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-   -   Sabres-Phoneix prospoal (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=152109)

JPurp26 07-18-2005 08:36 PM

Sabres-Phoneix prospoal
 
Phoneix needs a goalie because boucher and johnson are terrible. Sabres have a goalie crisis with 2 many so i dont know much about phoneix defense but is there anyway a trade would happen if so what would it be
i like kolanos to bad hes a forward him derek roy and maxim afingenov would be awesome

Naych_PHX 07-18-2005 08:43 PM

hmmm... Kolanos... Miller, Noronan... Biron... sounds interesting.

hbk 07-18-2005 08:48 PM

I'm a Phoenix fan (best to admit my bias up front). I posted a Jeff Taffe for Noronen proposal earlier in the Phoenix forum and this was rightfully criticized as not really providing the proven performer that the organization is likely to be looking for if the Great One is going to be behind the bench. That being said, that's fairly even. Could also be worked with Keith Ballard.

Hedberg 07-18-2005 08:49 PM

Interesting idea.

MrMackey 07-18-2005 08:54 PM

I don't think that Kolanos alone would be enough to bring back one of Buffalo's goalies, however it does look like a very good match. It shouldn't take too much to get one of Biron or Noronen, recognizing that they've got to do something with that situation... however Kolanos' injury problems don't make him that valuable on the trade market.

PHO has to get rid of some bodies, and I can see them making a 2-for-1 deal. If Kolanos is of interest, maybe something like Spiller + Kolanos for Noronen might work?

PHO defense:
Morris
Mara
Hulse
O'Donnell
Gauthier
Tanabe
Spiller
B. Ference

hbk 07-18-2005 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMackey
I don't think that Kolanos alone would be enough to bring back one of Buffalo's goalies, however it does look like a very good match. It shouldn't take too much to get one of Biron or Noronen, recognizing that they've got to do something with that situation... however Kolanos' injury problems don't make him that valuable on the trade market.

PHO has to get rid of some bodies, and I can see them making a 2-for-1 deal. If Kolanos is of interest, maybe something like Spiller + Kolanos for Noronen might work?

PHO defense:
Morris
Mara
Hulse
O'Donnell
Gauthier
Tanabe
Spiller
B. Ference

Can't see Phoenix dealing both Spiller and Kolanos for a backup goalie and I'm a fan of Noronen - although how many years has he been a top 10 prospect? Seriously, Kiprusoff went for a second. Lalime a 4th. I don't think the market value has increased dramatically for goalies. Phoenix has the resources (both cap room and budget) to pursue more proven options without giving anything up (Khabby being one of them).

Phoenix isn't really long a lot of bodies. They have a club option on Devereux and you can expect a buyout on Savage which is essentially going to wash out whatever they have to pay to sign Derek Morris. That leaves Mara as their only RFA to address beyond their goalie situation.

Ference will not be resigned. His acquisition was a huge organizational mistake. One that I hope they don't make again.

Beukeboom Fan 07-18-2005 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbk
I'm a Phoenix fan (best to admit my bias up front). I posted a Jeff Taffe for Noronen proposal earlier in the Phoenix forum and this was rightfully criticized as not really providing the proven performer that the organization is likely to be looking for if the Great One is going to be behind the bench. That being said, that's fairly even. Could also be worked with Keith Ballard.

Not saying that Kolanos would be enough to land a goalie, but I think that Miller would have to clear waivers to get sent down. Thus, the Sabres either have to make a deal, or keep 3 goalies up. I'd doubt that they would want to do that, so they will be very motivated to make a deal.

IMO, if they could get Taffe or Spiller for Noronen (assuming the Sabres like Biron more), I think it would be a good deal for both organizations. In fact, I think that Spiller would be a better fit in BUFF, but that's just me.

Buffalo Stylee 07-18-2005 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbk
I'm a Phoenix fan (best to admit my bias up front). I posted a Jeff Taffe for Noronen proposal earlier in the Phoenix forum and this was rightfully criticized as not really providing the proven performer that the organization is likely to be looking for if the Great One is going to be behind the bench. That being said, that's fairly even. Could also be worked with Keith Ballard.

