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-   -   OT: Devils new Owner Josh Harris Set to buy English Soccer side Charlton Athletic (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1548803)

Devils Trap 11-29-2013 04:29 PM

OT: Devils new Owner Josh Harris Set to buy English Soccer side Charlton Athletic
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...RLES-SALE.html

Quote:

Investment banker Josh Harris is set to become the latest American sports franchise owner to buy into English football.
The 48-year-old billionaire, who owns basketballís Philadelphia 76ers and ice hockey team New Jersey Devils, is said to be in detailed talks to purchase Charlton. The Championship club have been linked with a number of potential takeover moves recently, including consortiums from Turkey and Russia.
But the bid by Harris is understood to have progressed to an advanced stage since his associates came over for Charltonís home game against Leeds earlier this month.

Charlton are co-owned by Tony Jiminez and Michael Slater but it is claimed Mayfair property developer Kevin Cash bankrolls the London club and is keen to recoup his funding. Also, Jiminez has had to repay £500,000 to his former Newcastle colleague Dennis Wise after a High Court ruling regarding a property investment.
Manager Chris Powell and a number of players are in the last year of contracts that havenít been renewed because of the likelihood of a Charlton sale.
Harris, who spent around £500million buying his NBA and NHL franchises, could easily afford the mooted £43m price for Charlton that would include the freehold of The Valley. And there are ambitious plans being proposed for Charlton, who could, with the aid of wealthy owners, build a new stadium on land near the O2 Arena.


ScottyBowman 11-29-2013 04:43 PM

Basically a minor league team.

Devils Trap 11-29-2013 04:54 PM

Except with an influx of money and new signings can become a Prem League side

krudmonk 11-29-2013 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Trap (Post 75229133)
Except with an influx of money and new signings can become a Prem League side

Oh, it's so easy!

Devils Trap 11-29-2013 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krudmonk (Post 75229437)
Oh, it's so easy!

Never said it was easy did I ? Please post where I said that

I said that IF he puts money into them, they COULD become one

AdmiralsFan24 11-29-2013 05:10 PM

Ehh, they're only a league below the Premier League and finished 9th in it last year (though they're flirting with relegation so far this year.) Spend some money and they should be in the Premier League. Nothing wrong with what he said.

Devils Trap 11-29-2013 05:14 PM

The problem they are having right now is that the team owners cant even afford to pay their players right now

They are flirting with relegation, but 17th place out of 24 soo for now they are safe.

Killion 11-29-2013 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottyBowman (Post 75228509)
Basically a minor league team.

Well, sorta kinda but not quite due to the Relegation/Promotion model, Charlton after being embarrassed & relegated to the 3rd Division climbing back up to the Championship League, one rung below Premier and based in London. Their home stadium called "The Valley" (app 28,000 seater) is apparently the subject of plans to have that land cleared & used for public housing while building a new 40,000 seat stadium, in fact a full-on entertainment district, about a half a mile away from the 02 Stadium which seats 20,000. Seems pretty ludicrous to me, as in major over-kill. Charlton FC was offered Millenium Stadium but turned it down.

The Councils Master Plan calls for the closure of The Valley (and highly unlikely it ever does get public housing on that site as the lands valuable, 5mins from public transit). So who knows? The price-tag for the club isnt bad, and if you throw money at it could easily climb up to Premier League through promotion. Clearly though the stadium situation needs to be resolved so here obviously a lot more in play than just the purchase of an English Football Team. The Valley stadium itself was rescued from the brink back in the late 80's & early 90's, Charlton FC supporters actually forming a political party who ran against the existing Council & forced them into reversing their decisions, re-drafting plans. The stadium virtually re-built at that time as it had pretty much deteriorated over the years & decades. Could be seriously upgraded with increased seating, suites etc. The place has quite the fascinating history from its very earliest incarnations over 100yrs ago.

Hawkster 11-29-2013 05:43 PM

The sale price is actually £18m not £43m.

If the deal is completed he'll take on debts of £12m. £4m owed to the Royal Bank of Scotland (repaid at £1m per year) and £8m owed to former directors of the club that doesn't have to paid until a return to the Premier League is secured.

Franck 11-29-2013 07:06 PM

The 76ers co-owner Erick Thohir just finished up a deal to buy Inter a couple of weeks ago, I guess Harris just wants to keep up with the Joneses. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottyBowman (Post 75228509)
Basically a minor league team.

It's a football club in London, playing in the tier below the Premier League. As others have already said here, with some minor investing and a promotion the club would be worth several times its current value.

