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-   -   Big slump for Carey Price??? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=315248)

Whitesnake 11-25-2006 12:57 PM

Big slump for Carey Price???
 
It seems I'm the only one to worry but anybody knows what's going on with Price lately. He's been awful statswise, at least not playing like the great goalie we all think he is. Anybody saw him live lately????

Thanks.

CH Wizard 11-25-2006 12:59 PM

He never has shown consistency and I'm starting to be worried. He looked solid in pre-season games....and with a good coach it could help us forget it...but anyways a 5th overall pick should show consistency no matter what.

loudi94 11-25-2006 01:15 PM

He's sharing playing time with Pickard. Compared to the other goalies on other teams, he's not playing in the "easy" games that will pad his stats. While I would like to see him play more games, the stats mean little. He's easily going to be our #1 soon enough. Don't worry about him based on where he was drafted. If he was taken in the 2nd round when Lats was, we'd be all singing and dancing about him.
BTW how's everyone's darling Brule doing???

Whitesnake 11-25-2006 01:22 PM

He gave 3 goals and more in his last 9 games, having a Save % each time except twice. Yesterday, gave 5 goals on 27 shots. Sure he's been playing against top teams like Kamloops, Kootenay and Vancouver (4 games out of 9) but he's also been playing against average to poor teams like Chilliwack, Spokane and Calgary.

He's suppose to be one of the best and should rise to the occasion especially if he wants a shot at the World Juniors....But again, that's only stats that's why I hope some people who have seen him live during that "slump" could tell us how he's been...

Save %
He played Kamloops twice (top team) .914 / .852
Chilliwack twice (bad team) .864/.893
Spokane twice (average team) .857/.885
Kootenay once (great team) .889
Vancouver once (great team) .815
Calgary (average team) .919

Just wondering what's happenin....if something's happenin....I'm also afraid of his consistency, we keep hearing how strong he mentally is, know that he's got ALL the physical tools to succeed but again can't be consistent on a long period.

Little Nilan 11-25-2006 01:26 PM

He's 19 years old is what's wrong with him.

Whitesnake 11-25-2006 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loudi94 (Post 7168129)
He's sharing playing time with Pickard. Compared to the other goalies on other teams, he's not playing in the "easy" games that will pad his stats. While I would like to see him play more games, the stats mean little. He's easily going to be our #1 soon enough. Don't worry about him based on where he was drafted. If he was taken in the 2nd round when Lats was, we'd be all singing and dancing about him.
BTW how's everyone's darling Brule doing???

Seriously, I'm not even thinking of the rank. I'm dissapointed in Danis' performance and he wasn't even drafted.....Like I'm dissapointed in Lacasse's downfall.....though that was expected....

And it's not about Brule, Kopitar, Bourdon or anybody else....It was at one point, not anymore, time to move on. But I'm just true to myself, when we picked him after being shocked about the pick, I was afraid of his consistency and tendancy of giving bad goals at bad time. He had a great beginning of season but for whatever reason, he's having tons of trouble now. I wished he would've been traded to a contender to get his confidence going, hoped Slade's departure would give him a spot in Vancouver but I guessed he wouldn't play much with the other guy already there.

Let's hope he get things going once again, and be more consistent this time around.

Whitesnake 11-25-2006 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaded and Agrestic (Post 7168188)
He's 19 years old is what's wrong with him.

I understand that. My point was mainly to ask people who have seen it how he really plays, cause I understand stats says some but not all......But Irving is 18 and playing great though I understand his team is much better than Price's....

Would be interesting to see if Tri-City's coach comes back with Price against Irving tonight!!!!

TheHoser 11-25-2006 01:47 PM

Who cares. Getting shelled in junoir isn't a bad thing, it teaches a goalie to deal with bad games and bad goals and makes them compete harder to better themselves.

Duster 11-25-2006 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whitesnake (Post 7168244)
I understand that. My point was mainly to ask people who have seen it how he really plays, cause I understand stats says some but not all......But Irving is 18 and playing great though I understand his team is much better than Price's....

Would be interesting to see if Tri-City's coach comes back with Price against Irving tonight!!!!

It's a natural. And what a game it should be. Both goalies will be busy. Everett plays a disciplined style of hockey, imo, while Tri City has a pretty good offense led by Yellow Horn.

Dr_Hook 11-25-2006 02:13 PM

I too am pretty disappointed with his stats; not necessaraly the brut numbers, but the fact that he is behind his back-up for GAA and save%, which is a little disturbing to say the least. The strenght of the opposing team, well I guess it could explain a little but still...

I wasn't a fan of that pick and still am not. I want to be convinced though; I'm hoping for a very strong showing at WJC to erase the doubts that are creeping in my mind...:(

mabus 11-25-2006 02:46 PM

GAA Wins Losses
6.26 13 35
4.44 29 29
5.55 16 25
Carey Price? nope ... these are Patrick Roy's stats in juniors.
Let's relax, he's a 19 year old kid playing on a weak team in the minors. The stats mean very little at this level.

