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-   -   If we don't make the playoffs..... (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=340840)

alkurtz 02-05-2007 10:59 AM

If we don't make the playoffs.....
 
Let's look at some scenarios for 07-08 if we don't make the playoffs.
Is Sather back?
If we wants to return, there is a 95% chance Dolan will have him back
If he retires or is fired who replaces him? If he retires, likely Don Maloney, if he is fired.
perhaps Messier
Is Renney back?
If Sather or Maloney is GM, a 95% likely hood
If there is a new GM (Mess or someone else), no. Who would Mess hire as a coach or
would he be GM/Coach
Will the team change direction and go for younger players?
Likely not if Jags/Straka/Nylander return
What young players may make the team? Dawes (50%). Staal (75%), Callahan (50%),
Dubinsky (50%), Baranka (50%), Korpokoski (25%), Byers (25%), Moore (25%),
Immonen (25%)
Type of free agents pursued: 2nd line center, 2nd pair D
Goalie situation: Weekes leaves (100%), Montoya makes the team (75%)

EventHorizon 02-05-2007 11:00 AM

I think it's more like a 100% chance on Sather's return.

HockeyBasedNYC 02-05-2007 11:20 AM

I dont even want to think about this. When the Rangers have lost their 3rd straight home game vs. Montreal on the 27th, thats when ill be forced to.

dave4 02-05-2007 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alkurtz (Post 7923363)
Let's look at some scenarios for 07-08 if we don't make the playoffs.
Is Sather back?
If we wants to return, there is a 95% chance Dolan will have him back
If he retires or is fired who replaces him? If he retires, likely Don Maloney, if he is fired.
perhaps Messier
Is Renney back?
If Sather or Maloney is GM, a 95% likely hood
If there is a new GM (Mess or someone else), no. Who would Mess hire as a coach or
would he be GM/Coach
Will the team change direction and go for younger players?
Likely not if Jags/Straka/Nylander return
What young players may make the team? Dawes (50%). Staal (75%), Callahan (50%),
Dubinsky (50%), Baranka (50%), Korpokoski (25%), Byers (25%), Moore (25%),
Immonen (25%)
Type of free agents pursued: 2nd line center, 2nd pair D
Goalie situation: Weekes leaves (100%), Montoya makes the team (75%)

100% chance Sather wants to come back...why would he leave? Why would he give up one of the easiest jobs in all of sports? He doesn't have to answer to anyone, doesn't have to talk to the press, doesn't care what the fans say...and Dolan loves him. He'll be here another 5-10 years at least.

Renney is back as long as the team keeps up it's current trend of losing a lot and then winning just enough to make it look like the team can compete for something and he's doing a good job. Coaching will continue to be a problem whether Renney is back or not, because Sather has proven he has no clue how to hire a good coach. So if Renney is out, you can be sure someone just as bad will come in.

No way the team changes direction. See above. And with Jagr, Shanahan, etc. hanging around there will continue to be a 'go for it now, you never know what can happen when you make the playoffs' mentality. For another 5-10 years at least.

No idea which young guys might make the team, Renney seems to have had two completely different philosophies in the two years he's coached here. Last year he played and trusted rookies, this year he doesn't. Or is Sather making that call? No idea, nobody ever gets a chance to ask him.

He will go after free agents for sure. Not sure if they'll be the right free agents, or guys like Matt Cullen who looked better on another team, but he'll go after them.

HenrikO'doyle 02-05-2007 11:37 AM

Sather wants to be back and with Dolan around he will be let back in. Unfortunately Sather can do whatever he wants and he doesnt have to worry about suffering the consequences. Renney will also probably be back and if he isnt I still think Sather will hire another incompetent coach. It really comes down to Dolan, as long as hes around dont expect anything too good to happen with the Rangers or the Knicks.

Shadowtron 02-05-2007 11:48 AM

This is what I call the Rangers Viscious Circle. We'll miss the playoffs, but be on the doorstep. So we'll draft a project player mid-round. Then, when July 1st comes we'll re-up the roster because "we were so close last time. Only a player or two away". Slats will go out and get players to fill holes, but not necessarily fit the puzzle. For instance, getting a 2nd line center for Shanny (assuming he comes back) despite their uncomplementary playing styles. Because, as always, the Dolans know that it's the name that fills seats, not their ability to fit inside a team concept. And come 07-08, the Rangers will continue to be a patchwork team with Renney, the lapdog coach, taking his orders from Jagr.

94now 02-05-2007 11:49 AM

I think Sather will hire a new GM. That new guy will or will not fire Renney and will also be doing all the things the GM is supposed to do, like trades, for instance, or other things that Sather is no longer able to do.
Sather's job would be to explain to Dolan what is going on.

SingnBluesOnBroadway 02-05-2007 11:50 AM

If Sather wants to return he will return. If Sather returns, Renney will be the coach.

