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-   -   Proposal: Penguins/Oilers (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=40957)

Doghouse 01-04-2004 02:05 PM

Proposal: Penguins/Oilers
 
Since Brewer is on the block, so sources say, I thought I'd advocate a little proposal. Not to mention, I'm really really bored.

To the Penguins:
D Eric Brewer (2.5 mil.)

To the Oilers:
RW Aleksey Morozov (1.5 mil.)
C Milan Kraft--------(935K)
Net salary-----------2.435 mil.

The trade is on an even scale, money-wise. For what the Pens will get in return, a bonifide tough man on defense with experience and some upswing left, I think 65k added to their payroll would be fine. Not to mention, I'm sure they'll be some cash thrown around, however little the amount. We're not dealing with the Rangers or the Capitals here.

The Oilers get Morozov and Kraft, both with some upswing. And keep this in mind, Morozov has more points than more than half of the Oilers' roster. In the same respect, Kraft has more points than the same amount of Oilers with 10 less games played.

I honestly don't think, even considering how financially distraught the Penguins are these days, that 70k would break them.

However, I know nothing about Brewer's contract structure or his arbitration rights. If anybody has info on that, I'd like to hear it.

Winston Wolf 01-04-2004 02:35 PM

I don't like this from an Oiler's POV at all. Kraft would not even play for the Oilers and Morozov would get much less ice time than he does in Pittsburgh. The Oilers could do much better.

Peter Griffin 01-04-2004 02:37 PM

If Brewer is traded, I think Edmonton will try and get a big, talented center. Morozov would be a bit redundant with Dvorak and Hemsky already in Edmonton.

Big McLargehuge 01-04-2004 03:43 PM

Well Kraft is highly talented and is 6'3" 214.

Kraft and Morozov are two insanely talented players who have done well in Pittsburgh, just not nearly as much as they can. A change of scenery could launch these guys into something amazing.

But on the same side, I think Edmonton would like more of a sure thing coming to there end, or at least one defenseman to try to help lessen the blow of losing Brewer.

As a Penguins fan I do it, but I hope that we don't regret it down the line.

Peter Griffin 01-04-2004 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantompenguin
Well Kraft is highly talented and is 6'3" 214.

I meant someone who is more proven and someone who uses his size physically.

oilers_guy_eddie 01-04-2004 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantompenguin
I think Edmonton would like more of a sure thing coming to there end

I also think so. I don't think this idea is much worth talking about.

McCabe24 01-04-2004 04:07 PM

hmm...it's not bad value wise I guess, but I don't think Edmonton can afford to lose their #2 defenceman without even getting one back..

counter proposal:

To Pittsburgh: Eric Brewer, 2004 5th Round Pick
To Edmonton: Aleksy Morozov, Dick Tarnstrom

at least Edmonton would recieve a defenceman with reasonable offensive capabilites to make up for the loss of Brewer...

dats-13 01-04-2004 04:09 PM

Brewers name gets tossed around the trade rumors site like a ragdoll

Big McLargehuge 01-04-2004 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCabe24
hmm...it's not bad value wise I guess, but I don't think Edmonton can afford to lose their #2 defenceman without even getting one back..

counter proposal:

To Pittsburgh: Eric Brewer, 2004 5th Round Pick
To Edmonton: Aleksy Morozov, Dick Tarnstrom

at least Edmonton would recieve a defenceman with reasonable offensive capabilites to make up for the loss of Brewer...

That's probably more realistic.

Or even in the original deal you could toss in a guy like Drake Berehowsky, Patrick Boileau, or Marc Bergevin. Short term replacements. None of those names make more than 525k this year. I forget what Boileau makes but it's not much, Berehowsky and Bergevin are paid in ketchup. Bergy gets 400k this year and Berehowsky makes I believe the same, if not less(only because of his buyout from Phoenix).

Peter Griffin 01-04-2004 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantompenguin
Berehowsky and Bergevin are paid in ketchup.

And there's a reason for that...

DJ Spinoza 01-04-2004 04:38 PM

Brewer is exactly the player the Penguins need to try and go after. I think it's well talked about especially on these boards that the Penguins have a good number of very young prospects with high potential, Welch and Whitney especially.

However, you can't just count on 5 prospects automatically becoming your defense in 5 years - it hardly ever happens that way.

