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-   -   If Markov retired tomorrow, would you want the Habs to retire his number? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1500959)

JayKing 09-20-2013 05:00 PM

If Markov retired tomorrow, would you want the Habs to retire his number?
 
The debate came up in the Markov interview thread and I thought it was an interesting question. Not that I want him to retire now, but he has the stats for it, but with the Habs you have to have the stats and the cup. I think the Habs should but I can see why some people wouldn't agree. I also hope that he retires as a lifetime Habs and doesn't sign as a UFA to another team other than his KHL team if he still wants to play hockey.

Luiginho 09-20-2013 05:02 PM

If Koivu's number will not be retired then there is no reason to retire Markov's number, and I like Markov a lot.

NewHabsEra* 09-20-2013 05:06 PM

As much as I respect Markov, there is no way he gets his jersey retired, he never elevated his game in playoffs, I would even say that his play has always been extremmely desapointing in playoffs.. I would not retire Saku's number either but if I had to chose between them, I would pick Koivu without much hesitation..

CanadianSharks 09-20-2013 05:06 PM

I hope that both Saku and Markov have their numbers retired, but I doubt it.

AntonCH 09-20-2013 05:09 PM

As much as I like the player, and for all the years he's served - No, nothing warrants it.
Since it was brought up by poster #2, Koivu is in the same category.

Retired numbers are reserved for the greats, the dominating, the championship winners.
Individual trophy winners, Cup winners, Players for the ages.

My son is 8 yrs old and he knows who Maurice Richard and Guy Lafleur are. He does not know Saku Koivu for anything other than being an ex-hab

FormerLurker 09-20-2013 05:10 PM

I love Markov, but no way. Every Hab with a retired jersey has won multiple Stanley Cups, and Markov does not pass that test.

dunner 09-20-2013 05:18 PM

Great player in his prime but this is the Montreal Canadiens our rafters are for HOF'ers

Doc McKenna 09-20-2013 05:18 PM

In this era winning multiple cups is very very hard. I voted yes, but its in context. Maybe have his jersey honoured. Say a 'Markov' on the shoulder and allow someone else to wear it. Same for Koivu and Muller on the number 11.

ChoseLa 09-20-2013 05:19 PM

Neither Sak nor Markov. Unless he becomes instrumental in a cup win. The next number to be retired could be 76; between Roy and Subb there is noone worthy of the rafters. And i love both of Markov and Sak.

Not saying Subban has proven enough yet but he's the first candidate since Roy.

SouthernHab 09-20-2013 05:20 PM

No. Being a very good player is not good enough. You have to be a very good Cup winning player.

Hope the Habs can do that with Markov though......

AntonCH 09-20-2013 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc McKenna (Post 71345621)
In this era winning multiple cups is very very hard. I voted yes, but its in context. Maybe have his jersey honoured. Say a 'Markov' on the shoulder and allow someone else to wear it. Same for Koivu and Muller on the number 11.

You know there was a guy named Yvon Lambert who wore 11 before the last bunch of 11s.
He also managed to win multiple cups and was an integral cog in a very good team. Oh, btw, he managed to score a few timely PP goals as well!
So maybe for the number 11 they have 3 names?

As for Markov and Koivu, don't we have the ring of honor? I wouldn't have an issue with either being placed there.

Hope Of Glory 09-20-2013 05:23 PM

As much as I like him, he doesn't belong with the likes of Beliveau, Richard and Dryden, just to name a few.

wedge 09-20-2013 05:29 PM

not even close.
One I would retire is Mats Naslund, just because he's our first european.

but he's only played 600 games, not nearly enough for having his number retired.

Carbonneau is another one who would deserve it a lot more than Markov and even Koivu.

Seb 09-20-2013 05:31 PM

Koivu first

dkdaniel 09-20-2013 05:32 PM

No, not really.

ChemiseBleuHonnete 09-20-2013 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AntonCH (Post 71345397)
My son is 8 yrs old and he knows who Maurice Richard and Guy Lafleur are. He does not know Saku Koivu for anything other than being an ex-hab

That's because it's a reflect of what you taught him.

lostriver 09-20-2013 05:38 PM

Unfortunately he did not collect enough cookie points for his number to be retired.

MasterDecoy 09-20-2013 05:40 PM

yes

anybody who ends up in your top 3 or top 4 all time points leader for defensemen ON THIS TEAM, deserves to be up there, i mean, he's gonna get past harvey ffs

that said, im not mad if anybody thinks different. markov does lack the hardware but to be fair, he was robbed of a norris imo

edit: and he's gonna get into that top 3 without even being in the top 10 for games played. whaddup

Brainiac 09-20-2013 05:44 PM

Without a cup, it's hard to make a case for Koivu and Markov. It's not like we expect them to have 4-5 cups, it's almost impossible nowadays.

But just one or two and there would definitely be a case for them.

Subban is the only candidate at this point and even then, there's a lot of hockey left to be played! But to me, it's obvious that Subban can do his part. The rest will be a matter of timing, opportunities etc.

Agnostic 09-20-2013 05:48 PM

People need to get out of the six team 60's league and into the context of a 30 team NHL where players become unrestricted at 27.

Markov is not retiring tomorrow, he's probably going to have a 15+ year career with the habs. That's remarkable today, perhaps we will never see it again for this team.

what's more extraordinary is Markov did this while the players around him sucked, and for a while the organization was Mickey Mouse and led by idiots. Context people.

If people are reserving this team honour for Cup winning players who have HOF careers, fans will probably never see another jersey retired.

AntonCH 09-20-2013 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChemiseBleuHonnete (Post 71345987)
That's because it's a reflect of what you taught him.

Hate to tell you
one, he's an avid reader
two, the only thing I taught him is love for the team, not the name on the jersey
he learned about Lafleur and Richard all by himself
But i see where you can make a false assumption

NewbieOfGames 09-20-2013 05:57 PM

Yeah, and with this, why not retire Kovalev number.

AntonCH 09-20-2013 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agnostic (Post 71346345)
People need to get out of the six team 60's league and into the context of a 30 team NHL where players become unrestricted at 27.

Markov is not retiring tomorrow, he's probably going to have a 15+ year career with the habs. That's remarkable today, perhaps we will never see it again for this team.

what's more extraordinary is Markov did this while the players around him sucked, and for a while the organization was Mickey Mouse and led by idiots. Context people.

If people are reserving this team honour for Cup winning players who have HOF careers, fans will probably never see another jersey retired.

The purists will say that you're way off base - what do I know
In my humble opinion what you're asking is to reset the benchmark.
Would that then apply to the players of yesteryear?
Wouldn't that be akin to opening the floodgates?
just sayin............................................. .........

Rockomax 09-20-2013 05:59 PM

I love Markov, but no. The players that have their numbers retired are very special. Their names have transcended their own hockey era. They carried a unique status among the people. Even if you're too young to have seen them play, you know their names, their style of play, their nicknames, you would recognize them if you saw them on the street, some of their stats. I'm not sure that we will say the same about Markov and that your children (or grandchildren depending on your age) will know him as well as the other guys, if at all.

vokiel 09-20-2013 06:03 PM

You don't retire numbers based on whim. The number needs a wearer that accomplished something exceptional. With that criteria in hand, Saku deserves it more (he beat cancer). Markov essentially didn't do anything other than have a long career in the jersey. That's simply not enough since someone may accomplish better with the same number.


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