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sluggo* 12-27-2003 11:12 AM

Igilna avaible?
 
I've heard rumors that the Flames want to move Igilna before the trade deadline, not based on his play but just because of his contract. Are these rumors true?

kruezer 12-27-2003 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
I've heard rumors that the Flames want to move Igilna before the trade deadline, not based on his play but just because of his contract. Are these rumors true?

I'm not sure if they are true, but they sure keep popping up which probably isn't a good sign.

nucks2001 12-27-2003 04:08 PM

I hope the Flames hang onto him through the end of the season unless a playoff spot is gone. That being said, I don't see Iginla in a Flames jersey next year because he'll have to be qualified too high.

sluggo* 12-27-2003 04:16 PM

That being said, what doy ou guys think it would take for the Leafs to get Igilna out of Calgary if he is put on the trading block? Kaberle and Steen? Steen and a first rounder? Tucker and Steen? etc......

Michalek 12-27-2003 05:00 PM

I dont think that Iginla is movable at this point.

If he is ,he surely wont be traded to other Canadian team (even if this team has $$$)

sluggo* 12-27-2003 06:55 PM

Why wouldn't he go to another Canadian team? Another western conference team I can understand, but why not another Canadian team?

Snakeeye 12-27-2003 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
That being said, what doy ou guys think it would take for the Leafs to get Igilna out of Calgary if he is put on the trading block? Kaberle and Steen? Steen and a first rounder? Tucker and Steen? etc......

How about you try a real package?

Michalek 12-27-2003 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
Why wouldn't he go to another Canadian team? Another western conference team I can understand, but why not another Canadian team?

4 other teams cant afford iggy if Calgary cant , and Toronto has NO assets to land Jarome . ( Young ,proven in NHL forwardS, no Antrapov is too injury prone...)

They have no Gagne ,Williams,Comrie ,Gomez ,Friesen type of players

sluggo* 12-28-2003 06:09 AM

I think Steen would be of great interest to the Flames, "another" hockey prospect site has him ranked as a better prospect then any of the Flames other center prospects. Hes a playmaker with top line potential, he'd be the perfect center for a lot of the flames good winger/foward prospects who are more snipers. You add in someone like Kaberle or a first round pick and thats a good trade for both sides.

Michalek 12-28-2003 08:14 AM

With out Jarome our scoring would be even worse. We would need proven scorer back in the deal. How come Steen would halp the Flames to make PO this season?

sluggo* 12-28-2003 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michalek
With out Jarome our scoring would be even worse. We would need proven scorer back in the deal. How come Steen would halp the Flames to make PO this season?

If the Flames make the playoffs this season (which is still debatable, 4 team's are 3 points or less away) they aren't really stong enough YET to go very far, do you really thing they could beat the Avs, Canucks or Wings in a 7 game series?. Which is why rumors abou Igilna being traded keep popping up, if they had a chance of going anywhere once in the palyoffs there wouldn't be rumors about them trading their star player. They do have a good group of prospects who will help turn that team into a contender in a couple years, and Steen would really help that team succeed.

Snakeeye 12-28-2003 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
I think Steen would be of great interest to the Flames, "another" hockey prospect site has him ranked as a better prospect then any of the Flames other center prospects. Hes a playmaker with top line potential, he'd be the perfect center for a lot of the flames good winger/foward prospects who are more snipers. You add in someone like Kaberle or a first round pick and thats a good trade for both sides.

Kaberle is useless to us.

Take a look at the standings. Why in the bloody hell would the Flames trade Iginla for prospects and futures?

It is about as stupid as the Leafs trading Sundin for draft picks.

Like I said, try a real package.

sluggo* 12-28-2003 10:10 AM

Kaberle is useless to us.

I wouldn't call a 25 year old D-man whos able to put up 45+ points a year unless to a team thats in the bottom half of the league in goals for (and only one goal away from being in the bottom 10).

Take a look at the standings. Why in the bloody hell would the Flames trade Iginla for prospects and futures?

Making the playoffs is great, but how far they goin to go? Are the Flames going to beat the powerhoue teams in the west? Then the best team in the east (probably either the Leafs, Senators, Flyers or Devils), of course they aren't, not at this point in time. And the ONLY reason they would trade Igilna (now or later) is because of salary, the Flames can afford to pay him the 7+ million he'll be making. And they would take a prospect (or at least Steen) because hes the same age as the other young fowards the Flames in their system and on their team and would completement they very well (ie - playmaker with scorers).

