HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=3)
-   -   Proposal Phi and Was (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=40614)

MBJets 01-03-2004 06:33 AM

Proposal Phi and Was
 
If PHI is really serious about the cup this year it would help there chance allot it would be a huge salary dump for Was (price of winning for Phi) good young players for Was to start rebuilding. It works for both teams does it not????????

PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

Goulet17 01-03-2004 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
If PHI is really serious about the cup this year it would help there chance allot it would be a huge salary dump for Was (price of winning for Phi) good young players for Was to start rebuilding. It works for both teams does it not????????

PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

Philly gets raked over the coals in this proposed deal. They are giving up way too much in terms of youth and cheap inexpensive contracts.

Kolzig and Bondra's trade value is much less than what you think it would be due to both age and the size of their contract.

Gonchar's trade value is high but I'm not sure that Philly would be willing to part with any of their promising young roster players for Gonchar at this point (i.e. Gagne, Williams, Pitkanen).

regehr 01-03-2004 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

a) it's too big a trade to be realistic ($14.65mil in salary going to the Flyers).
b) I don't think the Flyers would give up that much youth (especially Pitkanen) for a chance to win now.

MBJets 01-03-2004 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goulet17
Philly gets raked over the coals in this proposed deal. They are giving up way too much in terms of youth and cheap inexpensive contracts.

Kolzig and Bondra's trade value is much less than what you think it would be due to both age and the size of their contract.

Gonchar's trade value is high but I'm not sure that Philly would be willing to part with any of their promising young roster players for Gonchar at this point (i.e. Gagne, Williams, Pitkanen).

I know Phi is getting raked long term but the chance in Phi to win the cup isn't long term ( Getting old Recchi, Amonte, Roenick,Primeau) Time is running out for Phi

stanley 01-03-2004 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
I know Phi is getting raked long term but the chance in Phi to win the cup isn't long term ( Getting old Recchi, Amonte, Roenick,Primeau) Time is running out for Phi

I think that's an incorrect presumption. They have plenty in the cupboard, such as the three guys you mentioned (Gagne, Pitkanen, Esche), along with Williams and a bunch of other guys in the system. Again, several organizations might have better prospects, but the Flyers have a deep system in their own right with talented players. In this case, the added financial cost for the Flyers is nowhere near the upgrade to the lineup.

Plus, I think Esche would be better than what Washington has now (sans Kolzig), but Ouellet could turn out to be better. I don't think they require a goaltender.

messy_eh 01-03-2004 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
I know Phi is getting raked long term but the chance in Phi to win the cup isn't long term ( Getting old Recchi, Amonte, Roenick,Primeau) Time is running out for Phi



I couldn't disagree more If anything phillys core is a good mix of ages:

Under 25: Comrie, Pitkannen, Gagne, Williams, Siedenberg, Vandermeer, Fedoruk

25-30: Handzus, Kapanen, Somik, Johnsson, Esche

31+: Lapointe, Roenick, Primeau, Brasher,Leclair, Amonte, Recchi, Desjardins, Ragnersson, Weinrench, therien.


Way too much to give up for a guy like Kolzig at 6.5 mil when they could get Cujo for free for only 1.5 mil more actually only about half that. Bondra is not really needed with Kapanen, amonte, Reechi a sniper from the wings isn't a pressing need. Gonchar would look good but i don't think philly would give up Pitkanen 1 for 1 for him I could see a deal like gagne + for Gonchar but not that big a package and Philly may spend money but they are not going to spend stupidly going in to a new CBA.

strungout 01-03-2004 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

On behalf of George McPhee....

Where in the hell do I sign?!?

:handclap:

SabresRule 01-03-2004 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
If PHI is really serious about the cup this year it would help there chance allot it would be a huge salary dump for Was (price of winning for Phi) good young players for Was to start rebuilding. It works for both teams does it not????????

PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

philly gets ripped. replace gagne with handzus and pitkanen with a lesser alternative and your close. also take out esche, he isnt going anywhere.

fan mao rong 01-03-2004 08:24 AM

Pitkanen is right now for Philadelphia. Notice the top powerplay in the league. Have to find another port to dump your trash. YOu must have seen one of those trash into treasure ads.

Steve L* 01-03-2004 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBJets
If PHI is really serious about the cup this year it would help there chance allot it would be a huge salary dump for Was (price of winning for Phi) good young players for Was to start rebuilding. It works for both teams does it not????????

PHI: Gagne & Pitkanen & Esche

WAS: Bondra & Gonchar & Kolzig

Thats brutal. Philly give up by far the better players and take on a load of salary for the pleasure of doing it.
Bondra and Gonchar arent needed. Kolzig would be an upgrade but only if Hackett was going the other way and that isnt going to happen.

Ajacied 01-03-2004 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve L
Thats brutal. Philly give up by far the better players and take on a load of salary for the pleasure of doing it.
Bondra and Gonchar arent needed. Kolzig would be an upgrade but only if Hackett was going the other way and that isnt going to happen.

