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Le Tricolore 07-05-2006 11:41 PM

Marc Staal?
 
What are the chances that he makes the NHL roster this season? My pick is coming up soon in a keeper fantasy league, and he'd be a nice addition to my defense.

Thanks.

Draft Guru 07-06-2006 12:09 AM

I'd say 35%.

FLYLine24 07-06-2006 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draft Guru (Post 5937487)
I'd say 35%.

I'll agree with this %.

Thirty One 07-06-2006 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLYLine88 (Post 5937629)
I'll agree with this %.

I think he's undershooting. I'd say 38.6%

Brooklyn Ranger 07-06-2006 12:52 AM

Unlikely, but not impossible.

Edge 07-06-2006 03:55 PM

Could he? Yes.

Should he? Maybe.

Will he? Not likely.

I'd say about 30-35% is about right. With the UFA signings, I just don't know where he'd play.

You've got some guys who are pretty locked. Add Rosival to that equation and that's even more true, if Ozolinsh comes back it's all over.

caldercup0 07-06-2006 03:57 PM

I think it's unlikely. In the AHL playoff games he played he didn't look terrific, and he could probably use another season in juniors.

True Blue 07-06-2006 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge (Post 5944439)
Could he? Yes.

Should he? Maybe.

Will he? Not likely.

I'd say about 30-35% is about right. With the UFA signings, I just don't know where he'd play.

You've got some guys who are pretty locked. Add Rosival to that equation and that's even more true, if Ozolinsh comes back it's all over.

Once Rozsival signs, it will make no difference how Stall performs in camp. Or who he outperforms.

Taz 07-06-2006 06:22 PM

To be honest i feel he does need just a bit more time either in OHL or some more AHL time (if he is can?)... He looked OK in the AHL play offs he played very simple hockey. I still think he needs to bulk up a tad more and adjust to the fast pace and improve his offence. There is no reason to rush him.

nyrmessier011 07-06-2006 09:01 PM

50-50 in my opinion from what ive read and the very little ive managed to see him play, but im no prospect guru so id listen to these other guys. I'm suprised that a lot of you guru's dont think he will play. I was almost sure towards the end of last season i was hearing news that pointed to him definetly playing next season. Regardless, If he's not gonna make the big team, I'd like to see him playing in Hartford.

Draft Guru 07-06-2006 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nyrmessier011 (Post 5947710)
Regardless, If he's not gonna make the big team, I'd like to see him playing in Hartford.

Ideally we'd want him in Hartford, but it's not possible. He still has another year of junior eligibity left. So it's either the NHL or back to the OHL.

nyr2k2 07-06-2006 10:02 PM

I think he should play another year of Juniors. He's not ready to step in a shut-down dman. Couple that with the roster we have right now, there really isn't any need for him. The '07-'08 season will be Staal's time to shine, IMO.

ATLANTARANGER* 07-06-2006 10:17 PM

OHL for Staal. Unless something breaks on the trade front and spots open up on D. Agrred he should really go to Hartford but under the current setup that won't happen.

True Blue 07-06-2006 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midclasscasualty (Post 5948337)
He's not ready to step in a shut-down dman.

And who on the Rangers roster qualifies as that?
Quote:

Couple that with the roster we have right now, there really isn't any need for him.
Who is so stellar that cannot easily be upgraded from?
Quote:

The '07-'08 season will be Staal's time to shine, IMO.
Until you see him in camp, how do you know he could not cut it as a third-pairing defenseman next year?
Quote:

Originally Posted by nyrmessier011
I'm suprised that a lot of you guru's dont think he will play.

It's not for lack of desire to see him have a shot. It's becuase realistically, there will be no room for him to make the team as a starting defenseman.

Son of Steinbrenner 07-06-2006 11:38 PM

Why is Rozsival the reason for Staal not to make the team? Why is that always the same old tired excuse?

The Rangers have basically spelled out there intentions for Staal. He is going to be on the team next season. From Sather to Maloney to Renney they have all basically said he a real good shot at it...

Rozsvial isn't going to have to worry about being the odd man out (after the way he played last season he shouldn't have too)

The reason Staal might be forced to make the team is Kaspar. Kaspar had 2 operations this offseason and who knows if he will be ready by training camp. At his age and with his injury history it's asking way to much for him to come back on time from this.

I predict Staal makes the team not only because of his play but because of manpower issues.

As the Rangers have shown in the past good young players will get there shot.

nyr2k2 07-06-2006 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by True Blue (Post 5949017)
And who on the Rangers roster qualifies as that?

Who is so stellar that cannot easily be upgraded from?

Until you see him in camp, how do you know he could not cut it as a third-pairing defenseman next year?

It's not for lack of desire to see him have a shot. It's becuase realistically, there will be no room for him to make the team as a starting defenseman.

