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-   -   Based on statistics so far, is aebischer a contender for the vezina? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=32465)

DRL 12-01-2003 09:38 AM

Based on statistics so far, is aebischer a contender for the vezina?
 
his stats so far are great, his play seems to be improving, is he going to keep it up? who knows.

is he a vezina candidate?

why or why not?

Biggest Canuck Fan 12-01-2003 09:41 AM

I can't see why not. I would be shocked if he kept this up, but for certain he is one of the seasons early suprises. Everyone thought it would be the big 6.. instead it's Tanguay, Abby, and the Defence.

Ol' Dirty Chinaman* 12-01-2003 09:42 AM

No.

Dr Love 12-01-2003 09:43 AM

Not at all. Aside from wins, his stats are very pedestrian. 20th in GAA, 12th in save % (I excluded goalies with less than 10 games played). Let me ask you this: is Chris Osgood a Vezina candidate? His numbers are comparable or better.

Foppa 12-01-2003 09:45 AM

20th in GAA and 12th in SV% among guys with at least 10 starts?

Those aren't 'great' stats...good maybe, and he's been getting better, but even on numbers alone, he's not a worthy candidate.

And when you consider he has still yet to show the ability to absolutely steal stretches of wins for longer periods of time...there is no way.

The VEGASKING 12-01-2003 09:47 AM

Other than wins what stat is so impressive? 22nd in GAA and 15th in SV% among goalies that have played enough games to qualify.

Edit: Well crap beat to the punch.

Goulet17 12-01-2003 10:11 AM

If a 2.29 GAA and .919 SA are pedestrian we've officially reached the apex of the dead puck era in the NHL, or it may very well be the first sign of the apocalypse.

Reign Nateo 12-01-2003 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goulet17
If a 2.29 GAA and .919 SA are pedestrian we've officially reached the apex of the dead puck era in the NHL, or it may very well be the first sign of the apocalypse.

I remember whe .335 and .875 were good numbers! :p

Dr Love 12-01-2003 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goulet17
If a 2.29 GAA and .919 SA are pedestrian we've officially reached the apex of the dead puck era in the NHL, or it may very well be the first sign of the apocalypse.

Those numbers are in the middle third among starting goaltenders. Thus, pedestrian.

Belgian Fan 12-01-2003 10:18 AM

No, Aebischer's been 'solid', but nothing like 'good' or even 'great'.

He's yet to steal games for us this season (even though he's been better as of late). There are more than five goalies that should go in front of him at this stage....

Mr. Canucklehead 12-01-2003 10:29 AM

Is Dan Cloutier a Vezina candidate?

Same answer: No.

~Canucklehead~

AllIsFehrNLoveAndWar 12-01-2003 10:45 AM

Marty Brodeur is 1.63 .928 12 wins and 4 shutouts. I think hes running away with it right now.

Owen Wilson 12-01-2003 11:13 AM

He hasn't beaten a top team yet.

Opponent Result GS MIN W L T EGA GA GAA SA SV SV% SO

NJD T 1-1 1 65 0 0 1 0 1 0.92 28 27 .964 0
EDM W 4-1 1 60 1 0 0 0 1 1.00 41 40 .976 0
CGY W 6-5 1 62 1 0 0 0 5 4.81 32 27 .844 0
LOS L 0-2 1 59 0 1 0 0 2 2.05 25 23 .920 0
NYR W 4-3 1 60 1 0 0 0 3 3.00 34 31 .912 0
ANA W 2-1 1 63 1 0 0 0 1 0.95 25 24 .960 0
DAL W 3-0 1 60 1 0 0 0 0 0.00 29 29 1.000 1
SAN W 4-3 1 60 1 0 0 0 3 3.00 29 26 .897 0
CHI W 4-3 1 65 1 0 0 0 3 2.77 27 24 .889 0
MIN T 4-4 1 40 0 0 0 0 4 6.00 14 10 .714 0
NYR W 3-2 1 61 1 0 0 0 2 1.96 24 22 .917 0
NJD L 3-4 1 59 0 1 0 0 4 4.09 31 27 .871 0
CGY W 4-2 1 60 1 0 0 0 2 2.00 28 26 .929 0
NAS W 5-3 1 60 1 0 0 0 3 3.00 19 16 .842 0
EDM W 6-1 1 60 1 0 0 0 1 1.00 34 33 .971 0
BOS L 1-4 1 60 0 1 0 0 4 4.03 34 30 .882 0
MIN W 5-2 1 60 1 0 0 0 2 2.00 23 21 .913 0
STL L 1-2 1 58 0 1 0 0 2 2.07 26 24 .923 0
Oct 10 CHI W 5-0

st_roland 12-01-2003 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goulet17
If a 2.29 GAA and .919 SA are pedestrian we've officially reached the apex of the dead puck era in the NHL


The apex? I wish...its going to get worse.

st_roland 12-01-2003 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRL
his stats so far are great, his play seems to be improving, is he going to keep it up? who knows.

is he a vezina candidate?

why or why not?


