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-   -   Is this the end for Primeau? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=195696)

greatwhite101* 11-29-2005 09:12 AM

Is this the end for Primeau?
 
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/spo...y/13279571.htm

You hear the chatter in every NHL city from players on opposing teams. Primeau is done. He's not coming back this season.

Primeau admitted during an NHL conference call in August that he had been having post-concussion symptoms as late as May from injuries suffered in the 2004 playoffs.

Clarke said if the medical staff told him tomorrow that Primeau wasn't coming back this season, he would have to prepare to make a trade for another center.

Trainer Jim McCrossin said that Primeau has had a series of days where he was symptom-free for 20 to 22 hours but has had only 31/2 "good days," when the time between his non-concussive symptoms has increased.

Flyers payroll is at $38,828,690... :amazed:

Well this is a tough deal for Keith and Flyers. :(

stanley 11-29-2005 09:22 AM

If Primeau can't come back it's a really tough blow for the Flyers. On the bright side, it would at least allow the club to move forward because for salary cap purposes, they would be allowed to exceed the cap by the amount of his salary.

It's an on-ice and locker room loss. It won't hurt them financially (and acutally, would probably help them in that department).

Edit: Timmy, if you're reading this, check the CBA. Teams are allowed to exceed the cap by the amount of a player's salary, if that player is medically unable to play for 10 consecutive games or 24 consecutive days. This sounds good on paper, but seems like it's only advantageous if the lost player is lost for the entire season. Otherwise, payroll shuffling would have to occur when that player returned. At any rate, the amount they exceeded the cap would still count against the player's share, league-wide, but wouldn't count against the Flyers' salary cap if and until Primeau returned.

It still seems like it's a bit premature to worry about this, though.

John Flyers Fan 11-29-2005 09:26 AM

I don't think that payroll number is accurate.

The Flyers get salary cap relief for Kapanen, Stevenson and Primeau. All missed 10+ games.

GKJ 11-29-2005 09:29 AM

It is a frustrating situation because he is the shutdown center. He is better than Handzus in that role. Guys like Keith Primeau do not grow on trees. However an interesting name that came into my mind, was actually Wayne Primeau, his brother who plays for the Sharks. Don't think they'd trade him until the Sharks would be out of it, but most people expect them to turn it around.

Dr Love 11-29-2005 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
I don't think that payroll number is accurate.

The Flyers get salary cap relief for Kapanen, Stevenson and Primeau. All missed 10+ games.

Which was used on call ups. The window for Kapanen and Stevenson's cap relief has closed.

stanley 11-29-2005 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
I don't think that payroll number is accurate.

The Flyers get salary cap relief for Kapanen, Stevenson and Primeau. All missed 10+ games.

John,
I think the only relief they receive is the ability to add the amount of their salaries to their cap figure while they're out of the lineup. As I understand it, once those players return, they lose the contingency to exceed the cap (which is why the most likely scenario in which teams take advantage of this stipulation is where a player is lost for the season).

Art Vandelay 11-29-2005 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RUS
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/sports/hockey/13279571.htm

You hear the chatter in every NHL city from players on opposing teams. Primeau is done. He's not coming back this season.

Primeau admitted during an NHL conference call in August that he had been having post-concussion symptoms as late as May from injuries suffered in the 2004 playoffs.

Clarke said if the medical staff told him tomorrow that Primeau wasn't coming back this season, he would have to prepare to make a trade for another center.

Trainer Jim McCrossin said that Primeau has had a series of days where he was symptom-free for 20 to 22 hours but has had only 31/2 "good days," when the time between his non-concussive symptoms has increased.

Flyers payroll is at $38,828,690... :amazed:

Well this is a tough deal for Keith and Flyers. :(

Quote:

"People think I'm finished," Primeau said. "I don't know what the future holds. But my whole intent is to play."
Key quote for me.
The only date that is really important is the trade deadline, by then Clarke must know if he should go after a replacement.

As for the payroll, that's what alot of short-term injuries will do to a team, the Flyers right now have a 25 man roster, when the injured players come back, players will be sent down to the Phantoms: (Ready, maybe Umberger) and maybe waived (Savage) that alone would cut about 2 million in payroll.

stanley 11-29-2005 09:33 AM

Man, you guys are quick. That's not so good with the girls, but impressive here.

John Flyers Fan 11-29-2005 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Love
Which was used on call ups. The window for Kapanen and Stevenson's cap relief has closed.

Umberger makes about 1/3rd of what Primeau makes.
Kavanaugh was only up for a few games and makes 1/3rd of what Kapanen makes.
Nobody was brought up to replace Stevenson.

There was some savings on Stevenson and Kapanen. We're also saving money on Umberger/Primeau.

It might not be a ton of money, but it could be significant come February/March.

Dr Love 11-29-2005 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
It might not be a ton of money, but it could be significant come February/March.

That's not how it works. You can only use that money while the player is on the DL. The money "saved" while Stevenson and Kapanen were out is now "lost." They can't recoup it or use up that space any more.

Art Vandelay 11-29-2005 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Umberger makes about 1/3rd of what Primeau makes.
Kavanaugh was only up for a few games and makes 1/3rd of what Kapanen makes.
Nobody was brought up to replace Stevenson.

