HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   Montreal Canadiens (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=16)
-   -   Referees. (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=517024)

Kriss E 05-15-2008 07:41 PM

Referees.
 
I've been watching a lot of the games throughout these 08 Playoffs.
All in all, bad calls are being made, but is anybody watching this Flyers-Penguins game?..
All the penalties given to Pittsburgh are more than ridiculous. Gonchar's holding(although ill give that one), but Letang's interference?? and Orpik's roughing???..

There's no way a referee can be THAT bad, it just can't.
So bottom line, does anybody else think the Refs are getting some kind of directive to not favor Pittsburgh?..Seeing as the beginning of the Finals are suppose to start around mid-next week if im not mistaken.
It is completely in the league's advantage to keep these series going as long as they can, so do you think they are influencing the refs to make such calls??..

I just don't think you can actually become a NHL Referee and be THAT bad.

lol..anyways..this has been discussed a lot, i never really put my 2cents, now was a good time to do it i felt.;)

Dogbert* 05-15-2008 07:45 PM

Tonight's refs are slanted for the same reason that last night's were. They need the broadcast revenue from the weekend NBC games.

Beakermania* 05-15-2008 08:43 PM

I'm with John Tortella on this one.... Its not intentional, its blindness (or incompetence as i call it).

I don't buy these conspiracy theories, we've seen bad reffing all season, both for and against the habs, both for and against many teams.... You remember it more when its against you, but there were plenty of bad calls both ways.

I think NHL refs are incompetent....

JGRB 05-15-2008 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brieremania (Post 14123914)

I think NHL refs are incompetent....

I'm inclined to give you my support in your thought.

WeThreeKings 05-15-2008 09:13 PM

I'm inclined to believe the same, while they suck its clear the refereeing was in Dallas' and Philly's favor.

Eight missed tripping calls in the third period alone.

Nashy 05-15-2008 09:17 PM

The reffing in the playoffs has been consistent, just like it was during the regular season......consistently ****.

Kriss E 05-16-2008 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brieremania (Post 14123914)
I'm with John Tortella on this one.... Its not intentional, its blindness (or incompetence as i call it).

I don't buy these conspiracy theories, we've seen bad reffing all season, both for and against the habs, both for and against many teams.... You remember it more when its against you, but there were plenty of bad calls both ways.

I think NHL refs are incompetent....

Thats where i disagree.
What we are seeing in the playoffs is beyong incompetency.
Crosby, who's usually a big whiner i admit, was really interfered with on so many occasions, its simply disgusting. I don't see how Letang gets called for interference on Upshall and Smith gets nothing for all the banging he did on Crosby all night long.
I dont see how there's no call at the end of the game, when Crosby is rushing on Biron with maybe 2min left, down 3-2, gets hooked by 3 different players(that type of hooking is the ONLY consistent penalty we've seen all season). Not only that, but the refs blows the whistle as soon as Crosby touches Biron and makes the faceoff be outside the zone.
I don't see how Orpik gets a penalty after he gets crosschecks from behing and then pushed..he doesnt retaliate, a pile up starts and he gets 2min..:shakehead..This is not incompetence or blindness. Im sorry, but i cant believe it is.
All the penalties in the beginning of the game, that completely cut the legs of the Penguins after they were dominating the shots 11-4, changed the whole outcome of the game and made the Flyers go up 3-0.
How can a referee disallow a goal like the Holmstrom one, but let the Briere goal be a good one.

It is not incompetence, the referees watch every game, they know what to call, they know the rules, it just doesn't make any sense at all the way they ref.
Big coincidence, for both games, the referees favored the team that was down 3-0. An even bigger coincidence, is that its in the league's( huge multi-million corporation) best interest to keep these series as long as possible.

Im way too rational and logical to think those are simple coincidences.
Any employee of any company, whether its a small business or big one, would get fired for such a bad work output.
So I doubt the refs are just incompetent.

As for Tortorella, he stayed polite.

ECWHSWI 05-16-2008 04:00 AM

Watched playoffs games, watched a few games at the World's too... NHL refs should really look at how they're doing things over there : sure they make mistakes once in a while but there's a few certainty...

1. they don't care what the score is, 3-2 in the last few minutes you'll get called if you do something wrong, happened more than once
2. they don't care if you're already down a man, you trip or elbow someone you'll get the chance to play 3 vs 5



the difference is right there, in the Worlds, they see something - they call a penalty, in the NHL they see something - look at the board - blow whistle (or not)...

seen many players or coaches complain at the Worlds ? me neither... they all know they have to play WITHIN the rulebook, not within parts of the rulebook the ref feel like applying on a particular game... finals ? semi ? late in the 3rd trailing by 1 ? not the refs problem... if you dont want to get "called", play within the rules...