1. No one on our roster qualifies as that. I'm just saying, Staal will be a shut-down dman, but not yet. Have you seen him play in person? I have- 5 different times. He's not ready yet.

2. I don't understand this question. Everyone on our D could be "upgraded," but from watching Staal play, I don't think he'd be the upgrade.

3. He probably could cut it as a third pairing defenseman. But, I'd rather have him logging 20 minutes a game in juniors, adding a bit more bulk and refining his game.

Staying put in juniors another year won't hurt him. Our defense, the way it is, is solid enough to compete. Having seen what I've seen from Staal, I don't believe that he's ready to step in and be an improvement over what we currently have.

Edge 07-07-2006 01:58 AM

Staal to me is another example of why I hate the junior/nhl age rules.

He strikes me as the classic tweener. He's ready to move on from the OHL but probably is just a little short of ideally being in the NHL. So you're forced with two options:

1. Don't challange him enough
or
2. Challange him too much.

Blackburn was a case like this a few years back as well.

FLYLine24 07-07-2006 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge (Post 5950680)
Staal to me is another example of why I hate the junior/nhl age rules.

He strikes me as the classic tweener. He's ready to move on from the OHL but probably is just a little short of ideally being in the NHL. So you're forced with two options:

1. Don't challange him enough
or
2. Challange him too much.

Blackburn was a case like this a few years back as well.

Yup, its complete BS. Its a lose, lose situation really...but the factor that makes me lean toward wanting him to return to the OHL is the fact that then we wouldn't lose him a year early to UFA (which could turn out to be a year wasted if he isnt ready for the NHL).

The best case scenario IMO is, let Staal play a few NHL games (under 10 though...or whatever the max games is before he loses Junior eligibility), send him back to Juniors. Hope his team doesn't make the playoffs and then ship him to the AHL to play 10 or so regular season AHL and then playoffs.

True Blue 07-07-2006 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midclasscasualty (Post 5949690)
1. No one on our roster qualifies as that. I'm just saying, Staal will be a shut-down dman, but not yet. Have you seen him play in person? I have- 5 different times. He's not ready yet.

So what? Since when must a future "shut-down" defenseman attain that status before he can begin his NHL apprenticeship? Your opinion seems to differ from others who think that, at a minimum, he is ready to be a #6 defenseman as soon as next year. At any rate, if you do not give him a real shot, then you never find out, now do you?
Quote:

2. I don't understand this question. Everyone on our D could be "upgraded," but from watching Staal play, I don't think he'd be the upgrade.
You said:

Couple that with the roster we have right now, there really isn't any need for him.

That statement leads me to believe that you seem to think that the most mediocre defense in the league has no need to be upgraded from. I think that Staal could be a good 3rd-pairing defenseman. I do not see the need to have such a veteran-laden defense on a team that is supposed to be getting younger and rebuilding. Also, as the defense is about as mediocre as it gets, why not give a young kid a shot to....gasp....improve it?
Quote:

3. He probably could cut it as a third pairing defenseman. But, I'd rather have him logging 20 minutes a game in juniors, adding a bit more bulk and refining his game.
Now you are going the other way. First you say that he is not ready. Now you say that he can be a 3rd pairing defenseman. Which is it? Seems to me that if he can cut it as a 3rd-pairing defenseman, then he is ready for the NHL.
And if he is ready to play on the 3rd pair, then his development would grow by leaps and bounds if he is playing 15 minutes at the NHL-level against NHL competition. Playing at juniors does nothing for him anymore.
Quote:

Our defense, the way it is, is solid enough to compete.
And I believe that our defense is amongst the worst in the league. And the last 2 months and the playoffs have show that.
Quote:

Having seen what I've seen from Staal, I don't believe that he's ready to step in and be an improvement over what we currently have.
Let's just take Rozsival as an example in this case. He is a 3rd pairing defenseman on any other team in the league. That the Rangers use him on the top pair does not change that. Most agree that without Jagr on the ice with him at all times, he would be seen as a fairly ordinary defenseman. So, he is you average 3rd line defenseman, and you state that Staal is ready to play on the 3rd pair next year, then why bring back Rozsival and not allow Staal a chance? Would you really miss the nightly obstruction penalty that Rozsival brings? Or the odd-man rush that results whenever Jagr does not pin the puck in the other zone?

bigblue21 07-07-2006 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by True Blue (Post 5952035)
So what? Since when must a future "shut-down" defenseman attain that status before he can begin his NHL apprenticeship? Your opinion seems to differ from others who think that, at a minimum, he is ready to be a #6 defenseman as soon as next year. At any rate, if you do not give him a real shot, then you never find out, now do you?

You said:

Couple that with the roster we have right now, there really isn't any need for him.