It is about as stupid as the Leafs trading Sundin for draft picks.

If there was pretty much no chance the Leafs would get out of the first rund and/or had a ton of good young playerslike the Flames, I'd be all for trading Sundin for picks and/or prospects, it all depends on situations.

Like I said, try a real package

Sure, once you get a season of reality about the Flames and their situation

Snakeeye 12-28-2003 10:20 AM

I am aware of the Flames situation. We currently stand in good position to make the playoffs for the first time in eight seasons.

You know, now that I think about it, you make such perfect sense! We probably arent going to win the cup this year, so yes, lets rip out the heart and soul of the franchise - probably taking that playoff spot with it. Yes, the fans, who have supported this team all along will completely understand that. First playoff berth in nearly a decade? Meh. We dont need that! We've been "waiting for next year" for so long that hey! Whats one (two...three...four...) more years?

Give me a break.


Tomas Kaberle: 1-10-11 +6
Jordon Leopold: 5-9-14 +3
Toni Lydman 2-7-9 +7
Robyn Regehr 2-7-9 +7

Difference is, The Flames are not very deep offensively, as you say. And yet we have three players putting up offensive numbers about the same as Kaberle, on a much more talented team.

As I said, we dont need Kaberle. How about we try an offensive forward - with NHL experience?

Try making a deal that actually helps the Flames.

flamesfan12 12-28-2003 10:20 AM

So let me get this straight. We should trade our best player, our captain and our heart and soul for prospects because we won't get far in the playoffs? Please give me a break. If Iginla is going anywhere we are going to need players that can play now and not prospects.

Kaberle is useless to us. Our defence is set for many years to come. Toronto has nothing that we need or want.

Michalek 12-28-2003 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
If the Flames make the playoffs this season (which is still debatable, 4 team's are 3 points or less away) they aren't really stong enough YET to go very far, do you really thing they could beat the Avs, Canucks or Wings in a 7 game series?. Which is why rumors abou Igilna being traded keep popping up, if they had a chance of going anywhere once in the palyoffs there wouldn't be rumors about them trading their star player. They do have a good group of prospects who will help turn that team into a contender in a couple years, and Steen would really help that team succeed.


Are leafs going any far???
haha , with the D they have making 2nd round would be a success to them. Hnestly. Look at cup winners lately. Lidstrom ,Chelios ,Niedermayer ,Stevens,Blake ,Foote on those rosters. With bunch that leafs have on they D they aint going anywhere ,sorry but thats my opinion. even 2 Iginlas wont help them.
Oh and I will say it again Iginla wont be traded for unproven prospect )Steen), Leafs have NO assets that Sutter would want in return for Jarome ( kaberle is nice but we dont need much help on D., we could use young PROVEn forwards ,but Leafs dont have those) In fact Im very confident that Iginla wont be moved any time soon ,unless offer will be too sweet to refuse.

sluggo* 12-28-2003 12:02 PM

As I pointed out that Flames are excatly raking up goals, their offense could use help and Kaberle is a younger player that can do that, hes also a leader (he wears an A in Toronto, which says something) can could be that leader on the Flames blueline for years to come (and he would easy be the top offensive D-man on the Flames, as of last year, but over 20 points). As for the offense, as I told you if you add Steen to the Flames other young fowards and prospects they'd be setting themselves up for their future (which is what they need), they have a lot of good young fowards who can score, adding a 19 year old playmaking center with top line potential is only going to help that team.

[QUOTE=flamesfan12]So let me get this straight. We should trade our best player, our captain and our heart and soul for prospects because we won't get far in the playoffs? Please give me a break. If Iginla is going anywhere we are going to need players that can play now and not prospects.QUOTE]

I've said the same with the Leafs, given the situatin of the NHL right now if a team isn't in a positio nto make serious run at the cup NOW (and the Flames aren't, they most likely won't make it to second round if htey do make the playoffs) they should be looking to the future, which is looking very good for the Flames. Those players the Flames have that are the future of that team are at least 3-5 years away from hitting their primes and carrying the team, by that time Igilna will be in his early 30's (at the end of or just past his prime), not the most valuable thing for a team (at least not at Igilnas salary).

