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-   -   If the Flyers Continue to Lose... (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1512267)

R3M1N1SC3 10-08-2013 01:07 PM

If the Flyers Continue to Lose...
 
Just wanted to know your guys opinions of what COULD happen should the Flyers continue to spiral downward even with Berube at the helm.

Anybody think Snider would do something a little out of this world? Such as trade guys like Giroux, Hartnell, Voracek, Schenn's, etc

My thoughts on the team so far:

1) They look really out of shape. The wingers can't gain a step on anybody rushing down the wing and they are losing puck battles on the boards. If they are not out of shape, they are either injured or completely demotivated

2) Giroux has to make a difference. When you pay a guy 8 million dollars a year, he HAS to stand out. Regardless of who is around him. So far through three games, Giroux is unable to gain any separation from defenders and looks slower than usual. I'm a little worried!

3) Berube. When he played, he was known as a fighter/thug. Can he motivate these guys more so than Lavy did? It leaves me to wonder whether the players were frustrated playing FOR Lavy. Perhaps they were tired of his 'system'? I always thought Lavy was a more hard-knosed type of coach much like Berube is. How much of a difference can it possibly make.

Krishna 10-08-2013 01:08 PM

I said it the other day :
Trade everyone
Trade Brad Smith
Fire everyone
Keep MSE
Burn down the wells fargo center and build a new arena

R3M1N1SC3 10-08-2013 01:12 PM

LOL. I don't think it's time to 'burn down the Wells Fargo' but there certainly is a cause for concern.

Throughout the entire pre-season and first three games we have won just one game. The Hurricanes made us look like a bad team and I know they are not a very good team.

ILoveStephanieBrown 10-08-2013 01:12 PM

I really can't see them blowing up the core of this team twice in 4 years. That would be just be completely idiotic.

Appleyard 10-08-2013 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOREacek (Post 72220159)
I really can't see them blowing up the core of this team twice in 4 years. That would be just be completely idiotic.

Especially since on paper the core... and the team fullstop, is pretty damn decent and very good value for money. Our forwards are all tied up on such great value deals.

Last year this team had worse personnel, massive injury problems, no continuity, a coach who was not adjusting and a goalie who threw every other game away. They were above .500, and three wins off getting into the playoffs. (albeit in a shortened year... whichever way you wana look at that!)

On paper (I know on paper is not always reality) this team is a playoff team, with a forward group that is very good, very young, and only missing 1 35 point 3LW.

The D is more problematic... but if we could somehow wangle a 2nd tier young D man next year who can develop (and there are some intriguing RFAs if any get that far (Schultz, Gulbrandson, Kulikov, DeKeyser, Larsson, Del Zotto... PK ;)) it would start to look a lot more rosy for the future. (I know that is easier said than done.)

And then the Goalie... well, lest just hope Mason gets back on track to becoming the goalie he seemed destined to be in the OHL, AHL and his first year in the NHL.

A 3LW can be got quite easily, Goalies are a lot of luck for the most part, and a decent goalie can look like a great behind a solid team... it is the D man that we need, if we could somehow drop lucky or ingeniously pick one up, the team could be magical.

A lot of ifs and buts... but that is the capped NHL. One or two players could turn this team into legitimate contenders. I truly believe that.

FlyersFanz 10-08-2013 02:27 PM

As the title of the thread states....I will continue to cry.

Krishna 10-08-2013 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyersFanz (Post 72223245)
As the title of the thread states....I will continue to cry.

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__...leaned_525.jpg

Garbage Goal 10-08-2013 03:08 PM

The level of underperformance and underachievement in that scenario would be unprecedented for me. So I would probably have a morbid curiosity about how it would all go down.

Also there is the crying.

Prongo 10-08-2013 03:12 PM

If they struggle again all year I see the likes of Coburn, timonen, Hartnell, talbot, and one of couts or schenn being traded. Retool the defense and bring in some fresh young players like morin and whoever you can acquire at the draft for a pretty package of some of those players. I think it's just too premature to think this team will be a lottery team again, let's see what the chief brings to the table first

R3M1N1SC3 10-08-2013 03:40 PM

If we can't score more than one goal against Florida tonight, I just might cry :cry:

Jtown 10-08-2013 04:35 PM

if we blow it up this year i could see hartnell coburn kimmo grossman couturier all be fair game.

usahockey22flyers 10-08-2013 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jtown (Post 72228069)
if we blow it up this year i could see hartnell coburn kimmo grossman couturier all be fair game.

I agree. And the development of Couturier in particular needs to be talked about.

I think he'll be fine, but if he posts stats this year similar to the ones he had last season...

We all better start getting concerned.

Then we may have this question arise. Did Laviolette hurt the growth of our youngsters?

Beef Invictus 10-08-2013 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usahockey22flyers (Post 72229185)
I agree. And the development of Couturier in particular needs to be talked about.

I think he'll be fine, but if he posts stats this year similar to the ones he had last season...

We all better start getting concerned.

Then we may have this question arise. Did Laviolette hurt the growth of our youngsters?

Almost certainly.