That statement leads me to believe that you seem to think that the most mediocre defense in the league has no need to be upgraded from. I think that Staal could be a good 3rd-pairing defenseman. I do not see the need to have such a veteran-laden defense on a team that is supposed to be getting younger and rebuilding. Also, as the defense is about as mediocre as it gets, why not give a young kid a shot to....gasp....improve it?

Now you are going the other way. First you say that he is not ready. Now you say that he can be a 3rd pairing defenseman. Which is it? Seems to me that if he can cut it as a 3rd-pairing defenseman, then he is ready for the NHL.
And if he is ready to play on the 3rd pair, then his development would grow by leaps and bounds if he is playing 15 minutes at the NHL-level against NHL competition. Playing at juniors does nothing for him anymore.

And I believe that our defense is amongst the worst in the league. And the last 2 months and the playoffs have show that.

Let's just take Rozsival as an example in this case. He is a 3rd pairing defenseman on any other team in the league. That the Rangers use him on the top pair does not change that. Most agree that without Jagr on the ice with him at all times, he would be seen as a fairly ordinary defenseman. So, he is you average 3rd line defenseman, and you state that Staal is ready to play on the 3rd pair next year, then why bring back Rozsival and not allow Staal a chance? Would you really miss the nightly obstruction penalty that Rozsival brings? Or the odd-man rush that results whenever Jagr does not pin the puck in the other zone?

I think you're missing the point a little bit. Currently we have: Malik, Tyutin, Kasparaitis, Ward, Rachunek, and Richter signed, with Roszival possibly on the way. That's 7 already, Staal would make 8. Unless he can really impress Renney at camp and earn a starting spot for each game, I'd rather see him back in the OHL than in one game, out the next.

The point isn't whether or not we would miss Rozsival. I think the majority of posters, myself included, would prefer that he did not return so as to make room for Staal. But management has been talking with him and it seems that most likely he'll be back.

I wouldn't be surprised if Sather/Maloney sees the situation as such: Staal has one more year of junior eligibility left, let's use it, and we'll work him in next year.

Otherwise, I find it really hard to explain some of the signings, such as Richter.

True Blue 07-07-2006 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njranger21 (Post 5952445)
I wouldn't be surprised if Sather/Maloney sees the situation as such: Staal has one more year of junior eligibility left, let's use it, and we'll work him in next year.

I understand that and agree that that is what management is probably thinking.
However, I am simply questioning it and answered the statement that was posed. The statement was:

I'm suprised that a lot of you guru's dont think he will play.

I responded to why he will not make the team. The discussion then branched out into the various little tangents.
The one thing that I will caveat is the thinking that he will suddenly have a place next year. When Rozsival is resigned, it will be to a multi-year deal. As such, you will have 5 defensemen on multi-year deals. If Rachunek plays well, he will be brought back. What that means is that on the most mediocre defense in the league and what is supposed to be a rebuilding team, a rookie will not have chance to break in not only this year, but next year as well. And that is disturbing.
Quote:

I think you're missing the point a little bit. Currently we have: Malik, Tyutin, Kasparaitis, Ward, Rachunek, and Richter signed, with Roszival possibly on the way. That's 7 already, Staal would make 8. Unless he can really impress Renney at camp and earn a starting spot for each game, I'd rather see him back in the OHL than in one game, out the next.
That's rather the point. If our roster is filled with a bunch of #4-6 defensemen, is it really too horrific if Stall was the #6 instead of a Rozsival or a Richter? I know that such an action will not happen. However, my point is that it should.
Quote:

The point isn't whether or not we would miss Rozsival. I think the majority of posters, myself included, would prefer that he did not return so as to make room for Staal. But management has been talking with him and it seems that most likely he'll be back.
We agree on both of those points.
Quote:

Otherwise, I find it really hard to explain some of the signings, such as Richter.
Actually, I am still baffled by it.

bigblue21 07-07-2006 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by True Blue (Post 5952526)
I understand that and agree that that is what management is probably thinking.
However, I am simply questioning it and answered the statement that was posed. The statement was:

I'm suprised that a lot of you guru's dont think he will play.

I responded to why he will not make the team. The discussion then branched out into the various little tangents.
The one thing that I will caveat is the thinking that he will suddenly have a place next year. When Rozsival is resigned, it will be to a multi-year deal. As such, you will have 5 defensemen on multi-year deals. If Rachunek plays well, he will be brought back. What that means is that on the most mediocre defense in the league and what is supposed to be a rebuilding team, a rookie will not have chance to break in not only this year, but next year as well. And that is disturbing.

That's rather the point. If our roster is filled with a bunch of #4-6 defensemen, is it really too horrific if Stall was the #6 instead of a Rozsival or a Richter? I know that such an action will not happen. However, my point is that it should.

We agree on both of those points.

Actually, I am still baffled by it.

Oh well, maybe some trade will be made to make room for Staal. We can always hope.


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