Denzil 11-29-2013 09:56 PM

So the blandest, dullest club in London is the next in line to sell of what little personality it had for the mighty buck. What's with the huge stadium in North Greenwich too? Surely there aren't enough drooling vegetables in the area to fill 40k.

cutchemist42 11-29-2013 10:36 PM

I'll never understand why NA sport owners buy into these teams. The environement is not set up to be profitable, its not the point of these league.s

Killion 11-29-2013 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutchemist42 (Post 75252171)
I'll never understand why NA sport owners buy into these teams. The environement is not set up to be profitable, its not the point of these league.s

Well, in this case, it is actually understandable as theres some seriously good looking potential upside. He buys a franchise & gains control of The Valley Stadium on the cheap and right in London next to Canary Wharf & the 02 Stadium, one notch below the Premier Division. So youve got some development issues in terms of a new stadium with a few options & if he throws some money at the team & they get promoted to Premier, rolling in it. Seriously increasing value. Maybe flip it again in 5-7yrs or whatever. Undervalued & underpriced asset, the terms of the sale rather attractive.

Devils Trap 11-30-2013 12:10 AM

Yea if he puts some money into it and if the team makes it into the premier league, he could make a serious buck of out this

Killion 11-30-2013 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Trap (Post 75255123)
Yea if he puts some money into it and if the team makes it into the premier league, he could make a serious buck of out this

Absolutely. Between the possibilities from the stadium & real estate end of things to the really bargain basement price (and excellent terms if whats reported is accurate) on that club with a pretty feral fan base in the Addiks' & control of The Valley, looks pretty good to me. Key of course will be what he does with Management, Coaching & Signings, but its doable. That club goes Premier Division, combined with the stadium & development issues, in London, Canary Wharf & environs, you kiddin me? Kaching!. In some respects Id kind of like to see him completely reno & retrofit The Valley, what with all the history there, but that may not be possible, practicable. More at stake than just the preservation of that rather tired old pitch.

Franck 11-30-2013 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutchemist42 (Post 75252171)
I'll never understand why NA sport owners buy into these teams. The environement is not set up to be profitable, its not the point of these league.s

Promotion to the Premier League is estimated to be worth over £100m just by itself.

Charlton are not a big name club by any means, but just by virtue of being a London club there is going to be plenty of potential buyers should they gain promotion in the future.

Officer Rod Farva 11-30-2013 01:25 AM

Don't you dare say Sucks at a game there tho.

mouser 11-30-2013 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franck (Post 75256073)
Promotion to the Premier League is estimated to be worth over £100m just by itself.

Charlton are not a big name club by any means, but just by virtue of being a London club there is going to be plenty of potential buyers should they gain promotion in the future.

What does it cost to assemble a roster that can get a team promoted to the Premiership? And stay there hopefully.

Devils Trap 11-30-2013 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mouser (Post 75257915)
What does it cost to assemble a roster that can get a team promoted to the Premiership? And stay there hopefully.

Ill say Cardiff is the best possible example seeing how they were recently promoted and are doing OK to start the year

Cardiff (in terms of player values from transfermarkt.com) were worth around 70 million euros this season. However out of that 70 million, they bought 38 million euros worth of players this summer after promotion

So with that alone, I would say last year they were worth around 42 million pounds in terms of value. However, that doesnt have much to do with spending. I cant find the players wages per year/week anywhere to let you know . Because once you buy a player by market value, you then have to offer them a contract with wages per week.

Edit: According to Fifa 14's manager mode Cardiff's players this season (and they are damn accurate with all player wages) is 560k dollars per week on wages . Soo im guessing thats about 20 million a year in terms of player wages, however im also guessing around 3-4 million in those wages are on the big name players they bought this summer. Soo I would guess in terms of wages they spent about 15 million dollars last year to sustain players they already had.

According to transfermarkt.com Charlton's value (players only) is at a measly 1.4 million pound . Soo With my guestimates, they would need to bring in around 30 million euros worth of talent to the squad from transfers and then also pay wages.

The 3 promoted sides this year Crystal Palace (24.3 Million euro value) Cardiff City (53 million euros, but again spend huge this summer so i would say they are around the 40 million euro mark) and Hull City (22.4 million euro value) . So it would take around 20-30 million euros worth of transfer spending alone to bring a team up to the prem, purely based on the latest examples. It could happen with a much less team in terms of value of players, but that is the latest examples i have.

Link to Hull City value -http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/hull...rein_3008.html
Palace Value - http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/crys...erein_873.html
Cardiff Value -http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/card...erein_603.html (Here is the amount they bought in terms of value this summer , the other teams did not spend much at all. http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/card...erein_603.html (Thats the transfer values)
Charlton's value - http://www.transfermarkt.com/en/char...erein_358.html

Soo they have a ways to work, but it isnt that astronomical of a fee to make it (transfers only speaking here)

martin27 12-01-2013 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Trap (Post 75258183)
Ill say Cardiff is the best possible example seeing how they were recently promoted and are doing OK to start the year

As a flyer fan I hate the outter of your avatar but as a Utd fan I love the inner. :yo: Anyway...

Quote:

Originally Posted by mouser (Post 75257915)
What does it cost to assemble a roster that can get a team promoted to the Premiership? And stay there hopefully.