Iz 05-16-2008 07:20 AM

There's a big difference between the International Hockey referees and the NHL referees. They are all competent referees. It's the mentality of their job that differ.

NHL Refs: Don't manage the game. Your call should not disturb the result of the game.

IIHF Refs: Call what you see. If your call disturb the game, it's not your problem. Players know the rules so it's their problem.

I prefer the later. But it is still a job that rely on personal judgment so it will always have mistakes in referring.

Pascal 05-16-2008 07:24 AM

Reffing is not an easy job when you have 18,000 people judging everything you do, plus the people watching on TV. That being said, that doesn't explain why 90% of them are totally incompetent.

I would use the goal they refused to Detroit last game to perfectly picture how NHL refs are.

GoneAway 05-16-2008 07:27 AM

What pisses me off is that they decide to crack down on certain things during the playoffs...

Dont tinker with the game in the playoffs...do it in the regular season, but leave the playoffs alone.

Puckhead58* 05-16-2008 10:30 AM

I've been suspicious since the playoffs began. They have made some stupid calls and they always seem to be in favor of getting one team back in the game. It seems like they can't allow one team to win big, they always have to call a few penalties against the team that is doing better so it will turn into a close game.
Sometimes I wonder if the whole playoffs are pre-defined by the league. Don't you find it strange that the passed 3 seasons had a Canadian team in the Cup Finals against an American team.

Nobody expected Calgary to face Tampa in the finals, or Edmonton to face Carolina in the finals. Ottawa had a good season last year, but did anybody predict them to be in the finals with Anaheim?

Sometimes I wonder if the players are just paid actors in the NHL now.

SerialSeb 05-16-2008 10:36 AM

What drives me nuts is they call the game a certain way all season long and in the playoff barely call the interferences, hooking, grabbing. Drives me crazy. Why have a regular season then, no point creating a game plan if they change the rules in the playoffs from game to game.

There are only 60+ NHL referees. In the all of North America these are the best they could hire???

Iím having a hard time accepting that the cream of the referring world is this incompetent.
The NHL as to put a serious effort in offering the client (the fans) a new format that atleast seems fair.
And if it means more stoppage for reviews so be it. It would eventually die down a bit just like penalties where rampant when they came out of the lock-out.

David_99 05-16-2008 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puckhead58 (Post 14128479)
Sometimes I wonder if the players are just paid actors in the NHL now.

My friend said almost those exact same words back in the Summer of '93.

"It was the Stanley Cups' 100th anniversary so of course they were going to let the Habs win it, in a series with Gretzky, no less. They're all actors. It's like wrestling, it's all predetermined. It's also why the Bruins can never beat the Habs. They were told not to."

He's a Leafs fan though, so I didn't pay attention to him, as usual. Although it's 14 years later and the Bruins still can't beat the Habs.... Hmm.... ;)

SerialSeb 05-16-2008 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David_99 (Post 14128547)
My friend said almost those exact same words back in the Summer of '93.

"It was the Stanley Cups' 100th anniversary so of course they were going to let the Habs win it, in a series with Gretzky, no less. They're all actors. It's like wrestling, it's all predetermined. It's also why the Bruins can never beat the Habs. They were told not to."

He's a Leafs fan though, so I didn't pay attention to him, as usual. Although it's 14 years later and the Bruins still can't beat the Habs.... Hmm.... ;)

They actually didn't beat us during the 70's but then most teams couldn't. In the 80's we did well against them but then it changed until this decade.
Playoff Appearances: 76
Overall Playoff Record: 398-273-8
Stanley Cup Championships: 1992-93, 1985-86, 1978-79, 1977-78,
1976-77, 1975-76, 1972-73, 1970-71,
1968-69, 1967-68, 1965-66, 1964-65,
1959-60, 1958-59, 1957-58, 1956-57,
1955-56, 1952-53, 1945-46, 1943-44,
1930-31, 1929-30, 1923-24

2008 -- defeated Boston, 4-3, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals
lost to Philadelphia, 4-1, Eastern Conf. semifinals

2006 -- lost to Carolina, 4-2, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals

2004 -- defeated Boston, 4-3, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals
lost to Tampa Bay, 4-0, Eastern Conf. semifinals

2002 -- defeated Boston, 4-2, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals
lost to Carolina, 4-2, Eastern Conf. semifinals

1998 -- defeated Pittsburgh, 4-2, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals
lost to Buffalo, 4-0, Eastern Conf. semifinals

1997 -- lost to New Jersey, 4-1, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals

1996 -- lost to N.Y. Rangers, 4-2, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals

1994 -- lost to Boston, 4-3, Eastern Conf. quarterfinals

1993 -- defeated Quebec, 4-2, Adams Division semifinals
defeated Buffalo, 4-0, Adams Division finals
defeated N.Y. Islanders, 4-1, Wales Conference finals
defeated Los Angeles, 4-1, Stanley Cup Finals