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/...decision_.html

As for Couturier, Appleyard has a few posts that show he actually did pretty damned well compared to all other players in a similar role. Couturier has not been put in a position to succeed; he has been put in a very difficult role.

Curufinwe 10-08-2013 05:35 PM

I'll never understand why we should be in a hurry to trade Couturier after he signed a very cheap extension, and after Laviolette put his trade value in the trash by giving him almost no real offensive opportunities. We won't get fair value for him and almost inevitably he'll break out on his new team.

MiamiScreamingEagles 10-08-2013 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krishna (Post 72220005)
I said it the other day :
Trade everyone
Trade Brad Smith
Fire everyone
Keep MSE
Burn down the wells fargo center and build a new arena

Second usage of the season. Be prepared for more.

Beef Invictus 10-08-2013 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curufinwe (Post 72230307)
I'll never understand why we should be in a hurry to trade Couturier after he signed a very cheap extension, and after Laviolette put his trade value in the trash by giving him almost no real offensive opportunities. We won't get fair value for him and almost inevitably he'll break out on his new team.

Trading Couturier could end up being Sharp 2.0

Curufinwe 10-08-2013 05:47 PM

If he goes to Toronto and breaks out centering JVR I'll die.

I'm OK with the LSchenn trade (although they should have demanded a draft pick as well) but they need to keep their young guys longer than two or three seasons.

Krishna 10-08-2013 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles (Post 72230467)
Second usage of the season. Be prepared for more.

:laugh:

Jack de la Hoya 10-08-2013 05:58 PM

I don't see the Flyers facing any immediate decisions with their forwards, regardless of the way this season goes.

The defense is another matter. If they continue to struggle going forward, they are going to be faced with some decisions. One is Timonen--does he want to get moved to get a chance at a cup. If he does, he deserves to be traded to the best possible team, preferably in the Western Conference. I don't think he'd yield a huge return--maybe a "B" prospect and a pick.

The other is Coburn. Presumably Mez walks at the end of the season, while Schenn, Streit, and Grossmann are here next year. Gustafsson is a wildcard, but I don't think he'd generate much of a return. Coburn is our most valuable "expendable" asset--and I use that term cautiously. If he was made available near the trade deadline, he'd almost certainly be the best defenseman that could be had by a contender.

orange is better 10-08-2013 06:01 PM

Two words: aaron ekblad

Prongo 10-08-2013 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orange is better (Post 72231285)
Two words: aaron ekblad

He is exactly what we are so desperate for. Right handed shot who would potentially give us a #1 for a long time. Imagine him and Morin on a top pair in three years if both are fulfilling their potential. My god, it would be glorious.

On another note, if we do continue to struggle, I think we could get a kings ransom from Edmonton for Hartnell. They are extremely desperate for a gritty top 6 player, and Hartnell would be the answer.

Curufinwe 10-08-2013 06:07 PM

Doubt Hartnell will waive to go there.

Krazed Flyer 10-08-2013 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R3M1N1SC3 (Post 72219945)
Just wanted to know your guys opinions of what COULD happen should the Flyers continue to spiral downward even with Berube at the helm.

Anybody think Snider would do something a little out of this world? Such as trade guys like Giroux, Hartnell, Voracek, Schenn's, etc

My thoughts on the team so far:

1) They look really out of shape. The wingers can't gain a step on anybody rushing down the wing and they are losing puck battles on the boards. If they are not out of shape, they are either injured or completely demotivated

2) Giroux has to make a difference. When you pay a guy 8 million dollars a year, he HAS to stand out. Regardless of who is around him. So far through three games, Giroux is unable to gain any separation from defenders and looks slower than usual. I'm a little worried!
.

I don't know much about any of the stats or history or anything... But what I do know, is that I've noticed this trend as well... Wingers are slow to the puck and lose battles often. And ever since that one game a year ago, Giroux has not been the same. He was the **** before he was named captain and then some afterwards. Then there was a point where he didn't stand out, was slow... I dont remember what happened, but I agree with these two points.

Krazed Flyer 10-08-2013 06:13 PM

When I started watching the Flyers as an Upperclassman in High school (08-10), we had some low notes, but I always loved watching them. They were fast, tough, and lived up to the name "Broad Street Bullies", to some extent. But either way, we were friggin tough and steamrolled through people. Then somewhere along the lines we lost fighters, lost speed, and lost heart. Idk if its the ***** rules in the NHL or Lavy's words becoming empty after a year or two. Lottery picks in the draft. I really don't know. All I know, is I miss that team those flyers...

FlyingPhilly 10-08-2013 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prongo (Post 72231519)
He is exactly what we are so desperate for. Right handed shot who would potentially give us a #1 for a long time. Imagine him and Morin on a top pair in three years if both are fulfilling their potential. My god, it would be glorious.

On another note, if we do continue to struggle, I think we could get a kings ransom from Edmonton for Hartnell. They are extremely desperate for a gritty top 6 player, and Hartnell would be the answer.

If the Flyers continue to struggle and get a new GM who can institute a plan for longer than a year, I say they aim for Ekblad in 2014 and McDavid for 2015. Could have a lot of great prospects by trading Hartnell, Coburn, and Kimmo along with a few top picks. Who knows if that would work out though.


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