Sure there buddy..

The Caps are given up the 3 best players rather easily. Valuewise, it's a different story since you'd have to consider age, potential, and salary.

Bondra is still a better player than Gagne.

Kolzig is so much better then Esche, not even funny.

And Gonchar is still superior towards Pitkanen.

Peter Griffin 01-03-2004 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modano = God
Sure there buddy..

The Caps are given up the 3 best players rather easily. Valuewise, it's a different story since you'd have to consider age, potential, and salary.

Bondra is still a better player than Gagne.

Kolzig is so much better then Esche, not even funny.

And Gonchar is still superior towards Pitkanen.

Agreed, the Flyers would be an improved team short term.

Ajacied 01-03-2004 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fan mao rong
Have to find another port to dump your trash.

I'm curious what you think of your own players when you consider the likes of Gonchar, Kolzig and Bondra trash. I'd be more then happy to aquire such trash if it were up to me..

Feenom 01-03-2004 09:04 AM

With this deal Philly would make everyone else in the East tremble with fear. This team would be fit for a Cup win. Kolzig alone is a huge improvement. If this deal ever got done, you might even be witness to a couple of cups for the Flyers. They still keep Comrie and Williams too.

PF 01-03-2004 09:14 AM

I'd love to have Gonchar here but not for Pitkanen, only way we get him is if we deal one or two d-men and picks to upgrade and then somehow grab another depth d-man at the deadline so Hitch has that depth he likes so much.

Kolzig I also like but I think Esche is doing great when he plays, Hackett, well...he's a capable back-up/rotation starter just he can't handle things on his own full-time (see his play whilst Esche was injured).

Not alot of need for Bondra at the price he'd cost since we have Recchi, Williams, Amonte and Kapanen on our right hand side, who sits out of that if we get Bondra?


Deal doesn't work for the Flyers.

dats-13 01-03-2004 10:15 AM

Kolzig has proved that he can handle the playoff push...but this is just to many star players switching hands it would kill chemistry...

Marshall 01-03-2004 11:41 AM

I don't think this trade is that insane for Philly if they want to win now. They are getting three proven players, though they are also getting their salaries.

That said, I wouldn't do it if I was Philly.

Rex88 01-03-2004 01:21 PM

That is brutal - all young and improving as the base for Philly in the future.
Numbers time
Esche: GAA 1.83 and SP 923%
Kolzig: GAA 3.14 and SP 896%
I understand one year on very different teams.
This trade does NOT work given ages, salary and future.

Fighter 01-03-2004 01:23 PM

Gonchar is maybe better offensively, but overall I take Pitkanen over him any day of my life (younger, cheaper, more complete; what a steal by the Flyers!) :bow:

And Bondra is pretty much washed up IMO.

With the addiction of Comrie, if they continue to play good, I don't see the Flyers involved in trades if not for a huge goalie.

Flytype 01-03-2004 01:30 PM

Woof!
 
1. Pitkanen is almost untradeable
2. BECAUSE Washington would be looking to dump sal., you wouldn't get back equal value.
3. Washington would have to take Hackett not Esche.
4. Washington would have to take Therien...
5. Try this.

Hackett and Therien for Kolzig.

Wait I forgot to throw in the 9th round pick. :joker:

Steve L* 01-03-2004 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modano = God
Sure there buddy..

The Caps are given up the 3 best players rather easily. Valuewise, it's a different story since you'd have to consider age, potential, and salary.

Bondra is still a better player than Gagne.

Kolzig is so much better then Esche, not even funny.

And Gonchar is still superior towards Pitkanen.

Gagne has more value than Bondra.
Pitkanen has more value than Gonchar.
While Kolzig obviously has more value than Esche, the goalie market is very low at the moment.

Ask any Sens fans if theyd give up Chara, Spezza and Lalime for those 3 or ask Detroit fans Zetterberg, Datsyuk and Legace and I know what answer youll get.

Peter Griffin 01-03-2004 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve L
Gagne has more value than Bondra.
Pitkanen has more value than Gonchar.
While Kolzig obviously has more value than Esche, the goalie market is very low at the moment.

Ask any Sens fans if theyd give up Chara, Spezza and Lalime for those 3 or ask Detroit fans Zetterberg, Datsyuk and Legace and I know what answer youll get.

Read M=G's post again. He never said that it was fair valuewise, but simply that the Flyers were getting the three best players in the deal.

blah 01-03-2004 04:20 PM

The Flyers require their forwards to play defense, so Gagne is better than Bondra from a Flyers perspective.
Kolzig better than Esche? Not this season to date.
Gonchar is a lot better than Pitkanen though.

This proposal isn't close to being in the realm of possible.

windowlicker 01-03-2004 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve L
Pitkanen has more value than Gonchar.

:eek: :eek: :eek: Sorry friend....... thats just outlandish.

Marshall 01-03-2004 04:28 PM

"Pitkanen has more value than Gonchar."

I think this is argueable. The rest I agree with. Flyers don't do this deal.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:16 AM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.