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-   -   Bob Gainey's drastic purge. (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=277034)

Pere Noel 08-01-2006 03:17 PM

Bob Gainey's drastic purge.
 
I recently had a peak at our roster for the previous season (2003-2004) and got curious as to whom Bob had let go, "lost", or traded.

As I made the count, I was astonished by the numbers : 67% of the players had been replaced within two seasons !

For the purpose of my calculations, I only counted players that had played 8 or more games in the 2003-2004 seasons. I found 20 players that are gone by now, and 10 remaining ones.

This came a bit a shock... and that drastic purge, ironically, contrasts severely with the constant critics of many, to the effect that Bob Gainey is not a "mover" and sits down and do nothing.

20 players that are gone:

1- Patrice Brisebois
2- Pierre Dagenais
3- Stephane Quintal
4- Andreas Dackell
5- Jim Dowd
6- Jan Bulis
7- Yanic Perreault
8- Richard Zednik
9- Donald Audette
10- Joe Juneau
11- Jason Ward
12- Niklas Sundstrom
13- Ron Hainsey
14- Chad Kilger
15- Gordie Dwyer
16- Karl Dykhuis
17- Darren Langdon
18- Marcel Hossa
19- Mathieu Garon
20- Jose Theodore

10 Players that are still here:

1- Alexei Kovalev
2- Saku Koivu
3- Mike Ribeiro
4- Michael Ryder
5- Steve Begin
6- Sheldon Souray
7- Mike Komisarek
8- Craig Rivet
9- Francis Bouillon
10- Andrei Markov

PS: Had Bob signed a UFA center, I suspect Ribeiro would have been gone as well. Just speculation from my part. That would have brought the number to 70% !

hab 08-01-2006 03:21 PM

NICE


there is absolutly NOBODY from that list of 20 worth taking a spot on this team
:clap:

habfan4 08-01-2006 03:21 PM

Despite the number of player moves (and outside of the Theodore trade) I wouldn't categorize the moves as either drastic or unexpected. The purge, IMO signals the end of the table scrap days for the Habs, when they had to content themselves with retreads and cast-offs from other teams.

RedArmyMontreal* 08-01-2006 03:24 PM

Out of all the players gone, there's not a single one that we got rid of that we can say it was a step backward.

Players on that list of course...

I think the sole big mistake we made was Beauchemin.

Pere Noel 08-01-2006 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by habfan4 (Post 6185722)
Despite the number of player moves (and outside of the Theodore trade) I wouldn't categorize the moves as either drastic or unexpected. The purge, IMO signals the end of the table scrap days for the Habs, when they had to content themselves with retreads and cast-offs from other teams.

I think drastic is a proper term... I agree with you that that the players were not the best of class that is for sure.... but Bob came on board, and basically wiped out the table of those players without second thought. That was drastically good :)

habfan4 08-01-2006 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pere Noel (Post 6185758)
I think drastic is a proper term... I agree with you that that the players were not the best of class that is for sure.... but Bob came on board, and basically wiped out the table of those players without second thought. That was drastically good :)

Drastically good, I can accept. :D

Bronn 08-01-2006 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedArmyMontreal (Post 6185751)
Out of all the players gone, there's not a single one that we got rid of that we can say it was a step backward.

Players on that list of course...

I think the sole big mistake we made was Beauchemin.

Out of the list i liked Ward , Dowd, Langdon, the Z Man (at some point) and Theo (at some point) but you're right that it was not a step backward to get rid of them.

As for the rest , i am simply glad that they are gone.

Snap Wilson 08-01-2006 03:32 PM

You may want to do the same comparison around the rest of the league. Anaheim only has eight players left from the end of 2004, seven if Vish gets traded. Boston, I think, only has three or four. Of the players that have their name on the Cup for the Lightning, only ten are still with the team, and one (Eric Perrin) is back after a year away from the league.

What Gainey has done isn't unusual, it's pretty much the new status quo.

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:32 PM

and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

Joey 08-01-2006 03:34 PM

great post. and of those 10 players, those are some of the most important players on the team, and the only one that looks out of place is Mike Ribeiro.

RedArmyMontreal* 08-01-2006 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185846)
and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

Most of them walked way, so it's not fair to only look at what gainey received in trades.

If you want to do that, you need to look what we added through the UFA market aswell.

And that includes Kovalev, Samsonov and Dandenault. Not sure if you want to include Johnson on that list.

benji 08-01-2006 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185846)
and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

Higgins
Perezhogin
Huet
Streit
Plekanec
Dandenault
Samsonov
Johnson

Plus a bunch of up and comers such as Kostitsyn, Lapierre, Ferland, O'Byrne, Grabovsky, etc.

It's not who Gainey has brought in in exchange for the guys lost, it's how he got them here. And he's done a better job than I could have wished for.

Add all these guys to the list of the 10 players who remain, and then pick which team is better.

TornACL 08-01-2006 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185846)
and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

...and Cristobal Huet

pavlako11 08-01-2006 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moneyp (Post 6185839)
You may want to do the same comparison around the rest of the league. Anaheim only has eight players left from the end of 2004, seven if Vish gets traded. Boston, I think, only has three or four. Of the players that have their name on the Cup for the Lightning, only ten are still with the team, and one (Eric Perrin) is back after a year away from the league.

