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-   -   Proposal: Two trades that would change our future (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1486683)

PredsHabs 08-19-2013 03:43 AM

Two trades that would change our future
 
Been thinking about these two. One I have already posted on trade boards under Josi to Montreal. The other one is a new idea. What do you think?

To Montreal: Josi,Spaling,Beck,Sissons,2014 2nd round draft pick,2015 3rd round pick

To Nashville: Gorges,Pacioretty,Collberg

Adds a young good Left winger who can score and a replacement for Josi.

To New York Rangers: Wilson,2014 1st round draft pick

To Nashville: Stepan

May seem like an overpayment but he is what we need #1 Center and Pacioretty would replace Wilson.

I Will Son 08-19-2013 03:44 AM

Both trades are easy NO's

EagleBelfour 08-19-2013 03:56 AM

Montreal say no to the first trade. Josi is a fantastic young defenceman, but the Montreal Canadiens cannot trade away their top winger for him. We also have a plethora of good defenceman (Beaulieu, Tinordi, Ellis, Dietz) that have the potential in the future to integrate our lineup and fill, somewhat, the role Josi would do for our team. I don't see anyone filling the grand hole Pacioretty would leave if traded.

I really don't see Nashville trading Roman Josi after signing him to a new, 7 years contract.

PredsV82 08-19-2013 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by predshabs (Post 70325771)
Been thinking about these two. One I have already posted on trade boards under Josi to Montreal. The other one is a new idea. What do you think?

To Montreal: Josi,Spaling,Beck,Sissons,2014 2nd round draft pick

To Nashville: Gorges,Pacioretty

Adds a young good Left winger who can score and a replacement for Josi.

To New York Rangers: Wilson,1st round draft pick

To Nashville: Stepan

May seem like an overpayment but he is what we need #1 Center and Pacioretty would replace Wilson.

even though he is playing wing now the goal is eventually to have Wilson play center.

and even though we are giving mtl a lot of volume, they are giving up a lot of quality.... everything after Josi is basically filler, even Beck, since hes not really proven himself yet

PredsHabs 08-19-2013 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PredsV82 (Post 70326295)
even though he is playing wing now the goal is eventually to have Wilson play center.

I keep hearing that but when is it going to start. I like the fact that Watson is being molded into a true center in the minors. So why is Wilson not headed that same way seeing how we need that true #1 Center.

Look at the numbers. Both are 23 years old.
Stepan
2010-2011 82gp 21g 24a
2011-2012 82gp 17g 34a
2012-2013 48gp 18g 26a

Wilson
2010-2011 82gp 16g 18a
2011-2012 68gp 15g 20a
2012-2013 25gp 7g 12a

If there is some way of getting Stepan without trading Wilson I would do it but I believe that is what it would take.

PredsHabs 08-19-2013 06:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Will Son (Post 70325775)
Both trades are easy NO's

From the other teams stand point or yours

glenngineer 08-19-2013 08:11 AM

No to both trades. Lateral moves at best. If Beck pans our it's a horrible trade, if he doesn't we're still giving up a top pairing defenseman and a good young power forward. All things being equal Josi will be the best player out of everyone mentioned. If Beck turns into a poor mans Doan and Wilson keeps progressing we lose this deal in a big way. We also have no one to replace Josi. Sorry. Big fat no from me.

Top 6 Spaling 08-19-2013 10:47 AM

I agree Stepan is better than Wilson, but that 2014 1st is an asset I don't want to move. A few injuries or slumps and we could be picking top 5.

StarvinArvin38 08-19-2013 10:56 AM

I keep wilson and out 1st over stepan. Would be a lateral move at best.

Patches is good but not worth the package we'd be sending.

This kills all the depth Poile hoarded this offseason. With injuries, like last year, we would have only a small amount of breathing room compared to our cushy position we are in right now.

Soundgarden 08-19-2013 11:16 AM

No to both trade. We don't need to drastically change our line-up when we aren't really improving it. This is just trading for trading sake.

Persona5 08-19-2013 11:38 AM

If Poile traded Josi or Wilson I would be very upset unless it was for a True
#1 Center. There is no way I would be happy with either of these trades.

Byrddog 08-19-2013 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top 6 Spaling (Post 70329181)
I agree Stepan is better than Wilson, but that 2014 1st is an asset I don't want to move. A few injuries or slumps and we could be picking top 5.

That pick is going to be another chance to build this team. It is far too important right now to just whizz away. While there is no guarantee of any draft pick even the ones that we just spent months arguing over it is the lone way for this team to get the offensive pieces it needs.

Pac is clearly an upgrade over Wilson and Stephan is as well it makes no sense to give up Josi with his contract. If there is one defenseman that should be trade bait it should be Jones. He will be cheap for a while but in the end a decision will have to be made to keep him or trade Weber. If the kids as good as projected in 3 or 4 years his salary demand will explode.

It is not very likely that any top forward is going to be signed here as a F/A and if DP is going to get one thru a trade it is going to hurt. The trade proposals that most here are putting out are just laughable.

PredsHabs 08-19-2013 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soundgarden (Post 70329681)
No to both trade. We don't need to drastically change our line-up when we aren't really improving it. This is just trading for trading sake.

So a top line of Pacioretty-Stepan-Forsberg/Hornqvist is not a drastic improvement.

Preds33 08-19-2013 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by predshabs (Post 70331811)
So a top line of Pacioretty-Stepan-Forsberg/Hornqvist is not a drastic improvement.

