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-   -   how big is the loss of DeVries in the scheme of things? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=17128)

imagine29028 10-05-2003 09:19 AM

how big is the loss of DeVries in the scheme of things?
 
I personally think #7 was the glue that held together that defense....and I was really disapointed he left (although not suprised).

do you think his absence will have a big impact?

Jori 10-05-2003 09:32 AM

I think Adam Foote is the glue of the defense. I'm not sure how much they will miss Devo. I think it depends how Skrastins is able to adapt to the system and how much the Avs get out of the sixth and seventh defensemen. If the defenders can stay relatively healthy, than I would say no, but Blake and Foote are known to get knicked up occasionally.

I wish de Vries would have stayed, but after he turned down the multi-year contract offer from the Avs a year ago, the writing was on the wall. Clearly, de Vries was looking for a big pay day. One thing you have to realize about Lacroix is that he will pay his star players well, but he wont overpay for second and third tier players.

Goulet17 10-05-2003 09:51 AM

Devo is a big loss, as much as we'd like to think otherwise.

Not so much for his surprising offense at times, but he was a very solid defensive presence in the defensive zone. At 6'2" 215lbs. with great balance on his skates, he was a rock at times on defense and he gave the Avs another player to match and battle the league's power forwards down low. In fact, at times I think Devo was a more dependable physical presence than the likes of Blake, and even Adam Foote when it came to Todd Bertuzzi.

The Avs had the money to pay Devo what he received this year from the Rangers, but I think it was more of an unwillingess on the part of Lacroix to commit multiple contract years to Devo. It didn't fit with Lacroix's philosophy with respect to the expiration of the current CBA.

DarioinDenver 10-05-2003 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goulet17
Devo is a big loss, as much as we'd like to think otherwise.

Not so much for his surprising offense at times, but he was a very solid defensive presence in the defensive zone. At 6'2" 215lbs. with great balance on his skates, he was a rock at times on defense and he gave the Avs another player to match and battle the league's power forwards down low. In fact, at times I think Devo was a more dependable physical presence than the likes of Blake, and even Adam Foote when it came to Todd Bertuzzi.

The Avs had the money to pay Devo what he received this year from the Rangers, but I think it was more of an unwillingess on the part of Lacroix to commit multiple contract years to Devo. It didn't fit with Lacroix's philosophy with respect to the expiration of the current CBA.

I could not disagree more. DeVries has slow feet, did not pinch forwards off the puck in the corners and wasn't impressive in front of his own net. DeVries, if anything is of the mold of Klemm but worse. That's just my opinion but I've always felt he's been overrated. When his linemate isn't named Adam Foote I believe we will quickly find out how truely overrated he was. I see no loss in DeVries except for jumping up into the play.

MisterUnspoken 10-05-2003 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
I could not disagree more. DeVries has slow feet, did not pinch forwards off the puck in the corners and wasn't impressive in front of his own net. DeVries, if anything is of the mold of Klemm but worse. That's just my opinion but I've always felt he's been overrated. When his linemate isn't named Adam Foote I believe we will quickly find out how truely overrated he was. I see no loss in DeVries except for jumping up into the play.

So far with the Rangers though he has looked impressive. Not overly so, but he has been solid and has finished his checks, and seems to do just what he is meant to do, play tough defense.

avfan#21 10-05-2003 02:02 PM

What kinda ticks me off about DeVries is that the Avs were at one point the only thing separating him from journeyman status perhaps career minorleaguer. He is probably one of a handful of players that was likely sorry to see Hartley go, as Bob's persistance IMO is what molded Greg into a second tier defensman. He sold out for money, and I don't think the Avalanche organization has ever been about players who look at dollar signs first, winning and class second.