Keith Ballard would definitely be of interest to me if I'm Sabres management. I didn't like to see him leave our prospect pool in the first place. I personally wouldn't mind giving up Mika for him.

zetterberg40 07-18-2005 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMackey
I don't think that Kolanos alone would be enough to bring back one of Buffalo's goalies, however it does look like a very good match. It shouldn't take too much to get one of Biron or Noronen, recognizing that they've got to do something with that situation... however Kolanos' injury problems don't make him that valuable on the trade market.

PHO has to get rid of some bodies, and I can see them making a 2-for-1 deal. If Kolanos is of interest, maybe something like Spiller + Kolanos for Noronen might work?

buffalo for them 2 are gonna have to add something to that

JOHNBOY 07-18-2005 09:29 PM

Just tossing this one out there...

Ballard + Ference for Noronen + draft pick (?)

Rowley Birkin 07-18-2005 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JOHNBOY
Just tossing this one out there...

Ballard + Ference for Noronen + draft pick (?)

I wouldn't make that deal. Mika is way better than his trade value suggests.

The proposal just now on the Sabres board is more interesting. Morris for Miller, straight up. As a Sabres GM, i make that deal, but i'd see what else could be got for Miller around the league first.

JOHNBOY 07-18-2005 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowley Birkin
I wouldn't make that deal. Mika is way better than his trade value suggests.

The proposal just now on the Sabres board is more interesting. Morris for Miller, straight up. As a Sabres GM, i make that deal, but i'd see what else could be got for Miller around the league first.

Miller can get more then just Morris imo.

barrytrotzsneck 07-18-2005 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowley Birkin
I wouldn't make that deal. Mika is way better than his trade value suggests.

The proposal just now on the Sabres board is more interesting. Morris for Miller, straight up. As a Sabres GM, i make that deal, but i'd see what else could be got for Miller around the league first.


I doubt Phoenix makes it. Morris is considerably more valuable than Miller, at this point. He's easily Phoenix's best defenseman..and at this point, all Miller has proven is that he's good in the AHL.

Puckhead 07-18-2005 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbk
Can't see Phoenix dealing both Spiller and Kolanos for a backup goalie and I'm a fan of Noronen - although how many years has he been a top 10 prospect? Seriously, Kiprusoff went for a second. Lalime a 4th. I don't think the market value has increased dramatically for goalies. Phoenix has the resources (both cap room and budget) to pursue more proven options without giving anything up (Khabby being one of them).

Phoenix isn't really long a lot of bodies. They have a club option on Devereux and you can expect a buyout on Savage which is essentially going to wash out whatever they have to pay to sign Derek Morris. That leaves Mara as their only RFA to address beyond their goalie situation.

Ference will not be resigned. His acquisition was a huge organizational mistake. One that I hope they don't make again.

What you're forgetting is that Kiprusoff did not play in San Jose the way he played in Calgary. Some guys need to be the starter to really show their stuff. I think Noronen could be that type of player, and Phoenix can't stick with what they've got. Although David LeNeveu is coming up and he could be the piece that has been missing in goal, since Khabibulan left, although he would need some time. If you could get Noronen cheap, I say do it, otherwise, wait for LeNeveu.

hbk 07-18-2005 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puckhead
What you're forgetting is that Kiprusoff did not play in San Jose the way he played in Calgary. Some guys need to be the starter to really show their stuff. I think Noronen could be that type of player, and Phoenix can't stick with what they've got. Although David LeNeveu is coming up and he could be the piece that has been missing in goal, since Khabibulan left, although he would need some time. If you could get Noronen cheap, I say do it, otherwise, wait for LeNeveu.


Not forgetting it at all. The only reason I would want to deal for an unproven commodity like Noronen is if I beleived that he had that type of potential. Noronen hasn't stolen the #1 spot in Buffalo and I don't think I would be rushing out to "overpay" for purely potential with a counterparty that has more initiative to make a deal. There are a number of Phoenix fans who would already say that the names I've thrown out would be considered an overpayment from our side. That being said, I'm throwing out names that I beleive would work for both sides.

Phoenix has options. Noronen is one of them. Bottom line is Buffalo has to make a deal. My preference as a Phoenix fan would be to pursue the Khabby option. If that isn't available I would provide some consideration to the Cujo option. Then I start looking to make deals with teams with backups with potential with initiative to make room for another netminder in the system. Toskala from San Jose is another guy that I would strongly look at.