1992 -- defeated Hartford, 4-3, Adams Division semifinals
lost to Boston, 4-0, Adams Division finals
1991 -- defeated Buffalo, 4-2, Adams Division semifinals
lost to Boston, 4-3, Adams Division finals

1990 -- defeated Buffalo, 4-2, Adams Division semifinals
lost to Boston, 4-1, Adams Division finals

1989 -- defeated Hartford, 4-0, Adams Division semifinals
defeated Boston, 4-1, Adams Division finals
defeated Philadelphia, 4-2, Wales Conference finals
lost to Calgary, 4-2, Stanley Cup Finals

1988 -- defeated Hartford, 4-2, Adams Division semifinals
lost to Boston, 4-1, Adams Division finals

Kriss E 05-16-2008 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iz (Post 14127283)
There's a big difference between the International Hockey referees and the NHL referees. They are all competent referees. It's the mentality of their job that differ.

NHL Refs: Don't manage the game. Your call should not disturb the result of the game.

IIHF Refs: Call what you see. If your call disturb the game, it's not your problem. Players know the rules so it's their problem.

I prefer the later. But it is still a job that rely on personal judgment so it will always have mistakes in referring.

The NHL refs decide more the outcome of a game than IIHF Refs.
In many POs game, the Dallas-SJ overtime is the perfect example, they let things go by, many things. But then call a penalty that they let slide time and time again before in the same game.
To me thats deciding the outcome a lot more than a ref that is consistent.

Since it hasn't changed, im guessing the league is pleased with the refereeing. Therefore, it only makes me feel that the refs are calling the game the way the top dogs want them to do it.
Its sad.

kovalev47 05-16-2008 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 14123113)
I've been watching a lot of the games throughout these 08 Playoffs.
All in all, bad calls are being made, but is anybody watching this Flyers-Penguins game?..
All the penalties given to Pittsburgh are more than ridiculous. Gonchar's holding(although ill give that one), but Letang's interference?? and Orpik's roughing???..

There's no way a referee can be THAT bad, it just can't.
So bottom line, does anybody else think the Refs are getting some kind of directive to not favor Pittsburgh?..Seeing as the beginning of the Finals are suppose to start around mid-next week if im not mistaken.
It is completely in the league's advantage to keep these series going as long as they can, so do you think they are influencing the refs to make such calls??..

I just don't think you can actually become a NHL Referee and be THAT bad.

lol..anyways..this has been discussed a lot, i never really put my 2cents, now was a good time to do it i felt.;)

I feel the reffing is bad, but the fault lies with the league. The refs were used to calling games one way and now they are told to do the opposite. Reffing never used to be such a problem until the "new NHL" was created. The refs are probably confused on what should or should not be called because of it.

Kriss E 05-16-2008 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovalev47 (Post 14131692)
I feel the reffing is bad, but the fault lies with the league. The refs were used to calling games one way and now they are told to do the opposite. Reffing never used to be such a problem until the "new NHL" was created. The refs are probably confused on what should or should not be called because of it.

I don't think they're confused. I think the refereeing has been consistently bad throughout the year.
But what happened vs Detroit and vs Pittsburgh these last 2 games is beyond the usual bad refereeing.
Looking at the situations, Detroit and Pitts up by 3, i think the league is flat out telling the refs to favor one team, so they can make more money out of this.

kovalev47 05-16-2008 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kriss E (Post 14132781)
I don't think they're confused. I think the refereeing has been consistently bad throughout the year.
But what happened vs Detroit and vs Pittsburgh these last 2 games is beyond the usual bad refereeing.
Looking at the situations, Detroit and Pitts up by 3, i think the league is flat out telling the refs to favor one team, so they can make more money out of this.


Hmm that's another possibility. I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. The more games, the more cash the league makes. But if this is the case, the league is at fault again rather than the refs. Also if the league is condoning this type of behavior, this league is turning out to be no better than the WWE. They may as well decide ahead of time who the winner is.

Nobak 05-16-2008 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovalev47 (Post 14133949)
Hmm that's another possibility. I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. The more games, the more cash the league makes. But if this is the case, the league is at fault again rather than the refs. Also if the league is condoning this type of behavior, this league is turning out to be no better than the WWE. They may as well decide ahead of time who the winner is.

You say that like the WWE being scripted is an unproven but widely believed conspiracy theory.

Kriss E 05-16-2008 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kovalev47 (Post 14133949)
Hmm that's another possibility. I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. The more games, the more cash the league makes. But if this is the case, the league is at fault again rather than the refs. Also if the league is condoning this type of behavior, this league is turning out to be no better than the WWE. They may as well decide ahead of time who the winner is.

I wouldn't go as far as that. Maybe just be more lenient towards one team is more plausible than completely throwing a game.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:58 AM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.