Foppa2118 10-05-2003 02:12 PM

I can't remember if Devo held out at all last year of not, I think he might have. If so, than that's what sent him packing, because Pierre just hates that. He trades away, or just lets go of almost everyone who holds out, even if it's for a day. Why do you think Tanguay made sure he signed that contract before camp. Look, at Drury, Klemm, Miller, Simon and a few other guys I just can't remember.

avs1dacup 10-05-2003 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foppa2118
I can't remember if Devo held out at all last year of not, I think he might have. If so, than that's what sent him packing, because Pierre just hates that. He trades away, or just lets go of almost everyone who holds out, even if it's for a day. Why do you think Tanguay made sure he signed that contract before camp. Look, at Drury, Klemm, Miller, Simon and a few other guys I just can't remember.

i'm sure if the avs couldn't get morris, that drury would seill be here. klemm went via UFA(didn't hold out, jsut wanted more than what pierre was offering), miller was traded and it had NOTHING to do with money nor contract hold out and simon i don't remember. so you didn't use any good examples.

Foppa2118 10-05-2003 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avs1dacup
i'm sure if the avs couldn't get morris, that drury would seill be here. klemm went via UFA(didn't hold out, jsut wanted more than what pierre was offering), miller was traded and it had NOTHING to do with money nor contract hold out and simon i don't remember. so you didn't use any good examples.


Actually I was refering to holdouts in the past, not at the time they left. Drury held out for a couple days, so did Miller, so did Simon, so did Klemm, and I think Devo might have too, along with a few other guys that left(maybe Deadmarsh, I'm not sure). So I did use good examples. I've heard this therory a few times form other people as well, so it's not just me that has picked up on it. I'm not saying that this is for sure what happened with all these guys. I'm just saying it's an interesting coincidence

DarioinDenver 10-05-2003 04:35 PM

Devo didn't hold out. He was just a UFA and he rejected PL's contract offer. I could be totally off but dollar for dollar I think he went NY's way for about 500K. With new twin daughters, the cost of housing, the quality of life etc... I don't see the intelligence of that move. I don't see it working out much better than Trottier's tenure in NY either.

nathan 10-05-2003 05:00 PM

What was the length of the NYR contract? If they really are different, then I think that could be the biggest factor.

DarioinDenver 10-05-2003 05:06 PM

Off the top of my head I thought both deals were three years. But I'm sure DeVries and his agent saw it as 500k per year so in sum a 1.5 million dollar difference.

Foppa2118 10-05-2003 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
Off the top of my head I thought both deals were three years. But I'm sure DeVries and his agent saw it as 500k per year so in sum a 1.5 million dollar difference.

Wow that's it, 500k more a year, and the same amount of years. If that's true, then that's not even selling out, that's bailing out. I thought Pierre was offering less years, and that was the sticking point.

DarioinDenver 10-06-2003 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foppa2118
Wow that's it, 500k more a year, and the same amount of years. If that's true, then that's not even selling out, that's bailing out. I thought Pierre was offering less years, and that was the sticking point.

I believe the Avs offered him a 3 year 2.8 million dollar deal. NY is a 3.5 four year deal that's heavily frontloaded. So 700k plus and extra year and a front loaded contract (which might hurt him with a lock out).

For the longest period of time I really did dislike DeVries as a player. He had this horrible habit of cross-checking forwards in the corners with that rabbit puch style, just real fast cross-checks that weren't called on him that often. He wouldn't get his feet dirty like a Blake, Foote, or Bourque and just use his body to pinch a guy from the puck. His stock went up in my book by a very large margin when he dropped the gloves with Brasher and showed some stand-up toughness. I still think he has some serious holes defensively and the Rangers are about the worst team he could join up with because of the top three defenders he can pair with. He's going to have a worse than Kasper first year in NY I fear. From the Avalanche perspective, DeVries had no place on the team 2-4 years from last year with the depth we have in our system.

Deader 10-06-2003 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nathan
What was the length of the NYR contract? If they really are different, then I think that could be the biggest factor.

3 years ;)

Av-merican 10-06-2003 05:55 AM

I don't think it was the money that was the factor. It was his desire to play a larger role, and he wasn't gong to get that here with Foote and Blake here.

I don't think DeVo was overrated. If anything, he was underrated. Take in mind he led the NHL in takeaways the final year the NHL kept track of that sort of thing in 2001-2002. He knows when to pinch up, when to stay back, had a decent, if not great, shot from the point and rarely got beaten on breakaways. A good all-around defenseman.

