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-   -   Steen vs. Vermette (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=23953)

leafaholix* 10-29-2003 06:49 PM

Steen vs. Vermette
 
After a conversation with Sens fans, I'd like to know...

Who has higher potential to make a big impact in the NHL?

Please don't just take offensive abilities into consideration, look at both players games as a whole.

Jeffrey 10-29-2003 07:25 PM

IMO
Vermette is a complete player !
he's fast, he has a nice scoring touch + he's good defensively...
I think vermette would be a cooke type of player... maybe with luck and hardwork ... a Lehtinen type of player...
i would definately select him over steen..

leafaholix* 10-29-2003 07:30 PM

You said...

- Fast
- Nice scoring touch
- Good defensively

Steen is...

- Fast
- Physical
- Fearless
- Great playmaker
- Great stickhandler
- Great defensively
- Great leader

Very much like Shane Doan.

V for Voodoo 10-29-2003 07:35 PM

you asked what people thought, now let them answer..
flaunting steen and his special skills defeats the purpose

Vatican Roulette 10-29-2003 09:15 PM

Vermette

icarus 10-29-2003 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voodoo Daddy
you asked what people thought, now let them answer..
flaunting steen and his special skills defeats the purpose

No kidding...

leafaholix* 10-29-2003 09:25 PM

No, it's just the guy who responded first.

He's never seen Steen play, I suppose I should have asked for knowledgable members to pick... my fault.

Vlad The Impaler 10-29-2003 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go pierre hedin
No, it's just the guy who responded first.

He's never seen Steen play, I suppose I should have asked for knowledgable members to pick... my fault.

Ok, so are you saying you asked a question while being persuaded that one of the answer would indicate someone is not knowledgeable? Sounds useless and inflamatory to say the least.

leafaholix* 10-30-2003 12:06 AM

I actually meant people who have either seen or read up on both prospects. Not someone who just looks at what one guy can do and thinks he's automatically better. My response to kryoptix's post was to show Steen's abilities.

He said...

Quote:

Vermette is a complete player !
From all the reports, so is Steen.

Quote:

he's fast, he has a nice scoring touch + he's good defensively...
Steen...

Fast - Yes.
Nice scoring touch - Yes, but more of a playmaker.
Good defensively - Yes

Quote:

i would definately select him over steen..
What makes it so definate? When you're COMPARING two prospects, you've got to look at both their assets... not just 1 guys. It may also be because he hates the Leafs...

Kevin Forbes 10-30-2003 03:27 AM

there is not one speed called fast
there is not one level of solidness defensively
there is not one type of nice scoring touch

I think, what Krypo is saying is that he thinks Vermette is better then Steen, especially in these aspects

What sort of thread is this going to be if you're just going to semi-flame all those who pick Vermette?

Plus you just completely blow off Krypo by saying he's never seen Steen play, so therefore he can't know anything at all.

You asked a question, be prepared for an answer that isn't Steen, and accept it, you're not going to change anyone's minds.

Jeffrey 10-30-2003 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go pierre hedin
I actually meant people who have either seen or read up on both prospects. Not someone who just looks at what one guy can do and thinks he's automatically better. My response to kryoptix's post was to show Steen's abilities.

He said...

From all the reports, so is Steen.

Steen...

Fast - Yes.
Nice scoring touch - Yes, but more of a playmaker.
Good defensively - Yes

What makes it so definate? When you're COMPARING two prospects, you've got to look at both their assets... not just 1 guys. It may also be because he hates the Leafs...

True i've never seen Steen.. but i've read some about him !
and for vermette ... i've seen him plenty of times and i think he's a typical sens player (very skilled, very fast,good defensively and not enough touted) he dominated in the AHL.. and IMO would play in the nhl soon..
steen is comparable to Chris Higgins (from wut i've read)
but I've seen so much things happen in recent years(about Sweden prospects particuly) and this make me beleive .. that it's maybe more hype than true..
I'll wait until i see him and after that i would have a bette r opinion..
maybe it's just me but im not sold on sweden prospects (sorry)..
btw you description in steen make me beleive is a future HOFamer..
maybe you're too much biased ...
anyway good luck to both prospects!

surixon 10-30-2003 09:59 AM

Well having seen both play, I would take Vermette over Steen. I really don't see what people see in Steen. I saw him in the world juniors and was really unimpressed by him. Vermette by far has more speed then Steen probably a better shot. On top of that Vermette has very good stick handling and playmaking skills. He is also very sound defensivly. I would also like to ad that it's nice to see that Vermette is finaly getting noticed as being one of the better prospects.

West 10-30-2003 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by surixon
Well having seen both play, I would take Vermette over Steen. I really don't see what people see in Steen. I saw him in the world juniors and was really unimpressed by him. Vermette by far has more speed then Steen probably a better shot. On top of that Vermette has very good stick handling and playmaking skills. He is also very sound defensivly. I would also like to ad that it's nice to see that Vermette is finaly getting noticed as being one of the better prospects.

Just going by stat's it looks like he's having a break out year in sweden.