Cyrrus147 11-25-2006 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mabus (Post 7168719)
GAA Wins Losses
6.26 13 35
4.44 29 29
5.55 16 25
Carey Price? nope ... these are Patrick Roy's stats in juniors.
Let's relax, he's a 19 year old kid playing on a weak team in the minors. The stats mean very little at this level.

That was what I was about to post. Patrick Roy had awful stats in the junior. Price has so many upside that I am sure that he will become better once he will start working with Roland Melanson.

Cristobal Huet had a 86% save percentage in 4 games in the AHL last year...so I guess we can wait before pushing the panic button.

LeMAD 11-25-2006 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyrrus147 (Post 7168747)
so I guess we can wait before pushing the panic button.

Yeah, but people are already pushing the "franchise goalie" button...

Le Tricolore 11-25-2006 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaded and Agrestic (Post 7168188)
He's 19 years old is what's wrong with him.

We should get one of our coaches to fix that.

tinyzombies 11-25-2006 04:38 PM

I'm not interested in statistics for goalies when it comes to the juniors or the minor leagues, as long as he's playing his game. Numbers don't necessarily reflect how goalies are playing, especially in those leagues.

From what I've seen of him in person, he's big and quick. Besides, Melanson knows what he's doing, obviously.

Montreal Typical 11-25-2006 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whitesnake (Post 7168244)
Would be interesting to see if Tri-City's coach comes back with Price against Irving tonight!!!!

I doubt he will. It would be a third game in three nights for him, that's just too much.

Dr_Hook 11-25-2006 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMAD (Post 7169148)
Yeah, but people are already pushing the "franchise goalie" button...

Good call ! :clap:

Besides being drafted real (too?) high, what has he done to warrant that title ? A lot of so-called franchise-goaltender became that without any hype preceeding them; yet in Price case, the franchise tag has been put on him since the day he's been drafted. And the doubters are said to be "panicking"; there's no panic, I just refuse to be over-enthused by the hypers...

To put it ala Larry David, Curb your enthusiasm people

Blind Gardien 11-25-2006 05:13 PM

Posting Patrick Roy's stats is pointless. The whole purpose of Whitesnake's thread is to find out the story *behind* the stats from anybody who has seen Price recently. Good goalies (usually on bad teams) can have bad stats, sure. That's where the Roy example comes in. Bad goalies (on really good teams) can have great stats too. And in Price's case... what about mediocre stats on an average team? Who knows? It's beside the point. I'm wondering how Price has been playing too.

Even before we drafted him, I came away thoroughly unimpressed from the WU-18. That dampened my spirits on him when he was announced as our pick, of course. Subsequently, many of us haven't seen a lot. Some people say he deserved a spot on last year's WJC team, but that optionalpractisegate did him in. But my vague recollection is that he wasn't exactly putting up a wall in the camp either (3 goalies basically flopped, only 1 played well). We give him good reviews on his NHL exhibition games in general. Although that's a very small sampling. I was no more impressed from the Prospects Tourney than I was at the WU-18 overall. Some brilliancy followed by some mediocrity. We'll see him against the sub-par Russian squad next week. We'll get some WJC camp stories. Sportsnet has a Tri-City game on its CHL sked this year (Jan.23 vs. Vancouver), so maybe we'll get that chance too.

Generally speaking, it's a spotty record for a #5 overall pick, I'd say. I'm thinking I've seen him around 10 times now myself, but nothing since camp. I too would like to hear something more about his play, beyond what just looking at his stats can tell us. And definitely more than what looking at Patrick Roy's stats can tell us.

Whitesnake 11-25-2006 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blind Gardien (Post 7169665)
Posting Patrick Roy's stats is pointless. The whole purpose of Whitesnake's thread is to find out the story *behind* the stats from anybody who has seen Price recently.

That's exactly it BG. Nor was I too enthusiastic, nor am I panicking, I'm just asking.

Besides, we know we would see 5 threads an hour if Price had Irving's kind of stats even though that would mean Price would be playing for a top team or would receive 10 shots a game.....

For whoever asks about Price's and Pickard's opponents, here's the stats:

Price: 10W 6L, Save % = 0.903 G.A.A. = 2.84
Opponents he played against, combined wins and losses of : 208W,150L

Pickard: 6W 2L, Save % = 0.912 G.A.A. = 2.49
Opponents he played against, combined wins and losses of : 94W,93L

So first Pickard played half the number of games Price played. And he did play against weaker opponents.

But again, I couldn't care less about him, I'm interested in Price and ONLY is interested in his development and how he really plays besides the numbers....

le_sean 11-25-2006 06:09 PM

What people might forget is that the point of a draft is to pick a player based on potential. Carey Price has all the tools to be a great goaltender. Roberto Luongo was picked at #4 overall even though he didn't have the greatest stats in juniors (3.10 GAA and .902 SVP), but he was still picked high. The fact of the matter is none of us are professional scouts, we don't know how they think.