The Penguins need to improve their defense, with that I am stating the overobvious. They have started this through the draft, but also need to do this through free agency and/or trading.

Brewer is a guy that we are pretty sure is on the block. He's still very young and could be a valued member of the Penguins rebuilding efforts. Even if it meant taking on a little bit in salary, Patrick would be an idiot not to trade for this guy if Edmonton wants to deal.

That's the problem, I don't think we've got what it takes. What exactly are the Oil looking for in return for Brewer? I'm weary on giving up Kraft, who has improved his game this year but is bounced around. Morozov is a similar story, as far as me being weary to trade him, but I would move both for Brewer.

But there has to be better offers out there for him. I'd also be more than willing to deal Tarnstrom, even moving all three for him. I don't know the value of these guys. I don't think the Penguins have what it would take to get Brewer.

I probably come off sounding high on Brewer, but it's for a reason - he's the exact type of player we don't have that we need. This defense still needs to be as best as it can be for Fleury and/or Caron. And it would be very good for the younger defensemen, especially a rookie like Orpik, to have someone like Brewer who may be able to help their career.

Sadly, I honestly can't see the Penguins going after him. They should try, though.

I'm very interested in looking into this. What is Brewer's contract status after this year?

Big McLargehuge 01-04-2004 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Griffin
And there's a reason for that...

Berehowsky is good as long as he's being used on the 3rd defensive pairing.

Bergevin is crap, but he's a leader.

As I said though, short term fill-ins if Edmonton needs a defenseman.

Peter Griffin 01-04-2004 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantompenguin
Berehowsky is good as long as he's being used on the 3rd defensive pairing.

Bergevin is crap, but he's a leader.

As I said though, short term fill-ins if Edmonton needs a defenseman.

I don't think "fill-ins" are going to be of any interest if the Oilers are too trade one of their top d-men. The only way I see Edmonton trading Brewer is if they get a player with the same upside, only a center who has size and plays physical. Tossing in a guy like Berehowsky or Bergevin isn't going to make the original deal any more enticing to Oiler fans.

Doghouse 01-04-2004 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McCabe24
counter proposal:

To Pittsburgh: Eric Brewer, 2004 5th Round Pick
To Edmonton: Aleksy Morozov, Dick Tarnstrom

I'd do that deal in a second. I'd make the 5th round pick a 2nd round pick though. Simply, because the Pens would only be losing their best offensive weapon on the PP. And the way the Pens' PP and goal scoring is that's a lot to give up. Not to mention, they would also be losing, arguably, one of their best forwards with nothing to replace him with other than from within their system. Thus, my reasoning for a higher pick.

But the basic structure of the deal sounds very good. Other than Edmonton adding 100k to their payroll. Not sure if it'll break them either way.

DJ Spinoza 01-04-2004 04:53 PM

I'd do that deal without a pick, but I just don't see Edmonton moving Brewer for just Tarnstrom and Morozov.

I wonder exactly what other teams are interested?

McCabe24 01-04-2004 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doghouse
I'd do that deal in a second. I'd make the 5th round pick a 2nd round pick though. Simply, because the Pens would only be losing their best offensive weapon on the PP. And the way the Pens' PP and goal scoring is that's a lot to give up. Not to mention, they would also be losing, arguably, one of their best forwards with nothing to replace him with other than from within their system. Thus, my reasoning for a higher pick.

But the basic structure of the deal sounds very good. Other than Edmonton adding 100k to their payroll. Not sure if it'll break them either way.

I wouldn't add a 2nd, it would pretty much be the same structure of you Kraft and Morozov for Brewer, but replacing Kraft with Tarnstrom....I think a 2nd would be way too much for Edmonton to throw in. And the PP quarterback you'd be losing in Tarnstrom, you'd be gaining a more capable guy with Brewer. I think the 5th could be upped to a 4th if it gets the deal done, but no higher or Pittsburgh would have to add something else...

Cerebral 01-04-2004 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrKnowNothing
Brewer is a guy that we are pretty sure is on the block.