What Gainey has done isn't unusual, it's pretty much the new status quo.

Two years ago Boston was 1st place in the division, now they're... well you know ;)

Anyone can revamp their team, the key is to improve while doing it, BG has shown us that he can do that.

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedArmyMontreal (Post 6185869)
Most of them walked way, so it's not fair to only look at what gainey received in trades.

If you want to do that, you need to look what we added through the UFA market aswell.

And that includes Kovalev, Samsonov and Dandenault. Not sure if you want to include Johnson on that list.

Kovy was already there, but you're right he got Dandenault... and Samsonov / M.Johnson this summer...

Most of the guys in the 20 list didn't have any value besides Theo anyway...

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TornACL (Post 6185885)
...and Cristobal Huet

Sorry forgot about Cristo !!! How could I...

habitforming 08-01-2006 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185846)
and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

. . . Give it up Rookie! Your such a motivator -- Get a life with a more thought out post will you !

:shakehead :shakehead

znk 08-01-2006 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185846)
and this is what he got back from those 20 guys:

David Aebischer (backup goalie)
Radek Bonk (4th line center)
Garth Murray (???)
That's it !!!

yeah Bob is a good mover...

Some times its not about what you get in return its about what the free roster spot allows you to do.
Just add Huet, Kovalev,Samsonov.

Under the new CBA you infact have to move players in return for nothing if you think it gives you the opportunity to get sign a new player. Example if you dont get rid of Theo's salary you possibly cant sign Samsonov. So in the end the trade could be looked at as Theo for Aebischer and Samsonov.

I suggest you give it some thought

Kirk Muller* 08-01-2006 03:43 PM

This level of turnover is quite common, especially over three seasons. There's nothing exceptional about it. You don't really notice it when it happens to other teams because teams usually keep their core players, but there's always of rotation of lower level players who are looking for jobs anywhere they can play.

The players can be broken down into a few categories:

Good players who needed to moved:
20- Jose Theodore
1- Patrice Brisebois

André Savard bandaids/busts:
3- Stephane Quintal
4- Andreas Dackell
7- Yanic Perreault
9- Donald Audette
10- Joe Juneau
12- Niklas Sundstrom
6- Jan Bulis
14- Chad Kilger
8- Richard Zednik

dime-a-dozen 4th liners
5- Jim Dowd
15- Gordie Dwyer
16- Karl Dykhuis
17- Darren Langdon
11- Jason Ward
2- Pierre Dagenais

Réjean Houle-era busts:
13- Ron Hainsey
18- Marcel Hossa
19- Mathieu Garon

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by benji (Post 6185880)
Higgins
Perezhogin
Huet
Streit
Plekanec
Dandenault
Samsonov
Johnson

Plus a bunch of up and comers such as Kostitsyn, Lapierre, Ferland, O'Byrne, Grabovsky, etc.

It's not who Gainey has brought in in exchange for the guys lost, it's how he got them here. And he's done a better job than I could have wished for.

Add all these guys to the list of the 10 players who remain, and then pick which team is better.

For sure this year's edition is going to be better but Higgins , Plekanec and Perezhogin were already in the system...

Anyway, Bobby had to clean the mess caused by A. Savard... So it's quite normal he didn't got much in return for the 20 clowns...

RedArmyMontreal* 08-01-2006 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185897)
Kovy was already there, but you're right he got Dandenault... and Samsonov / M.Johnson this summer...

Most of the guys in the 20 list didn't have any value besides Theo anyway...

We sorta only hired kovy for like 20 games, no one was certain he would resign with us, which is why I consider him as an UFA signing.

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by habitforming (Post 6185913)
. . . Give it up Rookie! Your such a motivator -- Get a life with a more thought out post will you !

:shakehead :shakehead

Well that post was constructive and informative :dunno:

Lalander977 08-01-2006 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by znk (Post 6185927)
Some times its not about what you get in return its about what the free roster spot allows you to do.
Just add Huet, Kovalev,Samsonov.

Under the new CBA you infact have to move players in return for nothing if you think it gives you the opportunity to get sign a new player. Example if you dont get rid of Theo's salary you possibly cant sign Samsonov. So in the end the trade could be looked at as Theo for Aebischer and Samsonov.

I suggest you give it some thought

Good points, like I said, Gainey HAD to clean the previous mistakes...

Azalichio 08-01-2006 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185897)
Kovy was already there, but you're right he got Dandenault... and Samsonov / M.Johnson this summer...

Most of the guys in the 20 list didn't have any value besides Theo anyway...

Gainey got Kovy by trading Balej..

edit : and he managed to sign him later as an UFA, which makes it even better.

loadie 08-01-2006 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lalander977 (Post 6185897)
Kovy was already there, but you're right he got Dandenault... and Samsonov / M.Johnson this summer...

Most of the guys in the 20 list didn't have any value besides Theo anyway...

Actually, Kovy wasn't already here. BG went out and got Kovy for Balej and a 2nd I believe.


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