Who else did you want us to draft? Brule? Another undersized centreman who is also a primadonna. Skille, Setoguchi? Both RW's who we have an abundance of in our system. Lee, Bourdon? Hardly worthy of a Top-5 pick, as Lee is just a project and Bourdon has defensive braincramps every game. Kopitar? From a country that has never produced a player before, and yes this is important (if you had two players, both of equal skill, but one was from Canada and the other from Zimbabwe, who would you pick? It makes a difference).

Price is a goalie with amazing mechanics and is always prepared mentally, and he was only 17 when we drafted him, the goalie with the best potential since Fleury in 2003. This is combined with the fact that both Ottawa and Toronto had a need for a goalie, and Ottawa had the 10th pick, where Price would go. So would you rather us have Price or the Sens? It only made sense to pick him, Gainey and co. are not stupid. I love the pick, but I also would have loved Skille.

Blind Gardien 11-25-2006 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le_sean (Post 7170090)
What people might forget is that the point of a draft is to pick a player based on potential.

To be fair, I don't think many people forget it. It's independent from wanting to know how he's playing right now and evaluating the product we see in the present, even if it's an unfinished product. We know that. We hope it might help us gain insight on the potential, that's all.
Quote:

Who else did you want us to draft? Brule? Another undersized centreman who is also a primadonna. Skille, Setoguchi? Both RW's who we have an abundance of in our system. Lee, Bourdon? Hardly worthy of a Top-5 pick, as Lee is just a project and Bourdon has defensive braincramps every game. Kopitar? From a country that has never produced a player before, and yes this is important (if you had two players, both of equal skill, but one was from Canada and the other from Zimbabwe, who would you pick? It makes a difference).
This is the standard divergence in any Price thread. Personally, I think I'd take any of the above over Price right now. Maybe not Lee. At the time, Brule was my choice. Still would be. Agreed that it means nothing, however, but you put the question out there. :)
Quote:

Price is a goalie with amazing mechanics and is always prepared mentally, and he was only 17 when we drafted him, the goalie with the best potential since Fleury in 2003. This is combined with the fact that both Ottawa and Toronto had a need for a goalie, and Ottawa had the 10th pick, where Price would go. So would you rather us have Price or the Sens? It only made sense to pick him, Gainey and co. are not stupid. I love the pick, but I also would have loved Skille.
I'd rather the Sens had Price, personally. But I also agree that Gainey and co are not stupid, and by stating my personal perspective I don't mean to imply that I put any faith in it. I see what I see, but hopefully I see all the wrong things! (And fwiw, despite what we always hear about his great mental prowess, one of the things I get from watching him is that he actually seems to lose focus at times and it always strikes me as that plus the inconsistency issues would seem to fly in the face of this reputation he has for being so mentally strong.)

Anyway, again that comes back to the whole point of Whitesnake's thread... to get more actual game observation stories about Price, and here I am contributing once again to the same ol' same ol' premature draft hindsighting. Sorry! :dunce:

Little Nilan 11-25-2006 06:48 PM

Habs fan should learn to look at prospects every 5 months instead of every 5 minutes. Am I the only one who doesn't really care what happens to Price in juniors? I'll reserve judgement to when he gets to pro hockey, if he ever gets there.

Montreal Typical 11-25-2006 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaded and Agrestic (Post 7170387)
if he ever gets there.

Unless he suffers a career ending injury, he'll get there next season.

Mr. Hab 11-26-2006 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le_sean (Post 7170090)
What people might forget is that the point of a draft is to pick a player based on potential. Carey Price has all the tools to be a great goaltender. Roberto Luongo was picked at #4 overall even though he didn't have the greatest stats in juniors (3.10 GAA and .902 SVP), but he was still picked high. The fact of the matter is none of us are professional scouts, we don't know how they think.

Who else did you want us to draft? Brule? Another undersized centreman who is also a primadonna. Skille, Setoguchi? Both RW's who we have an abundance of in our system. Lee, Bourdon? Hardly worthy of a Top-5 pick, as Lee is just a project and Bourdon has defensive braincramps every game. Kopitar? From a country that has never produced a player before, and yes this is important (if you had two players, both of equal skill, but one was from Canada and the other from Zimbabwe, who would you pick? It makes a difference).

Price is a goalie with amazing mechanics and is always prepared mentally, and he was only 17 when we drafted him, the goalie with the best potential since Fleury in 2003. This is combined with the fact that both Ottawa and Toronto had a need for a goalie, and Ottawa had the 10th pick, where Price would go. So would you rather us have Price or the Sens? It only made sense to pick him, Gainey and co. are not stupid. I love the pick, but I also would have loved Skille.

Great post:clap: :clap:

Price looked awesome during training camp. I'm looking forward to next year's summer camp, as well. Price should be in the AHL next season (& should be with the Habs sooner than later).

p.s.: our stock is high in the "most important position" department (goalies). Huet, Aebischer, Danis, Halak, Price...

gars59 11-26-2006 07:51 AM

http://whl.ca/en/stats/game-summary.php?game_id=1002179

Carey price 14 save in 15 shoot
Irving 28 save in 31 shoot

:yo: :yo: :yo: :yo:


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