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-   -   Lindsay/Pearson Finalists for every season (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=1715821)

Beau Knows 07-29-2014 12:01 PM

Lindsay/Pearson Finalists for every season
 
I pulled up this thread from 2006 a search of the forums: http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...rson+finalists

It didn't have a list of finalists by season past 1999. Can these can be found somewhere or did the NHLPA not release the finalists until around 1999? Is it possible to compile a more comprehensive list than this one from the thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Czech Your Math
YEAR WINNER (Runners-up, no order unless votes included)
------------------
2014 Crosby (Giroux, Getzlaf)
2013 Crosby (Ovechkin, St. Louis)
2012 Malkin (Stamkos, Lundqvist)
2011 D Sedin (Stamkos, Perry)
2010 Ovechkin (Crosby, H Sedin)
2009 Ovechkin (Malkin, Datsyuk)
2008 Ovechkin (Iginla, Malkin)
2007 Crosby (Luongo, Lecavalier)
----------------------------------
2006 Jaromir Jagr (Ovechkin, Thornton)
2004 Martin St. Louis (Luongo, Sakic)
2003 Markus Naslund (Forsberg, Thornton)
2002 Jarome Iginla (Burke, Roy)
2001 Joe Sakic (Jagr, Lemieux)
2000 Jaromir Jagr 192 (Bure 159, Pronger 129)
1999 Jaromir Jagr (Hasek, Yashin, Joseph, Selanne)
1998 Dominik Hasek (Gretzky, Bure, Jagr, Selanne)
1997 Dominik Hasek (Lemieux, Kariya)
1996 Mario Lemieux
1995 Eric Lindros
1994 Sergei Fedorov
1993 Mario Lemieux
1992 Mark Messier
1991 Brett Hull
1990 Mark Messier
1989 Steve Yzerman
1988 Mario Lemieux
1987 Wayne Gretzky
1986 Mario Lemieux 137 (Gretzky 107, Coffey, Robinson)
1985 Wayne Gretzky
1984 Wayne Gretzky
1983 Wayne Gretzky
1982 Wayne Gretzky
1981 Mike Liut
1980 Marcel Dionne
1979 Marcel Dionne
1978 Guy Lafleur
1977 Guy Lafleur
1976 Guy Lafleur
1975 Bobby Orr
1974 Bobby Clarke
1973 Phil Esposito
1972 Jean Ratelle
1971 Phil Esposito

Edit: Added the years since 2006 to the list

Plural 07-29-2014 12:13 PM

I am not sure they have usually given out the "finalists" in Lindsay/Pearson award. Actually, I am fairly certain there is no official list of the voting records given.

Beau Knows 07-29-2014 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAnnala (Post 88473679)
I am not sure they have usually given out the "finalists" in Lindsay/Pearson award. Actually, I am fairly certain there is no official list of the voting records given.

Yeah, there is no voting record given. But in recent years at least the 3 finalists are named before the awards show. I'm not sure which year this began. I assume at one point they simply named a winner. The earliest record I can find of this myself is 2000-2001 where the Wikipedia entry for that season claimed Lemieux was a finalist.

livewell68 07-29-2014 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAnnala (Post 88473679)
I am not sure they have usually given out the "finalists" in Lindsay/Pearson award. Actually, I am fairly certain there is no official list of the voting records given.

They do announce the finalists. In 1998, 1997, 1996 (I believe) and 1995 Jagr was a finalist for the award as well as his 3 wins was a finalist in 2001, 8 times total.

Plural 07-29-2014 12:28 PM

Oh, all right. I have somehow missed the finalists for the Lindsay/Pearson award. Weird since I usually follow-up the award's quite closely.

Beau Knows 07-29-2014 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by livewell68 (Post 88473941)
They do announce the finalists. In 1998, 1997, 1996 (I believe) and 1995 Jagr was a finalist for the award as well as his 3 wins was a finalist in 2001, 8 times total.

Do you have sources for those years? Those years are missing on the original list, it would be nice to add them to the list, assuming the original list is accurate as well.

Horvath Broncos 07-29-2014 01:23 PM

Mike Liut in '81 is so mind boggling. Does anyone have any theory why it was him.

drganon 07-29-2014 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crosbylsmalkin (Post 88475495)
Mike Liut in '81 is so mind boggling. Does anyone have any theory why it was him.

My theory was that since back then the Vezina was still what the william jennings is today, they wanted to recognize him as being the best goalie that year by giving him that instead.If the vezina existed in its current form back then, they probably would've given him that instead of the pearson. That and a lot of people probably still though Gretzky wouldn't make it that far in the NHL. I have no idea if this is true in the slightest, buts it the only theory I got.

