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-   -   Who would you protect in an Expansion Draft (Rules Within) (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1478247)

Crease 07-31-2013 09:05 AM

Who would you protect in an Expansion Draft (Rules Within)
 
Hot rumor of the week is that Seattle will be getting a team as soon as 2014-2015. Lets assume a second team will be added at the same time, since it's a pretty good possibility and because we can apply the rules from the last expansion draft (which involved two teams).

Here are the rules:

You may protect one goaltender, five defensemen, and nine forwards OR two goaltenders, three defensemen, and seven forwards.

If you protect one goaltender, there is no experience requirement for those left unprotected. If you protect two goaltenders, each goaltender left unprotected must have appeared in at least 6 NHL games in 2013 or 16 NHL games in 2012 and 2013 combined.

At least one defensemen left unprotected had to have appeared in 24 NHL games in 2013 or 55 NHL games in 2012 and 2013 combined. At least two forwards left unprotected by each team had to have met the same requirements.

NYR Viper 07-31-2013 09:12 AM

Hank

Staal
McDonagh
Moore
MDZ
Girardi

Stepan
Hagelin
Brassard
Kreider
Nash
Callahan
Miller
Lindberg
Fast/Hrivik

It all depends on what occurs. If Staal is not re-signed then he should be dealt and they should protect McIlrath.

Dactyl 07-31-2013 09:21 AM

Same as NYR Viper

Goalie: Hank

Dmen: McD, Staal, DZ, Girardi, Moore

Forwards: Nash, Stepan, Hagelin, Brassard, Kreider, Callahan, Miller, Lindberg, Fast

If there was an expansion draft and Richards was taken from us, would the cap recapture penalty thing still affect us?

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 09:24 AM

regarding unprotected players, who can be taken? if McIlrath has never played a game in the NHL can Seattle claim him?

Kane One 07-31-2013 09:25 AM

Great idea, Crease. I'm make my list by tonight. :)

I have a question. Do players who have a NMC have to be on the list, even if we don't want them to be protected? I'm not sure if those existed before the 2005 lockout.

Crease 07-31-2013 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dactyl (Post 69795103)
If there was an expansion draft and Richards was taken from us, would the cap recapture penalty thing still affect us?

If he retires before the end of his contract, yes.

What team he spends the rest of his time with doesn't change the fact that the Rangers paid him $33m from 2012-2014 but were only charged $20m against the cap.

Crease 07-31-2013 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parker McDonald (Post 69795189)
I have a question. Do players who have a NMC have to be on the list, even if we don't want them to be protected? I'm not sure if those existed before the 2005 lockout.

That is a great question and I don't have an answer for you yet. The expansion draft rules are not pre-defined in the CBA. The NHL makes the rules unilaterally. If a team is forced to use a protection slot for a player with a NMC, it could really bone them.

EDIT: In the 1992 MLB expansion draft, all players with no trade clauses had to be protected.

Crease 07-31-2013 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadwayblue (Post 69795149)
regarding unprotected players, who can be taken? if McIlrath has never played a game in the NHL can Seattle claim him?

In 2000, the exemptions were (i) first and second-year pros and (ii) unsigned draft picks (except unsigned draft choices drafted from European clubs in the 1996 Entry Draft or before and who remain unsigned).

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crease (Post 69795469)
In 2000, the exemptions were (i) first and second-year pros and (ii) unsigned draft picks (except unsigned draft choices drafted from European clubs in the 1996 Entry Draft or before and who remain unsigned).

Thanks. So again, in the case of McIlrath, is he considered a 2nd year pro this year, despite the fact that he played in 5 post season games for Hartford in '11-'12?

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 09:42 AM

And I would imagine players with a NTC would have to be protected. So people should include him in their lists. That said, assuming the lists are due after the final compliance buyout period next summer, and he is bought out, then it's a moot point.

Kane One 07-31-2013 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadwayblue (Post 69795619)
And I would imagine players with a NTC would have to be protected. So people should include him in their lists. That said, assuming the lists are due after the final compliance buyout period, and he is bought out, then it's a moot point.

I'm assuming NMCs have to be protected and not NTCs, since they aren't being traded.

I'd be ****ing pissed if the list is due before the buyout period.

Crease 07-31-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadwayblue (Post 69795569)
Thanks. So again, in the case of McIlrath, is he considered a 2nd year pro this year, despite the fact that he played in 5 post season games for Hartford in '11-'12?

At the end of this season McIlrath will have completed two full AHL seasons. So wouldn't he be a third-year pro when the protected list is due?

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parker McDonald (Post 69795683)
I'm assuming NMCs have to be protected and not NTCs, since they aren't being traded.

I'd be ****ing pissed if the list is due before the buyout period.

I'd be interested in getting an official word on that. On the one hand, you're right, they aren't getting traded. But on the other, you could argue that a team should be required to use one of it's slots on any player with a NTC since they've already committed in writing that the player would remain on the team for the duration of the contract.

Yeah, that would be pretty bad.

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crease (Post 69796031)
At the end of this season McIlrath will have completed two full AHL seasons. So wouldn't he be a third-year pro when the protected list is due?

I guess it depends on the definition. I was thinking that as long as you have only played 2 seasons you're still a 2nd year pro.

Kane One 07-31-2013 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadwayblue (Post 69796271)
I'd be interested in getting an official word on that. On the one hand, you're right, they aren't getting traded. But on the other, you could argue that a team should be required to use one of it's slots on any player with a NTC since they've already committed in writing that the player would remain on the team for the duration of the contract.