This is a line that is quickly getting on my nerves.. we have heard from one person that Lowe is looking to trade Brewer! Likewise, the source he provided (I haven't seen it myself so I can't completely deny its possible existence) hasn't been verified by anyone else. All that I have read are a bunch of Spector type rumours claiming "maybe Kevin Lowe should deal Brewer for scoring help"! I'll repeat my earlier statement, don't you find it odd that these "rumours" have spurted out of Florida but haven't even seen the light of day in Edmonton?? The Florida press are the same people that claimed Comrie was looking for a $4+ million dollar contract.. how much did he sign for again? I personally don't even think Lowe would entertain the thought of trading Brewer at this point.. he is finally playing like a #1 d-man for the Oilers and just logged another 27 minute night. With Smith + Cross down and guys like Luoma and Lynch in our top 6, how could Lowe even begin to think about trading Brewer?

DJ Spinoza 01-04-2004 05:36 PM

Well, I didn't mean to speak with such certainty. I was under the impression that Brewer being traded was a fairly widespread rumor. :dunno:

Cerebral 01-04-2004 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrKnowNothing
Well, I didn't mean to speak with such certainty. I was under the impression that Brewer being traded was a fairly widespread rumor. :dunno:

No problem, I didn't mean to come off sounding mean.. it is Christmas-ish time still :p I've personally yet to see anything besides complete speculation that Brewer might be on the block.. one person on these boards mentioned he'd seem something in print regarding this fact but no one else has confirmed this. I personally doubt Brewer will be dealt.. that might be my Oiler-optimism speaking but the Oilers simply can't afford to deal a player away from their already twine-thin blueline..

DJ Spinoza 01-04-2004 06:00 PM

It's alright, I didn't take offense.

Stephen 01-04-2004 06:31 PM

After the Oilers got ripped off (my opinion only) in the Comrie deal, I think they'd ideally take a great young NHL player up front or a real bluechipper. Looking at Pittsburgh, I don't see a fantastic match, as I'm sure they wouldn't want to give up their bluechip pieces.

Darth Milbury 01-04-2004 06:44 PM

Kraft and Morozov are both talented, but both have been kicking around the NHL and AHL for years, without really accomplishing all that much (Morozov did have one nice season). I don't see EDM being interested in either guy.

IF Brewer were available (which I doubt), EDM would want to talk about guys like Orpik, Whitney, or Pitt's first rounder in the upcoming draft.

Big McLargehuge 01-04-2004 07:16 PM

well Pittsburgh doesn't trade prospects so good bye then.

Master Lok 01-04-2004 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phantompenguin
well Pittsburgh doesn't trade prospects so good bye then.

I have no problem with that. Trading Brewer our possible #1 defender for Morozov and Tarnstrom/Kraft would not make the Oiler fans happy. It also doesn't make any sense. Morozov would not unseat Dvorak or Hemsky as the top two RW's. There is some need for a centre but Kraft isn't what the Oilers are looking for in a #1 centre. If you were wanting to conduct a trade for Brewer, the Oilers are looking for someone to take Brewer's place immediately (and Tarnstrom's plus minus of -16 and age of 29 isn't going to look that good to the Oilers) and a young prospect.

If you don't like that, then that's fine. The Oilers will not trade Brewer for anything less.

Chayos 01-04-2004 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doghouse
Since Brewer is on the block, so sources say, I thought I'd advocate a little proposal. Not to mention, I'm really really bored.

To the Penguins:
D Eric Brewer (2.5 mil.)

To the Oilers:
RW Aleksey Morozov (1.5 mil.)
C Milan Kraft--------(935K)
Net salary-----------2.435 mil.

The trade is on an even scale, money-wise. For what the Pens will get in return, a bonifide tough man on defense with experience and some upswing left, I think 65k added to their payroll would be fine. Not to mention, I'm sure they'll be some cash thrown around, however little the amount. We're not dealing with the Rangers or the Capitals here.

The Oilers get Morozov and Kraft, both with some upswing. And keep this in mind, Morozov has more points than more than half of the Oilers' roster. In the same respect, Kraft has more points than the same amount of Oilers with 10 less games played.

I honestly don't think, even considering how financially distraught the Penguins are these days, that 70k would break them.

However, I know nothing about Brewer's contract structure or his arbitration rights. If anybody has info on that, I'd like to hear it.


The way i see the oil would only make a deal like this is they were doing a forward and brewer for a forward and D-man they could use.

The players u listed just are not impact prospects which it would take to land Brewer., I could see a deal like Brewer and laraque for Whitney and the right to switch 1st round picks with the pens.


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