I understand feeling passionate about a team and not wanting to see a star player go, but look at the team and the situation they are in, a young team who won't win now getting good prospects (along with possibly a 25 year old, top 10 offensive D-man, a 23 year old powerfowar and/or a top draft pick) who is good enough to be in the NHL now for a 26 year old player is a good hockey decision. No Toronot fan wanted to Clark go, but the situation demaned that trade take place, and it was the right choice. You want to see a (as of right now away) laterial trade being made (ie - a player of equel ability to Igilna coming back), that won't happen. Why would the Flyers take on Igilnas salary when they can keep Gagne? If he gets moved (and I've been saying for 2 years its only a matter of time he is moved) this year it won't be for "proven" NHLers because theres no reason for the other team to make that deal, prospects and draft picks are what the deal will be based around.

sluggo* 12-28-2003 12:08 PM

Are leafs going any far???
haha , with the D they have making 2nd round would be a success to them.


First, while the Leafs don't have an stand out D-men, they have been playing very well as unit (I don't know if you noticed them leading the NHL standings or not). And second, I've said since the off season (and you can go to the Leafs board and look it up if you want) that if the Leafs want to get anywhere near that cup they need to upgrade their defense. John Ferguson knows this and I will guarent you that the current Leafs defense is not the defense they will enter the playoffs with.

In fact Im very confident that Iginla wont be moved any time soon ,unless offer will be too sweet to refuse.

The Flames simply can't afford to keep, rumors don't keep popping up for no reason.

Michalek 12-28-2003 12:11 PM

ok Dude
Regehr ,Lepold ,Warrener ,Gauthier ,Lydman ,Farrance and Phenauf on his way.
Flames wont take D in Iginla deal , so just please stop offering Kaberle , Sutter wont take him!
Steen- at this point this kid doesnt have much value then Nystrom ,Kobasew ,Lombardi or Phenauf. He did nothing to prove him self as a sure NHLer. Look at Boyes ,kid looked ike real deal and didnt make NHL yet.
Flames didnt make PO for 7 years ,so they are fairly desperate to make them this year .even if they wont go through 1st round fans and managment will be happy with Flames efford this year.
One more point : I believe that there is way more teams that could have interest in IGINLA ,and they HAVE assets that TORONTO doesnt
Philly( Williams ,gagne ,Comrie ,Handzus)
NJD ( Friesen ,Gomez ,Gionta)
Detroit ( Zetterberg,Datsyuk)
Tampa ( Vince ,Fedotenko ,Richards)
or even Chicago ( Bell ,Arnasn ,Calder)
If Iginla would be on the block I thruly believe that Ferguson Jr would be quickly of the race

sluggo* 12-28-2003 12:33 PM

Regehr ,Lepold ,Warrener ,Gauthier ,Lydman ,Farrance and Phenauf on his way.

Not one of them has the offensive ability that Kaberle does (40+ points every yearin the NHL except his first and the shortened year, where he had 39) and offensive from the Blueline is a HUGE need of the flames.



Steen- at this point this kid doesnt have much value then Nystrom ,Kobasew ,Lombardi or Phenauf. He did nothing to prove him self as a sure NHLer.

Please learn a bit about a player for commenting on him - hes 19 and playing on a #1 line, #1 PK and #1 PP unit in the SEL, hes the captain of the Sweden WJC team and would have made teh NHL this year except for his contract in Sweden. Also given Igilnas contract and lack of productin since getting that contract (35 goals las tyear and on track for 27 this year) Steen + a pick and/or some like Kaebrke.Antropov or another prospect is not out of hte question in terms of value.

One more point : I believe that there is way more teams that could have interest in IGINLA ,and they HAVE assets that TORONTO doesnt
Philly( Williams ,gagne ,Comrie ,Handzus)
NJD ( Friesen ,Gomez ,Gionta)
Detroit ( Zetterberg,Datsyuk)
Tampa ( Vince ,Fedotenko ,Richards)
or even Chicago ( Bell ,Arnasn ,Calder)


Why would ANY one of those teams move a cheaper player for a more expensive one and not get that much more (if anymore) productin for the money (Flyers, Devils, Wings), Datsyuk for Igilna? Please, the Wings would NEVER, EVER make that deal. The Hawks and Tampa are in the same boat as the Flames and won't take on a 7 million dollar player. If/When (and its more when) Igilna gets moved it will be for prospects/picks.