RangersFan 02-05-2007 11:54 AM

count on Sather and Renney being back regardless of how out of the playoffs the Rangers finish. Last year's playoff berth bought Sather at least another decade to build another first round exit team.

dave4 02-05-2007 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway (Post 7923851)
If Sather wants to return he will return. If Sather returns, Renney will be the coach.

Why wouldn't Sather return? He gets paid big bucks and has nobody to answer to. No accountablity. Seems to be a constant theme running throughout the organization.

94now 02-05-2007 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave4 (Post 7924734)
Why wouldn't Sather return? He gets paid big bucks and has nobody to answer to. No accountablity. Seems to be a constant theme running throughout the organization.

Dolan sets the standard for accountability around this place.

dumpsathernow* 02-05-2007 01:18 PM

They aren't making the playoffs. That's number one. Second, there is 0.00% chance Renney will be back if that happens. He's a terrible coach. He has no clue or desire to rebuild. His line combo's are idiotic. Some guy told me that Renney and Maloney do not get along from a source he heard. That Maloney wants Renney to use kids from the farm system. Don't know if that is true. There is no proof of that. It's one of those stories you hear and you can't believe or dismiss. However, considering how proud Maloney and Sather were of their draft picks. I seriously doubt they are pleased at the scrubs Renney continues to use instead of using their prospects.

Sather isn't going anywhere. Dolan loves him. Maloney will be the next GM. Sadly, whether Maloney is a good GM or not. The fact this team will have Lundqvist, Tyutin, Staal and Baranka on the backend will probably keep any GM we have safe for the most part.

Edge 02-05-2007 01:18 PM

Unless there is a collapse I don't see anyone going anywhere.

No matter what, I see some changes coming in the offseason. I think the Rangers are at a point where they can start looking at possible trades and I think they also go out and sign a player or two as well.

As for draft position, the burden is on the scouts. When we look back at the last 10 years we see team's picking lower than us in the first round getting very good players. To me draft position is less important that actually finding the talent.

Picking 5th overall is nothing if you don't end up with a player.

g52* 02-05-2007 01:19 PM

Sather will be back, Dolan will be back, maybe Renney.

Team will miss the playoffs again, Jagr/Straka/Nylander will be back.

Edge 02-05-2007 01:22 PM

What really bothers me about this season is that I feel we've really wasted GREAT efforts by 4 guys.

dumpsathernow* 02-05-2007 01:26 PM

Nobody should be surprised. Not one kid made the team and stuck. The way they treated Dawes was a disgrace and showed exactly why this organization is a joke. I think idiot Renney played him one game with a real offensive player in Nylander vs. Toronto and he scored.

IMO, Hollweg, Hossa and J. Ward are not NHL players. Hollweg needs AHL to try and develop his talent. Hossa and J. Ward had their chances and have proved they stink. On defense, Rachunek is awful. Malik is a Cone.

Before here, Renney was given one coaching job for one year. There is a reason for that. He's stupid. I have no doubt he will be fired.

Bluenote13 02-05-2007 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutboy (Post 7924913)
Nobody should be surprised. Not one kid made the team and stuck. The way they treated Dawes was a disgrace and showed exactly why this organization is a joke. I think idiot Renney played him one game with a real offensive player in Nylander vs. Toronto and he scored.

IMO, Hollweg, Hossa and J. Ward are not NHL players. Hollweg needs AHL to try and develop his talent. Hossa and J. Ward had their chances and have proved they stink. On defense, Rachunek is awful. Malik is a Cone.

Before here, Renney was given one coaching job for one year. There is a reason for that. He's stupid. I have no doubt he will be fired.

Who is this? Gotta be a regular under his 'code' name ;)

GarretJoseph* 02-05-2007 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutboy (Post 7924913)
Nobody should be surprised. Not one kid made the team and stuck. The way they treated Dawes was a disgrace and showed exactly why this organization is a joke. I think idiot Renney played him one game with a real offensive player in Nylander vs. Toronto and he scored.

IMO, Hollweg, Hossa and J. Ward are not NHL players. Hollweg needs AHL to try and develop his talent. Hossa and J. Ward had their chances and have proved they stink. On defense, Rachunek is awful. Malik is a Cone.

Before here, Renney was given one coaching job for one year. There is a reason for that. He's stupid. I have no doubt he will be fired.


Do you even support the NYR?

dumpsathernow* 02-05-2007 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluenote13 (Post 7924972)
Who is this? Gotta be a regular under his 'code' name ;)


I speak the truth my friend. Not a regular. A newbie.

Bluenote13 02-05-2007 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutboy (Post 7925041)
I speak the truth my friend. Not a regular. A newbie.

