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-   -   Late bloomers of the NHL (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1477837)

lakai17 07-30-2013 03:27 PM

Late bloomers of the NHL
 
1. What is the average age considered to be a late bloomer that makes the NHL?

2. What league would you recommend a late bloomer with talent to go get noticed by any real scouts/connections?

I am guessing college or ECHL.

3. Who are the big names in the past or present that made the NHL out of no where with no draft status whatsoever?

dukeofjive 07-30-2013 03:29 PM

If i remember corectly Martin St louis went undrafted

Killion 07-30-2013 05:39 PM

Brett Hull was playing rep hockey at 17, wasnt even the best player on his
team at that time.... Tony Esposito didnt really take off until he was like 26.

brianscot 07-30-2013 05:50 PM

It took Hull's buddy Adam Oates three exceptional years at RPI, culminating in the NCAA Championship in 1985 to get noticed.

Fred Taylor 07-30-2013 05:51 PM

Adam Oates, St. Louis as mentioned, even Hasek in a sense was a late bloomer, really hit his stride from 29-36 I believe. Then again, a lot of goalies tend to peak later.

Pat Paeplow 07-30-2013 05:53 PM

MSL was pretty good wherever he played. I would argue that he went undrafted because of the bias of NHL front offices.

To me, Zdeno Chara is the first late bloomer that comes to mind.

brianscot 07-30-2013 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dopamine Fiend (Post 69773961)
MSL was pretty good wherever he played. I would argue that he went undrafted because of the bias of NHL front offices.

To me, Zdeno Chara is the first late bloomer that comes to mind.

I remember watching the University of Vermont in the early 1990's on tv and St. Louis was overwhelmingly noticeable -- he had gears, speeds, and hands that no one else at that level possessed.

In some respects, he was the Paul Kariya of the ECAC, but I had no idea that he'd blossom into what he became in the NHL.

LeBlondeDemon10 07-30-2013 06:16 PM

Markus Naslund

Killion 07-30-2013 06:21 PM

Red Berensons career didnt really get going appreciably until he wound up in St.Louis as was the case with a great number of players who didnt get their chances to even crack an NHL line-up until 67-68, by then well into their 20's, early 30's.

saskganesh 07-30-2013 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killion (Post 69773519)
Brett Hull was playing rep hockey at 17, wasnt even the best player on his
team at that time....

My brother played with him in Winnipeg... Tier 2, minor midget. Hull had a great shot then, but wasn't the best player or skater on that team of 14 year olds. That was around 1978. Anyhow, Hull worked on his game, over time, obviously.

I'm gonna add Tim Kerr (undrafted) and John LeClair (2nd rnd). Both were 20 goal scorers who eventually matured into repeat 50 goal gunners.

Sm4ckSm4sh 07-30-2013 11:19 PM

Alexandre Burrows is one.

70 points in 74 games in his last year in Major Junior as a 19-20

Plays in the ECHL for 2 years. Plays in the AHL for another 2 years and is called up to the Canucks and puts up 12 points in 43 games in 05-06. In his first full year with the Canucks goes 3-6-9 in 81 games at 25/26 years old.

Then he comes into his own:

07/08 - 12-19-31 in 82 Games
08/09 - 28-23-51 in 82 Games
09/10 - 35-32-67 in 82 Games
10/11 - 26-22-48 in 72 Games
11/12 - 28-24-52 in 80 Games
12/13 - 13-11-24 in 47 Games


I don't know much about his draft year(Put up 30 points in 60 games on a team with Radim Vrbata and Jason Pominville) or his scouting report. This looks like a true underdog story.

***EDIT***

Tim Thomas is another one. Drafted in the 9th round. Plays 4 years in College, 4 years between the FEL, IHL, ECHL and AHL. Then in the SEL, IHL, FEL until he plays 4 games with the Bruins in 2002-2003. Doesn't get a full shot until 38 games in the 05/06 when his career takes off

FrailSwan 07-30-2013 11:22 PM

Brenden Dillon.

Undrafted in both Bantam and NHL.

the edler 07-31-2013 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred Taylor (Post 69773905)
even Hasek in a sense was a late bloomer, really hit his stride from 29-36 I believe.

Yeah, he debuted in the Czech league as a 15 year old and was a full time starter at 17. Then he played for the Czech national team in the World Championships at 18 and in the Canada Cup at 19. That screams late bloomer. You know he was behind the Iron Curtain and couldn't play in the NHL before 25 right?. Then he comes over to the Blackhawks and is trapped behind looney Belfour and Keenan. Like Schneider was trapped behind Luongo and Aquilini for the last two or so seasons even though everybody knew he was the better goalie. With this same logic Igor Larionov is a late bloomer because you know he scored his first NHL point at 29 and had his best season points wise in the NHL at age 35|36!