Beau Knows 07-29-2014 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drganon (Post 88475793)
My theory was that since back then the Vezina was still what the william jennings is today, they wanted to recognize him as being the best goalie that year by giving him that instead.If the vezina existed in its current form back then, they probably would've given him that instead of the pearson. That and a lot of people probably still though Gretzky wouldn't make it that far in the NHL. I have no idea if this is true in the slightest, buts it the only theory I got.

Maybe some of the players were bitter that he came in with so much hype and was basically going to destroy the league. Gretzky broke the singles season points and assists record that season and led the league in scoring by 29 points. How that could possibly not win you the Pearson is hard to figure out.

This is why it would be nice to see the finalists for each year. I can't imagine that he wasn't a finalist that year, but it would be nice to know for sure given that he somehow didn't win the award that season.

Plural 07-29-2014 01:46 PM

There has been few "questionable" Lindsay/Pearson winners in the history.

Bobby Orr being left out for the trophy for the two first years when it was given is one of the biggest "what the ****s" in my mind.

Ageless66 07-29-2014 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAnnala (Post 88476063)
There has been few "questionable" Lindsay/Pearson winners in the history.

Bobby Orr being left out for the trophy for the two first years when it was given is one of the biggest "what the ****s" in my mind.

Esposito scored 76 goals and 152 points both records at the time

Plural 07-29-2014 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ageless (Post 88476195)
Esposito scored 76 goals and 152 points both records at the time

Yeah and he would have not gotten close to those numbers without Orr. Don't get me wrong, Espo was a great player on his own right. But there is no way he breaks that record without the help of Orr. As more outstanding player, it was Orr by a mile that year.

Ageless66 07-29-2014 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAnnala (Post 88476349)
Yeah and he would have not gotten close to those numbers without Orr. Don't get me wrong, Espo was a great player on his own right. But there is no way he breaks that record without the help of Orr. As more outstanding player, it was Orr by a mile that year.

But still you can't ignore the raw numbers. 76 goals was like how gretzkys 92 goals is right now. It was thought to be impossible to beat

Beau Knows 07-29-2014 02:20 PM

Here are the most wins + finalist positions since 1999 for players who appear at least twice (assuming the data is accurate):

Ovechkin: 3 wins + 2 finalists = 5
Crosby: 3 wins + 1 finalist = 4
Jagr: 3 wins + 1 finalist = 4
Malkin: 1 win + 2 finalists = 3
Sakic: 1 win + 1 finalist = 2
St. Louis: 1 win + 1 finalist = 2
Stamkos: 0 wins + 2 finalists = 2
Luongo 0 wins + 2 finalists = 2
Thornton 0 wins + 2 finalists = 2

I though it would be interesting to combine the players and the medias views. Here are those players Lindsay award and Hart trophy combined top 3 appearances since 2000.

Ovechkin: 6 wins + 3 finalists = 9
Crosby: 5 wins + 3 finalists = 8
Jagr: 4 wins + 4 finalists = 8
Malkin: 2 wins + 4 finalists = 6
St. Louis: 2 wins + 2 finalist = 4
Sakic: 2 wins + 1 finalist = 3
Thornton 1 wins + 2 finalists = 3
Stamkos: 0 wins + 3 finalists = 3
Luongo: 0 wins + 3 finalists = 3

Plural 07-29-2014 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ageless (Post 88476587)
But still you can't ignore the raw numbers. 76 goals was like how gretzkys 92 goals is right now. It was thought to be impossible to beat

True. It was probably the numbers that did it.

But what explains the Ratelle over Orr in 71-72? Sentimental value? He did win the Masterton award year before. But if I recall correctly, it was about his clean hockey rather than some obstacle he managed to overcome.

He did have a crazy good year tough, scoring 109 points in 63 games.

Ageless66 07-29-2014 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TAnnala (Post 88477063)
True. It was probably the numbers that did it.

But what explains the Ratelle over Orr in 71-72? Sentimental value? He did win the Masterton award year before. But if I recall correctly, it was about his clean hockey rather than some obstacle he managed to overcome.

He did have a crazy good year tough, scoring 109 points in 63 games.

Yeah that one is different. Still a very good season. Also Gretzky only has 5. All in all it has been given out 43 times and most of the time to the right player

Ishdul 07-29-2014 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crosbylsmalkin (Post 88475495)
Mike Liut in '81 is so mind boggling. Does anyone have any theory why it was him.

He barely finished ahead of Liut in the Hart voting. It was 242 to 237 there, so it wouldnt have taken a big shift in opinion for Luit to win. Still dumb though.

Ishdul 07-29-2014 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ageless (Post 88479395)
Yeah that one is different. Still a very good season. Also Gretzky only has 5. All in all it has been given out 43 times and most of the time to the right player

I think it's definitely been worse than the Hart at giving it to the right player.