Sorry my mistake. Welcome :moose:

You sound like your very upset, and since you're new at posting around here i'd say sit back and read a bit before your emotions get the best of you. Afterall, you do want to make a nice first impression with your new friends :teach:

CM Lundqvist 02-05-2007 01:55 PM

I agree with donut, sadly.

The coaching has been such a joke that's it not even funny. Think about it... Renney has held NO ONE accountable for anything. Jagr and Shanny have taken a countless number of dumb, lazy, hooking penalties, and they've never been benched. Nylander accidently high sticks someone in a 1-0 game with more than enough time left, and he gets benched. Malik and Rozsival have made a countless number of bad passes through the middle, Rozsival's pass to Kolnik being the WORST I'VE EVER SEEN - INCLUDING Bozo's bad giveaway to Gagne last year - and doesn't get benched. Pock makes a bad giveaway to Sundin, and it's healthy scratch time.

This guy is the biggest horse's ass I've ever seen. You people don't ever wonder why he hadn't coached in the NHL since 1997 before coming here? Does the fact that he never played an ounce of hockey in either major junior, AHL, or NHL not strike you people one bit? Does the fact that he has no clue of what line matchups are not irk you? Does the fact that he has no plan B for when guys like Jagr and Shanny can't score not puzzle you at all?

All I know is that good coaches know how to get it done when everything doesn't go accordingly. Good coaches can motivate players, and bring them together when it's needed. So far, Renney hasn't show any of those qualities to me, and if you're watching the same thing I'm watching, which I hope we all are, he hasn't shown it to you either. He had the underdog bit last year early on, but that went away. Now, the onus is on him.

dave4 02-05-2007 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GretzNYR99 (Post 7925245)
I agree with donut, sadly.

The coaching has been such a joke that's it not even funny. Think about it... Renney has held NO ONE accountable for anything. Jagr and Shanny have taken a countless number of dumb, lazy, hooking penalties, and they've never been benched. Nylander accidently high sticks someone in a 1-0 game with more than enough time left, and he gets benched. Malik and Rozsival have made a countless number of bad passes through the middle, Rozsival's pass to Kolnik being the WORST I'VE EVER SEEN - INCLUDING Bozo's bad giveaway to Gagne last year - and doesn't get benched. Pock makes a bad giveaway to Sundin, and it's healthy scratch time.

This guy is the biggest horse's ass I've ever seen. You people don't ever wonder why he hadn't coached in the NHL since 1997 before coming here? Does the fact that he never played an ounce of hockey in either major junior, AHL, or NHL not strike you people one bit? Does the fact that he has no clue of what line matchups are not irk you? Does the fact that he has no plan B for when guys like Jagr and Shanny can't score not puzzle you at all?

All I know is that good coaches know how to get it done when everything doesn't go accordingly. Good coaches can motivate players, and bring them together when it's needed. So far, Renney hasn't show any of those qualities to me, and if you're watching the same thing I'm watching, which I hope we all are, he hasn't shown it to you either. He had the underdog bit last year early on, but that went away. Now, the onus is on him.

Agreed. Renney has no hockey sense. I think he spends a lot of time going over lines and things like that before the game, but when it doesn't all go perfectly in a game he has no idea how to adjust.

His motivational skills do have to come into question as well. Too often the team is not ready to play hard.

94now 02-05-2007 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edge (Post 7924875)
What really bothers me about this season is that I feel we've really wasted GREAT efforts by 4 guys.

You're right in the sense that should they get help they deserved and never did, the results would be much more to our liking. But they did not wasted their effort. Similarly The Czech Line, The FLY line and others allowed Rangers fans to have some good memories about numerous completely wasted seasons in the past.

dumpsathernow* 02-05-2007 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluenote13 (Post 7925103)
Sorry my mistake. Welcome :moose:

You sound like your very upset, and since you're new at posting around here i'd say sit back and read a bit before your emotions get the best of you. Afterall, you do want to make a nice first impression with your new friends :teach:

Upset doesn't cover it. I figured, the only way they could get dumber than before where they tried to buy the playoffs was to actually draft lots of good prospects and not play them. They have done it. They have managed to become dumber than before.

Sadly, we have some fans that think the reason the kids aren't here is because they aren't ready or good enough. Sorry, I don't buy that. Look at all the players we have making the WJC's teams. Parise had 11 points in the WJC. Same year Dawes had 11 points. Dawes had 2 G 1 A in the final game while Parise did nothing. Both had very good rookie AHL years. Parise is playing his second NHL season. Dawes is rotting in the minors. That is the difference between our Rangers and NJ. One organization is smart. The other is stupid.

Bluenote13 02-05-2007 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94now (Post 7925294)
You're right in the sense that should they get help they deserved and never did, the results would be much more to our liking. But they did not wasted their effort. Similarly The Czech Line, The FLY line and others allowed Rangers fans to have some good memories about numerous completely wasted seasons in the past.

Look at our history, it goes back alot further.


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