Yeah, that would be pretty bad.

They have in writing that they won't be traded. If they could still be assigned to the minors, they should be allowed to be in the expansion draft.

NYRSchrute217 07-31-2013 01:31 PM

Nash
Stepan
Brassard
Kreider
Hagelin
Callahan
Dorsett
Zuccarello
Boyle/Pouliot (assuming we re-signed one/both)

Staal
McDonagh
Girardi
Moore
Del Zotto

Lundqvist

Stralman meets the defensemen requirement. Kreider will be a 3rd year pro this year due to him playing in the playoffs in 2012, therefore will need to be protected. Fast/Lindberg will be first (or second, depending if their loans to SEL clubs count) year pros in 13-14 therefore in 2014-15 will be ineligible. Miller is ineligible, too.

We would unfortunately lose Stralman for sure, but since he, Boyle and Pouliot are UFAs in 2014, it's not a big deal if the expansion draft does happen before UFA begins. If it does not, we may lose McIlrath depending on his pro contract eligibility.

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 (Post 69803177)
Nash
Stepan
Brassard
Kreider
Hagelin
Callahan
Dorsett
Zuccarello
Boyle/Pouliot (assuming we re-signed one/both)

Staal
McDonagh
Girardi
Moore
Del Zotto

Lundqvist

Stralman meets the defensemen requirement. Kreider will be a 3rd year pro this year due to him playing in the playoffs in 2012, therefore will need to be protected. Fast/Lindberg will be first (or second, depending if their loans to SEL clubs count) year pros in 13-14 therefore in 2014-15 will be ineligible. Miller is ineligible, too.

We would unfortunately lose Stralman for sure, but since he, Boyle and Pouliot are UFAs in 2014, it's not a big deal if the expansion draft does happen before UFA begins. If it does not, we may lose McIlrath depending on his pro contract eligibility.

Gotta believe if McIlrath would be exposed that they would protect him over Zuccarello or Dorsett.

NYRSchrute217 07-31-2013 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broadwayblue (Post 69803313)
Gotta believe if McIlrath would be exposed that they would protect him over Zuccarello or Dorsett.

You have to protect 9 forwards and 5 defensemen. Losing McIlrath would be unfortunate but without trading Staal/Del Zotto/Girardi it's something you have to do. But if that were the case, I think trading Del Zotto for a forward becomes a priority.

Thirty One 07-31-2013 01:41 PM

The Rangers lost Richter in the 1998 Expansion draft to the Predators (he was an UFA) and he signed back with them that summer.

This was a pretty good expansion draft trade for the Preds:
Los Angeles traded Kimmo Timonen and Jan Vopat to Nashville after the Predators agreed not to select Garry Galley.

broadwayblue 07-31-2013 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 (Post 69803375)
You have to protect 9 forwards and 5 defensemen. Losing McIlrath would be unfortunate but without trading Staal/Del Zotto/Girardi it's something you have to do. But if that were the case, I think trading Del Zotto for a forward becomes a priority.

Forgot about the 5 dman limit. So it is really important to know the actual definition of 2nd year pro. Would be pretty bad if we were letting Dylan develop slowly only to lose him in an expansion draft. That said, I'd see us dealing one of the 5 dmen you listed in exchange for picks/prospects or a top 6 forward before we simply let him go.

Crease 07-31-2013 01:46 PM

There are a lot of backdoor deals done during these things too. For example, the expansion team GM will agree not to claim a certain unprotected player in exchange for a future trade involving draft picks or prospects.

McRanger 07-31-2013 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -31- (Post 69803543)
The Rangers lost Richter in the 1998 Expansion draft to the Predators (he was an UFA) and he signed back with them that summer.

This was a pretty good expansion draft trade for the Preds:
Los Angeles traded Kimmo Timonen and Jan Vopat to Nashville after the Predators agreed not to select Garry Galley.

A lot of UFAs got taken in those expansion drafts. That was back when you got compensation for losing some UFAs.

Too bad for the Preds '99 was such a bad draft.

Thirty One 07-31-2013 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crease (Post 69803709)
There are a lot of backdoor deals done during these things too. For example, the expansion team GM will agree not to claim a certain unprotected player in exchange for a future trade involving draft picks or prospects.

Los Angeles really wanted Gary Galley....

Nashville got Vokoun and Timonen out of their expansion draft. Likely the biggest two keys of their early years.

There's also some trade possibilities. For example, if they are sweating it with McIlrath, they could trade him to a team shallow on D for a draft pick or a non-eligible player for sixty cents on the dollar.

NYR Viper 07-31-2013 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -31- (Post 69803869)
Los Angeles really wanted Gary Galley....

Nashville got Vokoun and Timonen out of their expansion draft. Likely the biggest two keys of their early years.

There's also some trade possibilities. For example, if they are sweating it with McIlrath, they could trade him to a team shallow on D for a draft pick or a non-eligible player for sixty cents on the dollar.

If this happens next off-season, I would think they would move one of their d-man (thinking they could re-sign Stralman and Girardi) and protect McIlrath. The organization loves his upside.

Crease 07-31-2013 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYRSchrute217 (Post 69803177)
We would unfortunately lose Stralman for sure, but since he, Boyle and Pouliot are UFAs in 2014, it's not a big deal if the expansion draft does happen before UFA begins. If it does not, we may lose McIlrath depending on his pro contract eligibility.

Have to imagine the expansion draft will take place before free agency begins. In 2000, the draft took place a week before free agency.


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