FlyersProspect2 07-18-2005 10:15 PM

The yotes already have their goalie of the future in David LeNeveu, no need to trade top rated prospects for a goalie. I've seen David play and he definitly is ready for the NHL. If the coyotes sign him, he could be a potential Calder Trohpy candidate and have a seaso like Andrew Raycroft.

hbk 07-18-2005 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyersProspect2
The yotes already have their goalie of the future in David LeNeveu, no need to trade top rated prospects for a goalie. I've seen David play and he definitly is ready for the NHL. If the coyotes sign him, he could be a potential Calder Trohpy candidate and have a seaso like Andrew Raycroft.

If you are the new coach and you just received an extra $7-8 million in budget room due to a rollback in player salaries and you desperately need to rebuild interest in your city - I think a proven goaltender is a better alternative than a really good prospect who could use one more year of seasoning in the minors or at the very most a backup role at the NHL level. I don't think rushing LeNeveu at this point would be in the best interests of Gretzky's coaching career, the organizations long term future, or David LeNeveu's confidence. From a cost/benefit perspective I think the risks of going with LeNeveu largely outweigh the benefits.

Gwyddbwyll 07-19-2005 02:42 AM

I cant imagine Kolanos going to Buffalo. They were the team that gave him his concussion with that hit from behind after all. I know Varada has gone to the Sens but still cant see it happening.

Derek Morris is staying.. Phoenix traded a major part of their future (Vaananen + 2nd) to get him to be their No.1 guy. Trade all that for an unestablished goalie? C'mon.

Taffe, Ballard, Kolanos, Spiller seem to be at a similar level of value so it would make a fair trade. Phoenix still has to decide what to do with their 3 goalies as well as see what is available on the FA market so I cant see anything happening for a while. I dont think there will be many trades anymore.

HuskyFlames 07-19-2005 06:07 AM

Calgery would most likely be interested in the guy left over from the Coyotes (Boucher or Johnston) as their backup goalie as well. Maybe a 3 way trade?

DINO22CICCARELLI 07-19-2005 06:43 AM

If the yotes want a goalie,they should talk to the caps. They may be willing to trade one of their four goalie prospects for draft picks in 2005 & 2006. In my opinion the yotes would have to part with this years second pick and next years first round pick. If they wanted are top goaloe prospect it could cost more.

Washingtons core of goalie prospects are the best of any team and all will be # 1 soon. With a lot of teams top goalies getting old, washington is in a very good trading position.

DINO22CICCARELLI 07-19-2005 06:47 AM

If the yotes want a goalie,they should talk to the caps. They may be willing to trade one of their four goalie prospects for draft picks in 2005 & 2006. In my opinion the yotes would have to part with this years second pick and next years first round pick. If they wanted are top goaloe prospect it could cost more.

Washingtons core of goalie prospects are the best of any team and all will be # 1 soon. With a lot of teams top goalies getting old, washington is in a very good trading position.

Steve L* 07-19-2005 06:54 AM

Would they not consider bringing Back for a year? I remember Yotes fans endlessly going on about how great he is so is that an option until there is a better UFA goalie market out there?

hbk 07-19-2005 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve L
Would they not consider bringing Back for a year? I remember Yotes fans endlessly going on about how great he is so is that an option until there is a better UFA goalie market out there?

I think you are asking about Burke.

Burke was great in Phoenix. Emphasis on WAS.

A crackdown on the size of equipment and increased game flow (and cross-ice passes - Burke's weakness) isn't going to help his game and would only serve as a nice reminder of why we dealt him in the first place.

Gwyddbwyll 07-19-2005 08:41 AM

Burke is an option. The UFA market isnt all that great, he's probably a better fit than all but Khabby or Cujo even though he isnt the player he was. I wouldnt be surprised to see Phoenix stick with Boucher and Johnson and see if they take the next step.

Dino - Phoenix doesnt have a 2nd this year. A 1st and a 2nd is a lot to ask.. I think its more likely it would be a 2nd for an expendable goalie prospect (see Kiprusoff trade). The market is just too saturated with young unproven bright goalie prospects.

Takeo 07-19-2005 09:30 AM

Ballard for Biron?


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