Not when we are leaving a giant hole on D, all this does is move the hole we have from offense to defense.

Top 6 Spaling 08-19-2013 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by predshabs (Post 70331811)
So a top line of Pacioretty-Stepan-Forsberg/Hornqvist is not a drastic improvement.

Yes, our top line would be much better, at the cost of our young #2D signed for 7 years, a very possibly top 5 pick, great prospects, and a lot of depth.

This digs our hole deeper IMO.

Iron Duke 08-19-2013 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byrddog (Post 70331545)
That pick is going to be another chance to build this team. It is far too important right now to just whizz away. While there is no guarantee of any draft pick even the ones that we just spent months arguing over it is the lone way for this team to get the offensive pieces it needs.

Pac is clearly an upgrade over Wilson and Stephan is as well it makes no sense to give up Josi with his contract. If there is one defenseman that should be trade bait it should be Jones. He will be cheap for a while but in the end a decision will have to be made to keep him or trade Weber. If the kids as good as projected in 3 or 4 years his salary demand will explode.

It is not very likely that any top forward is going to be signed here as a F/A and if DP is going to get one thru a trade it is going to hurt. The trade proposals that most here are putting out are just laughable.

I am very much in agreement with all the points made here. Too many trades that are filling needs but gutting our depth and futures and just creating new holes to fill. That aside, I also strongly doubt the Rangers take the proposed package.

glenngineer 08-19-2013 02:00 PM

No one has noted that we'd be giving up our first two picks in 2014. No thank you.

I Will Son 08-19-2013 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by predshabs (Post 70326315)
From the other teams stand point or yours

Ours

Filip Forceberg 08-19-2013 06:53 PM

These are very easy to turn down. No thanks.

jwhouk 08-19-2013 09:54 PM

These two trades would change our future, all right.

In 10 years, it would mean "Hamilton Predators" or whatnot.

No to both, thanks.

I Will Son 08-20-2013 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwhouk (Post 70346493)
These two trades would change our future, all right.

In 10 years, it would mean "Hamilton Predators" or whatnot.

No to both, thanks.

Agreed. Hah

Both trades are complete steps back. Awful value really

Gnashville 08-20-2013 08:57 PM

Are these trades meant to get Polie fired?

TootooTrain 08-21-2013 12:33 AM

I see Wilson's potential being higher than Stepans. Albiet, Willy's got a tougher road ahead in terms of recovery and experience.

Not too sure what to say about the first one. Kinda seems like names were pulled out of a hat.

PredsHabs 08-21-2013 12:42 AM

I added a little to the original trades above.

Lets take a look at what we take away from this team and what we add to this team.

Take aways.

Colin Wilson-age 23. Has never had more than 16 goals in a preds uniform.
Roman Josi-age 23. Good Defensemen with a pretty good cap hit.
Colton Sissons -age 19. Very good prospect. Can play hockey.
Nick Spaling-age 24. Good third line Center. His best year was 10 goals.
Taylor Beck-age 22. Good size. Had 7 points in 16 games with Nashville last year.
2014 1st round pick.
2014 2nd round pick.
2015 3rd round pick.

Additions.

Derek Stepan-age 23. Would be the top line Center we need. In only three NHL seasons he has put up 56 goals and 84 assists. Currently a RFA.

Josh Gorges-age 29. Has blocked 366 shots over the past two seasons. Would be a good fit with Weber. Was paired with Weber for two or three seasons on the Kelowna Rockets. Would be a solid Defensive Defenseman type partner for Weber. 5 years left on current deal at $3.9 Million per year.

Max Pacioretty- age 24. 2011-2012 33 goals 32 assists 79 games played. 2012-2013 15 goals 24 assists 44 games played. 6 years left on current deal at $4.5 Million per year.

Sebastian Collberg-age 19. Third best Swedish player from the 2012 draft. The group was called the "three bergs". We have two of them already in Forsberg and Aberg, I would love to add the third. This would help with depth.

Why this works.

Some people are backing off Wilson goin much higher that he currently is producing.
Spaling is probably gone anyways.
No whole left on defense like some say.Gorges signed for five more years
Stepan would be our #1Center for years to come. Currently a RFA.
Pacioretty would be on his wing for years to come. Signed already for six more years.
Beck a good prospect but Montreal will need size back in the trade due to Pacioretty size.
Sissons and the first round draft pick might sting a little bit but these trades will not put this team ten years further down the tubes.

Pacioretty-Stepan-Forsberg
Stalberg-Fisher/Watson-Hornqvist

Weber-Gorges
Jones-Ekholm
Klein-Bartley

Rinne

You can fill in the rest of the roster yourself. This would be the best top six we have had since the Kariya years. And These players will be around for along time they are still young.

Plus this still leaves players like
Smith
Bourque
Aberg
Salomaki
Budish
Shalla
Cehlin
Leipsic
in the system.
Remember we did not have a first round pick two years in a row 2011-2012(Fisher and Gaustad trades) but we traded for the 11th overall pick from the 2012 draft in Filip Forsberg.

triggrman 08-21-2013 04:40 AM

We have a few forward fprospects that IMHO are NHL talents.

Aberg, Forsberg, Beck, Watson and Sissons. I'd be shocked if any of our other (excluding 2013 draft) prospects ever have a permanent NHL home.

On defense. I only see Ekholm and Ellis as true NHL talents, again excluding the 2013 draft.


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