Taking that into account I abstain. 6 months ago I definitely would have voted Vernette.

Hossa 10-30-2003 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go pierre hedin
You said...

- Fast
- Nice scoring touch
- Good defensively

Steen is...

- Fast
- Physical
- Fearless
- Great playmaker
- Great stickhandler
- Great defensively
- Great leader

Very much like Shane Doan.

Do you want people to answer, or just those who give the answer you want to hear?

think-blue- 10-30-2003 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by surixon
Well having seen both play, I would take Vermette over Steen. I really don't see what people see in Steen. I saw him in the world juniors and was really unimpressed by him. .

I believe he put up 6 pts in 6 games in the WJC...anyways, what exactly unimpressed you by him?

Brock 10-30-2003 10:21 AM

Alexander Steen every day of the week.

He's among the leaders in scoring in the SEL so far, and he's a very complete prospect. I think that by the end of the year, he'll be a consensus top 25 prospect in the NHL.

Vermette is good player though, very underrated, especially since his AHL rookie season was very strong. He really sunk under the radar because of his injuries during his QMJHL career.

Sammy* 10-30-2003 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThinkBlue
I believe he put up 6 pts in 6 games in the WJC...anyways, what exactly unimpressed you by him?

Maybe the fact he was unimpressive?

Brock 10-30-2003 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sammy
Maybe the fact he was unimpressive?

Maybe you'd like to enlighten us then?

What was unimpressive about him? It's really a very simple question.

It's hard to be unimpressive as the team's captain and leading scorer.

To be honest, I wasn't a fan of the Steen selection on draft day. However after watching the WJC's last year, I immediately became a fan. He impressed me greatly as one of Sweden's only bright spots. He and Nilsson showed great chemistry with each other.

Volchenkov 10-30-2003 11:50 AM

I'm curious what a poll would uncover in this debate. I'll start one on the poll board.

think-blue- 10-30-2003 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Volchenkov
I'm curious what a poll would uncover in this debate. I'll start one on the poll board.

I guess that would be good.

I think we can still discuss the attributes of each player here. I also think there is room to hold people accountable on their opinions; some of that bashing headed gph's way was unnecessary.

Vincent_TheGreat 10-30-2003 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go pierre hedin
You said...

- Fast
- Nice scoring touch
- Good defensively

Steen is...

- Fast
- Physical
- Fearless
- Great playmaker
- Great stickhandler
- Great defensively
- Great leader

Very much like Shane Doan.

Ok I know your a leafs fan so expected you to think steen was better, but he isn't. Vermette has world class speed, steen is above average, nothing special. Steen better work on scoring or he will never make it anywhere. Steen is not that phsyical although he is strong, but Fast and physical don't apply to Steen, and he is average defensively. Sorry Vermette is the better of the two.

Volchenkov 10-30-2003 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThinkBlue
I guess that would be good.

I think we can still discuss the attributes of each player here. I also think there is room to hold people accountable on their opinions; some of that bashing headed gph's way was unnecessary.

Fair enough.

Let's do some coparisons. I'll give my opinion on the comparison + a short explanation adn they you will give yours. Feel free to add some of your own categories.

Speed: Vermette - He beat Havlat and Hossa in training camp - 'nuff said.
Scoring: Vermette - He was 6th or 7th in the AHL in his rookie season in goals after having a year off.
Toughness: Steen - Vermette is a skill player and a little small - Steen wins easily here
Playmaking: Steen - Vermette hasn't shown the ability to set up goals as much as Steen has.
Defense: Vermette - He's playing on Ottawa's PK and is being used as a defensive specialist on Ottawa - he wouldn't be unles he is already NHL calibre in terms of defense.
Puck Handling: I have no clue.

Your turn.

The Mars Volchenkov 10-30-2003 12:11 PM

The speed shouldn't even be a question as Vermette is the fastest player to ever attend a Sens training camp. Defensively, he's already killing penalties at the NHL level.

I can't comment on Steen though, as I've never seen him play, but I hear great things about him.

BlueAndWhite 10-30-2003 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent_TheGreat
Ok I know your a leafs fan so expected you to think steen was better, but he isn't. Vermette has world class speed, steen is above average, nothing special. Steen better work on scoring or he will never make it anywhere. Steen is not that phsyical although he is strong, but Fast and physical don't apply to Steen, and he is average defensively. Sorry Vermette is the better of the two.

Your opinion is that Vermette is better, that's fine. It is YOUR opinion after all.

Steen better work on his scoring ?

He is tied for 6th overall in scoring in the SEL. All the players ahead of him are significantly older (i.e. the likes of Jorgen Jonsson. He is first in GWG and 5th in assists.

You also are confused on his defensive play and his ability to mix it up physically.

DutchLeafsfan 10-30-2003 12:16 PM

Well, I personally like Steen a bit more, should be a very good player for years to come for the Leafs. Vermette isn't exaclty a slouch either though.

One thing which I do think is a problem with the Steen- Vermette comparison is that many posters will have seen Vermette play on fairly regular basis, while Steen could only be seen during the WJC, when he played on a bad Sweden entry.


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