Aebi is no Vezina contender, but hes playing better than I and a lot of other people expected.

PecaFan 12-01-2003 03:00 PM

Hmm, what happened to all those "all that matters is wins, baby!" posters? The ones justifying Brodeur's Vezina last year based on wins, even though he had less than stellar other stats?

I sense a double standard.

Dr Love 12-01-2003 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PecaFan
Hmm, what happened to all those "all that matters is wins, baby!" posters? The ones justifying Brodeur's Vezina last year based on wins, even though he had less than stellar other stats?

I sense a double standard.

1) His GAA is better.

2) As a couple of Avs fans have stated, he hasn't stolen any games yet. He's winning, but he's not winning. Big difference.

3) The title of the thread was "based on statistics" and based on statistics, he isn't.

NJD Jester 12-01-2003 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PecaFan
Hmm, what happened to all those "all that matters is wins, baby!" posters? The ones justifying Brodeur's Vezina last year based on wins, even though he had less than stellar other stats?

I sense a double standard.

If Aebischer finishes with a 2.02 GAA, 41 wins and nine shutouts in 73 games, and then no one gives him his due, cry "double standard" all you want. Brodeur's Vezina was overdue.

<JESTER>

NJD Jester 12-01-2003 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRL
his stats so far are great, his play seems to be improving, is he going to keep it up? who knows.

is he a vezina candidate?

Sure...

...and so is Roberto Luongo (2.29 GAA, .931 save percentage), who has comparable numbers to Aebischer this season, save for wins. Are you saying the Vezina should simply go to the most successful goalie via wins and losses? If so, are you polishing it for Chokemanek yet?

<JESTER>

DRL 12-02-2003 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJD Jester
Sure...

...and so is Roberto Luongo (2.29 GAA, .931 save percentage), who has comparable numbers to Aebischer this season, save for wins. Are you saying the Vezina should simply go to the most successful goalie via wins and losses? If so, are you polishing it for Chokemanek yet?

<JESTER>

not saying anything at all, just asking a simple question.

btw marty is the hands down winner so far ;)

and i dont see why cloutier can't be considered a candidate at this point in the season either :dunno:

golfmade 12-02-2003 10:39 AM

So far, no.

wazee 12-02-2003 11:19 AM

No. Aebischer has been a very average goalie this year.

Which is the reason DRL keeps starting trade proposals for goalies on the Trades and Rumors board.

Freudian 12-02-2003 11:31 AM

What is funny is that all those who complained about Aebischer before this season always pointed out that he had more losses than wins last season (while never discussing his GAA and Sv% since it was obvious losses was the "weak" stat for him last year). And now when he leads the NHL in wins that people are only talking about GAA and Sv%. Statistical cherry picking at its finest:)

As for the original topic. No. I don't think he has been even close to a Vezina calibre goalkeeer this season. He and his team have done well getting the wins they have considering the injury problems, but Aebischer hasn't shown much of an ability to steal games and they haven't met that tough opposition this far. He has to improve quite a bit to have a chance of hardware. But it is encouraging for him to lead the league in wins. He has not even been close to crashing and burning, like the most rabid Avs haters claimed he would.

PecaFan 12-02-2003 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Love
1) His GAA is better.

2) As a couple of Avs fans have stated, he hasn't stolen any games yet. He's winning, but he's not winning. Big difference.

3) The title of the thread was "based on statistics" and based on statistics, he isn't.

1) Who cares? GAA and SP are irrelevant last year as Brodeur had numerous folks above him last year (according to the 'Just Win, Baby' Folks)
2) Ah, so those wins of his don't count. Impressive debating technique.
3) I see, Wins suddenly aren't statistics? Again, not according to the JWB folks, it was the most important stat last year.

It's still a double standard. The league leader in wins isn't even a candidate for the Vezina? Anybody who defended Brodeur last year should be defending Aebischer this year.

meehan 12-02-2003 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PecaFan
1) Who cares? GAA and SP are irrelevant last year as Brodeur had numerous folks above him last year (according to the 'Just Win, Baby' Folks)
2) Ah, so those wins of his don't count. Impressive debating technique.
3) I see, Wins suddenly aren't statistics? Again, not according to the JWB folks, it was the most important stat last year.

It's still a double standard. The league leader in wins isn't even a candidate for the Vezina? Anybody who defended Brodeur last year should be defending Aebischer this year.

The difference is that the Devils win/won because of defense and goaltending while the Avalanche win because they have the best collection of offensive talent in the game. That said, Aebischer has played very well, at least in the Avalanche games I saw. If he continues to have the numbers he has now and continues to win at the rate he does now he should be a Vezina candidate at the end of the year; however now is too early to hand out Vezinas.

Let me also add that that you anti Brodeur people should really drop the excessive whining. Brodeur is the best, he won the vezina last year, he will probably win it again this year, and there really isn't anything you can do about it. So please, stop the whining, it gets old.


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