That being said, his loss shouldn't be crippling. Skoula will HAVE to step it up. He no longer has any excuses with Slovak chomping at the bit to move up. His play this preseason hasn't instilled me with much confidence.

There's also the factors of Skrastins and Liles. Liles has clearly outplayed Skoula and Skrastins is willing to give and take punishment, unlike Martin. Both will also have to up their respective games.

DarioinDenver 10-06-2003 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Av-merican
I don't think DeVo was overrated. If anything, he was underrated. Take in mind he led the NHL in takeaways the final year the NHL kept track of that sort of thing in 2001-2002. He knows when to pinch up, when to stay back, had a decent, if not great, shot from the point and rarely got beaten on breakaways. A good all-around defenseman.

I guess we will find out what kind of defenseman he really is playing in New York. Takeaways were removed from statistical tracking because of subjective interpretation. Is a takeaway counted when the other team dumps the puck on a line change? It could have been counted that way even if it seems outrageous. But that's why it was removed. I disagree that he "knows when to pinch", I think he pinched at will and Foote and the forwards knew when to get back to cover him. Rhino, and Sakic spent an awfull lot of time back at their on blue line when in the offensive zone. I would contend that DeVries didn't get beat on break aways because it was Foote who was back. I can recall numerous times that Foote faced 2 v 1s and was the defender going back and laying down on the ice in no mans land. Roy and Foote himself often made those moments forgettable relatively quickly.

I could be wrong but we will soon find out with the pairings he will face in New York.

Foppa2118 10-06-2003 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarioinDenver
For the longest period of time I really did dislike DeVries as a player. He had this horrible habit of cross-checking forwards in the corners with that rabbit puch style, just real fast cross-checks that weren't called on him that often. He wouldn't get his feet dirty like a Blake, Foote, or Bourque and just use his body to pinch a guy from the puck. His stock went up in my book by a very large margin when he dropped the gloves with Brasher and showed some stand-up toughness. I still think he has some serious holes defensively and the Rangers are about the worst team he could join up with because of the top three defenders he can pair with. He's going to have a worse than Kasper first year in NY I fear. From the Avalanche perspective, DeVries had no place on the team 2-4 years from last year with the depth we have in our system.

Yea now that I think about it, he did cross check the lower backs of opponents an awfull lot. I just feel bad because everyone that goes to NYR seems to lose their ability as a player, and its already happened with a few Avs players, like Kaspar, Fleury(minus the year he regained his form on the FLY line) and Kamensky. Just don't see why he would choose the Rangers over maybe the Leafs, or somebody else he could have had a bigger role with than he would with the Avs.

hoserthehorrible 10-06-2003 07:58 PM

I think Skrastins will actually provide better defense than deVries did and will be able to soak up most of his minutes. Skrastins won't however provide as much offense as deVries did. That role will have to be filled by Liles or an improved Skoula. Don't count on Skoula so here's to Liles picking up deVries' offensive production.

andora 10-06-2003 08:18 PM

i hope and think he'll rot in new york.. *shrugs*.. shoulda stayed for situation greg

dempsey_k* 10-07-2003 03:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by avfan#21
and I don't think the Avalanche organization has ever been about players who look at dollar signs first, winning and class second.

I think that's true but a little harsh on Devo. This is just a game, if you can make money, make it, there isn't as much loyalty in journeymen players, and when they're molded into something they should exploit their new found skills to the max. You only earn so much money in life ... would you blow that all just because of loyalty to a corporation and hypnosis to symbolism ?

Believe me, every single dressing room in the NHL is filled with comradery, even amongst each other. They're all a giant family, especially the ones who hate each other. Devo wasn't stabbing anyone in the back, and nobody felt stabbed in the back except some fans.

Fan Development 10-08-2003 07:44 PM

I wouldn't worry about Skrats, he's a workhorse who is as steady as a rock. He has a heavy shot from the point, but the Preds relied on Delmore and Timonen last season for offensive production on the blue line. Karlis was given greater defensive assignment in Nashville by the coaches so that's the game he played.
You're best all time pickup off Nashville's roster in the past was DeVries. That honor will soon be had by Skratstins....however it may one day be taken over by Slovak.


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