A very good example and model to adopt would be Southampton FC. Markus Leibherr took over the club in League 1 (two below the Premier League). They were at brink of bankruptcy too. By placing Nicola Cortese as Chairman - Southampton got to the Premiership in 3 years from the take over. This is now their second season in the Prem and they are doing fantastic. Hes been quite ruthless in how hes changed aspects of the club to help benefit it commercially as well as on the pitch. An example being replacing the manager Atkins who won them back to back promotions from League 1 to the Prem, so to bring a manager in that would be more accustomed to playing high quality football.

Southampton have gone for a policy of investing in improving their youth academy (£30mill) and purchasing higher profile players, such as Osvaldo and Lovren, than they could be expected to buy rather than purchasing lots of yoyo (champ to prem to champ to prem, etc) type players (£60mill ish overall on transfers). NOTE - wages would go up too, vastly once in the prem.

Southampton are a top 10 team though, I guess it depends on how successful he'd want Charlton to be and how long of an investment hes planning. But the example of Southampton I think is better than Cardiff, although Cardiff is a good example, because it shows the whole cycle of what would need to be done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killion (Post 75232305)
Charlton FC was offered Millenium Stadium but turned it down.

You mean the Olympic stadium right? The millennium stadium is in Cardiff. Im not sure they were offered it. Perhaps you are mistaking them for Leyton Orient? Anyway the Olympic stadium needs to be renovated for footballing purposes plus I doubt Charlton could fill a 60,000-80,000 stadium. I doubt West Ham, who have taken it on, can either tbh. They are probably better off building a stadium to their own needs, which they would also be able to sell naming rights of without a fuss of history etc..


Quote:

Originally Posted by cutchemist42 (Post 75252171)
I'll never understand why NA sport owners buy into these teams. The environement is not set up to be profitable, its not the point of these league.s

This is very true. Im sure this guy, dont really know much about him, could afford a bigger club than Charlton right? I mean if Thohir has purchased Inter Milan...

The best way to make big profit year by year from owning a football (soccer) team is through sponsorship. The big bucks from sponsorship come from having an established fan base, playing in the champions league, going on tours and winning things. As it means the club is on TV more often and there is a wider consumer base with potential to grow. Lower clubs, even those in the Prem, dont have that ability as they are saturated by all the other less known clubs. The support for them is mostly regional whilst the top 4 plus Liverpool (Utd, City, Arsenal, Cheslea) is global. However, even with this, constant investment is needed.

Basically the Glazers approach with Utd is how you would go about making money constantly. Although they are still paying off the debts they brought in by purchasing the club at the moment. Man Utd is the epitome club for this. But not all clubs have that potential. Or rather heavy investment and prolonged success would be needed first. Man Utd have 34 sponsors now. Which is ridiculous in comparison to other clubs, but it brings the money in. So he would have to invest heavily in Charlton to get them at that level. And it would take many years. If this is his intention then, he may be better off buying a more established club. But I'm no investment whiz.

He may intend to flip them after improving them a bit, and in turn increasing their value, as already discussed. Or he may just want them as a play thing.


-------
Fun little quiz this (Guess all of Utd's sponsors) = http://www.theguardian.com/football/...nited-sponsors

HabsByTheBay 12-01-2013 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denzil (Post 75250293)
So the blandest, dullest club in London is the next in line to sell of what little personality it had for the mighty buck. What's with the huge stadium in North Greenwich too? Surely there aren't enough drooling vegetables in the area to fill 40k.

Tough talk from a Millwall fan with your 9,000 crowds in the Championship.

There's really nothing wrong with the Valley, it's quite a cool little stadium with some room to expand (which is almost always why an English club leaves its stadium). The new bits are modern and comfortable, and the old bits could be replaced without too much hassle. Moving near the O2 would be rather pointless, it's a completely garbage entertainment district. But if they do move, Killion, building council flats there would be pretty easy - the council would just partner up with a developer to do it.

Edit: I'm pretty sure what Killion meant is that Charlton were offered the Millennium Dome, which is now the O2 arena.

Killion 12-01-2013 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martin27 (Post 75334353)
A very good example and model to adopt would be Southampton FC..... You mean the Olympic stadium right?... He may intend to flip them after improving them a bit, and in turn increasing their value, as already discussed. Or he may just want them as a play thing.

Yep, Southampton a good example/model, can be done... sorry for the confusion, yes, meant Olympic Stadium.... and I suspect the former in your last couple of sentences. As I mentioned earlier, fairly attractive sale price & terms, stadium & development potentialities, its in London, prime area etc. Distressed or middlin asset with huge potential.

knorthern knight 12-01-2013 07:56 PM

Anybody remember Tom Hicks? :shakehead

krudmonk 12-01-2013 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Trap (Post 75230067)
Never said it was easy did I ? Please post where I said that

I said that IF he puts money into them, they COULD become one

My sarcasm was lampooning the general idea that plenty have had before this dude, not anything you said. It takes Abramovich levels of cash to ascend to relevance.

No Fun Shogun 12-01-2013 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knorthern knight (Post 75362637)
Anybody remember Tom Hicks? :shakehead

Mild difference between spending £43 million on a soccer team versus close to £220 million, which is what Hicks & Co. spent on Liverpool.

... or I hope there is for the Devils' sake...


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