Flamin' Griz 12-28-2003 12:36 PM

Leopold and Phaneuf will probably both top out above Kaberle in terms of offensive ability when all is said and done.

Offense from the blueline is no longer a HUGE need for Calgary and the numbers show it.

Michalek 12-28-2003 12:43 PM

[QUOTE=sluggo]Regehr ,Lepold ,Warrener ,Gauthier ,Lydman ,Farrance and Phenauf on his way.

Not one of them has the offensive ability that Kaberle does (40+ points every yearin the NHL except his first and the shortened year, where he had 39) and offensive from the Blueline is a HUGE need of the flames.



Steen- at this point this kid doesnt have much value then Nystrom ,Kobasew ,Lombardi or Phenauf. He did nothing to prove him self as a sure NHLer.

Please learn a bit about a player for commenting on him - hes 19 and playing on a #1 line, #1 PK and #1 PP unit in the SEL, hes the captain of the Sweden WJC team and would have made teh NHL this year except for his contract in Sweden. Also given Igilnas contract and lack of productin since getting that contract (35 goals las tyear and on track for 27 this year) Steen + a pick and/or some like Kaebrke.Antropov or another prospect is not out of hte question in terms of value.

One more point : I believe that there is way more teams that could have interest in IGINLA ,and they HAVE assets that TORONTO doesnt
Philly( Williams ,gagne ,Comrie ,Handzus)
NJD ( Friesen ,Gomez ,Gionta)
Detroit ( Zetterberg,Datsyuk)
Tampa ( Vince ,Fedotenko ,Richards)
or even Chicago ( Bell ,Arnasn ,Calder)


Why would ANY one of those teams move a cheaper player for a more expensive one and not get that much more (if anymore) productin for the money (Flyers, Devils, Wings), Datsyuk for Igilna? Please, the Wings would NEVER, EVER make that deal. The Hawks and Tampa are in the same boat as the Flames and won't take on a 7 million dollar player. If/When (and its more when) Igilna gets moved it will be for prospects/picks.[/QUOTE]

Flames cant afford this move from Marketing point of view. They would loose many season ticket holders.
I believe that Flames will let Conroy 2.2 and McAmmond 1.5mln go as UFA ,and keep Iginla in town at 7mln. Keep in mind that warenka and Buzek will be gone by next june ,so its another 2mln to work with. Iginla wont be traded for prospect ,Calgary cant afford this move.

Michalek 12-28-2003 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sluggo
Regehr ,Lepold ,Warrener ,Gauthier ,Lydman ,Farrance and Phenauf on his way.

Not one of them has the offensive ability that Kaberle does (40+ points every yearin the NHL except his first and the shortened year, where he had 39) and offensive from the Blueline is a HUGE need of the flames.



Steen- at this point this kid doesnt have much value then Nystrom ,Kobasew ,Lombardi or Phenauf. He did nothing to prove him self as a sure NHLer.

Please learn a bit about a player for commenting on him - hes 19 and playing on a #1 line, #1 PK and #1 PP unit in the SEL, hes the captain of the Sweden WJC team and would have made teh NHL this year except for his contract in Sweden. Also given Igilnas contract and lack of productin since getting that contract (35 goals las tyear and on track for 27 this year) Steen + a pick and/or some like Kaebrke.Antropov or another prospect is not out of hte question in terms of value.

.

HE is fine kid ,he is doing well in SEL ,but this kid in absolutely UNPROVEN in NA , trust me Sutter wont move Iginla for Euro prospect

Michalek 12-28-2003 12:54 PM

Counter offer:
How about Antrapov and Stejen for Troubachev ,Ramhold ,Nystrom and McConnell
Since Leafs aint going for the cup ading more prospect to their system would surely help :rolly:

Flamin' Griz 12-28-2003 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michalek
Counter offer:
How about Antrapov and Stejen for Troubachev ,Ramhold ,Nystrom and McConnell
Since Leafs aint going for the cup ading more prospect to their system would surely help :rolly:

Holy cow, I wouldn't make that trade from a Flames perspective.....that's arguably 3 of our top 4 prospects! and for what? An big center with wonky knees and a gritty rookie?


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