Darth Yoda 07-31-2013 08:37 AM

Johan Franzén was no goalscorer before he came to the NHL, where it took him some time too and did not find it until he was 28. It is very apparent in his stats that he is a true late bloomer. He also was a center as far as i remember and in time got some tastes of the national team becouse of his defensive game.

http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=158

Sm4ckSm4sh 07-31-2013 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darth Yoda (Post 69793331)
Johan Franzén was no goalscorer before he came to the NHL, where it took him some time too and did not find it until he was 28. It is very apparent in his stats that he is a true late bloomer. He also was a center as far as i remember and in time got some tastes of the national team becouse of his defensive game.

http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=158

That's odd. He was drafted when he was 24? Wasn't like he was a "throw away" pick either. He was drafted in the 3rd round ahead of the likes of Ryan Callahan, Kris Versteeg, Mikhail Grabovski, etc. Has that ever happened in the NHL post Fall of the Iron Curtain?

Darth Yoda 07-31-2013 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sm4ckSm4sh (Post 69806799)
That's odd. He was drafted when he was 24? Wasn't like he was a "throw away" pick either. He was drafted in the 3rd round ahead of the likes of Ryan Callahan, Kris Versteeg, Mikhail Grabovski, etc. Has that ever happened in the NHL post Fall of the Iron Curtain?

He did not really play any junior either. Came into the swedish fourth division at age 14-15 and then played just two games junior at 17. Well, at least he was a scorer in the FIFTH division around 18. :)

nutbar 07-31-2013 07:18 PM

Luc Robitaille was drafted in the ninth round.. The Kings drafted Tom Glavine ahead of him!!

Dark Shadows 07-31-2013 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nutbar (Post 69812705)
Luc Robitaille was drafted in the ninth round.. The Kings drafted Tom Glavine ahead of him!!

Luc had a 45 goal, 84 point rookie season as a 20 year old.
Not sure if one so young qualifies as a late bloomer. Especially when he was so good in Juniors, but was doubted because of his skating.

pdd 07-31-2013 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Shadows (Post 69819569)
Luc had a 45 goal, 84 point rookie season as a 20 year old.
Not sure if one so young qualifies as a late bloomer. Especially when he was so good in Juniors, but was doubted because of his skating.

Yeah, and he immediately went on to be the league's preeminent left winger almot immediately; from 1987-88 through 1992-93, he made the first or second team every season.

I'd throw Mark Messier in as a late bloomer. Messier didn't peak until he was 29, and the league average GPG inflates his raw stats in his early years in Edmonton compared to his 89-90 season.

Eisen 08-01-2013 01:03 AM

Johnny Bower? Played lots of AHL though.

Killion 08-01-2013 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eisen (Post 69822821)
Johnny Bower? Played lots of AHL though.

Ya. Had a fairly stellar career in the AHL with Cleveland for years, Providence Reds for a couple, one season I think it was with the Vancouver Canucks of the old WHL. Not exactly a late bloomer, more a case of didnt really get the opportunity a lot earlier than he perhaps should have.

alko 08-01-2013 03:49 AM

Pavol Demitra. As a 24 years old in St. Louis Blues.

let see , what will Tomas Tatar show us.

Hobnobs 08-01-2013 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sm4ckSm4sh (Post 69806799)
That's odd. He was drafted when he was 24? Wasn't like he was a "throw away" pick either. He was drafted in the 3rd round ahead of the likes of Ryan Callahan, Kris Versteeg, Mikhail Grabovski, etc. Has that ever happened in the NHL post Fall of the Iron Curtain?

He was hidden gem in the lower leagues in Sweden. No one noticed how good he really were until he started playing in the higher divisions.

Pat Paeplow 08-01-2013 04:17 PM

Joel Otto? I can't decide whether he qualifies as a late-bloomer or not.

On one hand, he was an undrafted player who didn't play in the league until 23. The highest level of amateur hockey in which he competed was at Bemidji State, an NCAA Division 2 program.

On the other hand, he transitioned relatively painlessly into the NHL. And truthfully, he didn't just learn to play hockey on the bus to Calgary. He lit up the lower ranks of the NCAA to such a degree that he was a finalist for the Hobey Baker. I think that's the only time that's ever been accomplished from D2.

There must have been some mitigating circumstances resulting in him enrolling at Bemidji State, a sick grandmother keeping him close to home or something like that. Or maybe he flipped a switch his freshman year or something.

Stringer Bell 08-01-2013 10:20 PM

I think I remember that Owen Nolan didn't even purchase his first pair of skates until 10 years old. Not that old, but...ended up being drafted 1st overall.


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