There was some savings on Stevenson and Kapanen. We're also saving money on Umberger/Primeau.

It might not be a ton of money, but it could be significant come February/March.

Quote:

Club payrolls will never be permitted to be below the minimum or in excess of the maximum. Clubs at or near the upper limit that have players who incur a bona fide long-term injury will be entitled to replace up to the full value of the injured player's NHL salary (even if such salary would result in the club's team salary exceeding the upper limit). The "replacement salary" will not count against the club's upper limit but will count against the League-wide players' share.
http://www.nhl.com/nhlhq/cba/index.html

This quote is open to interpretation but mine is that the "cap relief" only comes in if a team has to go over the cap to replace an injured player.

Dr Love 11-29-2005 09:39 AM

LOTN you missed the key line:

Quote:

Upon return of the injured player, the team must come into immediate compliance with the requirements of the payroll range.

stanley 11-29-2005 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
It might not be a ton of money, but it could be significant come February/March.

John,
I don't think it's an average based on the amount of money a team chooses to spend. Instead, I think it's a real-time figure that can never be exceeded.

Read under "Club Payrolls:" http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=131133&hubname=nhl

I think I'm interpreting it correctly.

Art Vandelay 11-29-2005 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Love
LOTN you missed the key line:

Doesnt that strenghten my interpretation? That quote means that this (cap relief) only applies when a team has been forced to go over the cap to replace a long term injured player. The Flyers have as far as i know not been over the cap. (Except when they signed Forsberg)

(Only example of this (cap relief) that i know of is Elias - Mogilny in NJ)

stanley 11-29-2005 09:47 AM

Like I wrote before, you guys are Q-U-I-C-K, quick.

Dr Love 11-29-2005 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lion of the North
Doesnt that strenghten my interpretation?

Yes, that's why I pointed it out. Without that line, it could be interpeted the other way.

Art Vandelay 11-29-2005 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Love
Yes, that's why I pointed it out. Without that line, it could be interpeted the other way.

Ok :)

greatwhite101* 11-29-2005 10:35 AM

Clarke said if the medical staff told him tomorrow that Primeau wasn't coming back this season, he would have to prepare to make a trade for another center.

Who? Any ideas? I bet it will be some one like Gratton. Thats the only trade we will make with Florida.. lol No Luongo :eek:

jb** 11-29-2005 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RUS
Clarke said if the medical staff told him tomorrow that Primeau wasn't coming back this season, he would have to prepare to make a trade for another center.

Who? Any ideas? I bet it will be some one like Gratton. Thats the only trade we will make with Florida.. lol No Luongo :eek:

Has a checking line center I wouldn’t have a problem with that at all and I bet Hitch could work wonders with him for that role like he did with Primeau. He could be had for cheap and isn't expensive.

MojoJojo 11-29-2005 01:54 PM

The perfect fit would be Madden. Fits right into the hole created by Primeau in our payroll structure, and NJ may need to dump spme salary when Elias is ready to return. These trades are tough because of the rivalry, but man would that be sweet.

greatwhite101* 11-29-2005 01:58 PM

Yeah he has a sweet contract 3.861M per year for god knows how many years...
Thats would fit right in.

Toonces 11-29-2005 02:09 PM

This sucks... :help:

BobbyClarkeFan16 11-29-2005 05:23 PM

I think it's the end for Primeau. If it took him nearly a year to heal up from his last concussion, then I think eventually the doctors are gonna have to tell him to hang up the skates. I guess this means that we're going to be looking for a shut down centerman with size. I guess it means that that will probably be the role that Carter will start getting groomed for. I really hope not because it would be a waste of talent, but this wouldn't be the first time that Hitch has wasted talent that he has had at his disposal.

Roger's Pancreas* 11-29-2005 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MojoJojo
The perfect fit would be Madden. Fits right into the hole created by Primeau in our payroll structure, and NJ may need to dump spme salary when Elias is ready to return. These trades are tough because of the rivalry, but man would that be sweet.

Man you got my interest peaked with that one.

Brad* 11-29-2005 06:10 PM

That would definitely be a loss for the Flyers. Primeau does have a role on the team, and a relatively important one. I don't think Handzus is all that far away from Primeau in terms of defensive skill, but I'd prefer to have Handzus in a different role. An offensive one, like he has been.

Personally, I'll wait and see. Concussions are a funny thing, no one really knows when and if he'll be back. That's the scary part though, it's the not knowing. I think in all of the confusion, people start to convince themselves that since they don't know when he'll be back, he'll never be back. Not necessarily the case. Primeau is a tough guy, and someone who is obviously quite motivated to return. I wouldn't count him out just yet.

With that said, we still have to consider the possibility that he doesn't come back. If he doesn't, I am in agreement that another checking line center/good PK'er would be an option. I think Mike Peca would be a good fit. First of all, he'd likely come cheap. He hasn't worked out very well in Edmonton from what I understand, and later in the season he could perhaps be had for a fairly small amount. He's a tough, character player who can fill that checking role and kill penalties. He seems like a playoff type player to me, and someone that Hitchcock would enjoy having on the team. Also, I think he'd do well in a Hitchcock system.


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