Ageless66 07-29-2014 03:51 PM

Crosby and ovechkin have combined for 6 of the last 8 lindsays

livewell68 07-29-2014 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ageless (Post 88476195)
Esposito scored 76 goals and 152 points both records at the time

Wasn't that the season when Orr also got two records? Most assists in a season (102) a record that would stand until Gretzky and Lemieux came along, his 102 assists are still a defenseman record to this day. Also his 139 Pts is still an NHL record among defensemen.

LeBlondeDemon10 07-29-2014 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by livewell68 (Post 88486511)
Wasn't that the season when Orr also got two records? Most assists in a season (102) a record that would stand until Gretzky and Lemieux came along, his 102 assists are still a defenseman record to this day. Also his 139 Pts is still an NHL record among defensemen.

Yeah, Espo winning despite his impressive numbers never sat well with me. He played with the two most powerful offensive forces in the late 60's early 70's, Hull and Orr. To do what Orr did that year was just mind boggling. I wonder, for those that were around back then, was Orr seen like Gretzky was early in his career?

livewell68 07-29-2014 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeBlondeDemon10 (Post 88489833)
Yeah, Espo winning despite his impressive numbers never sat well with me. He played with the two most powerful offensive forces in the late 60's early 70's, Hull and Orr. To do what Orr did that year was just mind boggling. I wonder, for those that were around back then, was Orr seen like Gretzky was early in his career?

Well considering some still have Orr as the best player of all time says a lot about the kind of player Orr was.

He was the greatest all-around player the NHL has ever seen. Many thought his numbers were stick for ever at the time.

In fact in around 2000, THN (The Hockey News) had released a "Greatest Seasons" list and I remember quite fondly that Orr's season (1970-71) was named the greatest season of all time beating out Gretzky and Lemieux. His +124 is just mind boggling (you talk about records that will never fall, here folks is one that will never fall). Esposito has Orr to thank for his 152 Pts.

Killion 07-30-2014 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeBlondeDemon10 (Post 88489833)
Yeah, Espo winning despite his impressive numbers never sat well with me. He played with the two most powerful offensive forces in the late 60's early 70's, Hull and Orr. To do what Orr did that year was just mind boggling. I wonder, for those that were around back then, was Orr seen like Gretzky was early in his career?

At the NHL level or with Oshawa in Jr.A? If the former then sure, some similarities, if the latter, there as well, including size as Orr was just a scrawny 14yr old. But at the NHL?... Sure. The mind~bending moves & vision, the different way they each played their respective positions from what we'd been accustomed to. Deep rushing Defenseman, guy who could rag the puck like that playing keepaway from Superstars making them look mortal all of a sudden; or Gretzky, like smoke, eyes everywhere, unbelievably deceptive & quick. You knew you were watching someone pretty special. Beyond anything that'd come before in both of those guys. Orr though closer to earth, more elements of the proto-typical in him than Gretzky who really was a complete outlier. Didnt even look like he belonged out there until he started moving. Orr on the other hand, rather like some rushing Defenseman seen before & still playing (Shore, Harvey, Kelly, Horton etc), just amp'd up to a whole new level.

Budddy 07-30-2014 12:12 AM

Orr winning just once is crazy...just crazy:amazed:

LeBlondeDemon10 07-30-2014 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killion (Post 88492539)
At the NHL level or with Oshawa in Jr.A? If the former then sure, some similarities, if the latter, there as well, including size as Orr was just a scrawny 14yr old. But at the NHL?... Sure. The mind~bending moves & vision, the different way they each played their respective positions from what we'd been accustomed to. Deep rushing Defenseman, guy who could rag the puck like that playing keepaway from Superstars making them look mortal all of a sudden; or Gretzky, like smoke, eyes everywhere, unbelievably deceptive & quick. You knew you were watching someone pretty special. Beyond anything that'd come before in both of those guys. Orr though closer to earth, more elements of the proto-typical in him than Gretzky who really was a complete outlier. Didnt even look like he belonged out there until he started moving. Orr on the other hand, rather like some rushing Defenseman seen before & still playing (Shore, Harvey, Kelly, Horton etc), just amp'd up to a whole new level.

I should have been more specific. I was referring to the underlying resentment many had for 99 early in his career because he looked like a schoolboy while dismantling the league. I think some of this attitude influenced the players in their voting for the Lindsay/Pearson. From what I've heard, Orr was challenged with the rough stuff from day 1 in the NHL and earned his spot in the NHL according to the unwritten code. Gretzky not so much because he didn't play a physical game. Hence, the different perspectives on their domination.


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