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-   -   KHL as an old man's league (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=535633)

Beacon 07-12-2008 08:43 PM

KHL as an old man's league
 
I remember the IHL was an old man's league. If you could no longer hack it in the NHL, you went to the IHL while the AHL was more for young kids.

So will the new KHL be like that, except instead of taking people who can no longer make the 4th line, they'll take people who used to be stars, but not anymore and often can't even crack the top 2 lines.

Jagr is their biggest catch and he's 35. They also just got Brylin, 34. And they may be getting Shanahan, who I am pretty sure met Abe Lincoln personally.

Shark Staal 07-12-2008 08:52 PM

Radulov, Emery, Hossa...

squishy 07-12-2008 10:56 PM

Baranka (23)
Chiodo (25)
Dubielewicz (29)
Emery (25)
Grahame (32)
Hossa (27)
Jagr (35)
N. Kapanen (30)
I. Khomutov (23)
Kwiatkowski (31)
Lampman (25)
S. McCarthy (27)
Ozolinsh (35)
Pilar (31)
Rachunek (28)
Radivojevic (27)
Radulov (22)
Ruzicka (23)
Simon (36)
Stumpel (36)
Tolpeko (23)
Vasicek (27)
Wanvig (27)
York (30)
Zyuzin (30)

Beacon 07-13-2008 12:02 AM

All these players couldn't make it to where they want to be. Dubielewicz wants to be a starter. On the Isles, he'll be a permanent backup, and actually that's true on any NHL team. But in the KHL he gets to be a star.

Baranka thought he'll probably never make it, at least not in the next year. So he went to the KHL.

We are really talking about everyone who is either a "has-been" or a "never was".

I get why the "never was" are all in the KHL since it's the second best league in the world. I really see no reason for Vally to sit on our bench. He can go to Russia and make more money while starting and being praised as one of the top goalies in the world's largest country.

But what I'm suggesting is that it looks like "has beens" will no longer stick around the NHL on the 3-4 line and will just move to Russia to play on the first line there.

Shanny is still a first liner in any league that's not the NHL... and the KHL is great for old guys given that it has only a 52 game schedule.





Quote:

Originally Posted by squishy (Post 14853807)
Baranka (23)
Chiodo (25)
Dubielewicz (29)
Emery (25)
Grahame (32)
Hossa (27)
Jagr (35)
N. Kapanen (30)
I. Khomutov (23)
Kwiatkowski (31)
Lampman (25)
S. McCarthy (27)
Ozolinsh (35)
Pilar (31)
Rachunek (28)
Radivojevic (27)
Radulov (22)
Ruzicka (23)
Simon (36)
Stumpel (36)
Tolpeko (23)
Vasicek (27)
Wanvig (27)
York (30)
Zyuzin (30)


NYR Viper 07-13-2008 12:26 AM

that list of players isnt very impressive at all.........most of those players are 3rd and 4th liners....besides jagr(on the downside of his career) and radulov(a *****)

squishy 07-13-2008 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrooklynHockey99 (Post 14854266)
Shanny is still a first liner in any league that's not the NHL... and the KHL is great for old guys given that it has only a 52 game schedule.

Given the fact he looked like a pilon in the NHL last season, I'm not so sure he'd be able to keep up with the skating and speed required on the larger ice surface. Nevermind being able to handle first line ice time given all the extra skating. So I'm not so sure he's a first liner in the KHL.

But really, this talk of Shanny going to Russia strikes me as a waste of time, because I don't believe he's given it so much as a passing thought.

Shark Staal 07-13-2008 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by squishy (Post 14854717)
Given the fact he looked like a pilon in the NHL last season, I'm not so sure he'd be able to keep up with the skating and speed required on the larger ice surface. Nevermind being able to handle first line ice time given all the extra skating. So I'm not so sure he's a first liner in the KHL.

But really, this talk of Shanny going to Russia strikes me as a waste of time, because I don't believe he's given it so much as a passing thought.

i agree with you 1,000%

KRM 07-13-2008 04:25 AM

Quite ignorant of some of you, remember that this is just it's first season of play.

Some of the worlds best players already play there too, so it's not like any (well Jagr and Radu) of these players acquired will be poster boys for the KHL.

Pogo 07-13-2008 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by squishy (Post 14853807)
Baranka (23)
Chiodo (25)
Dubielewicz (29)
Emery (25)
Grahame (32)
Hossa (27)
Jagr (35)
N. Kapanen (30)
I. Khomutov (23)
Kwiatkowski (31)
Lampman (25)
S. McCarthy (27)
Ozolinsh (35)
Pilar (31)
Rachunek (28)
Radivojevic (27)
Radulov (22)
Ruzicka (23)
Simon (36) REALLY?!?!?!
Stumpel (36)
Tolpeko (23)
Vasicek (27)
Wanvig (27)
York (30) Really?!
Zyuzin (30)

Lotta Rangers there

eco's bones 07-13-2008 06:34 AM

I was around when the old WHA began. At first a lot of people thought of them as an annoyance or a joke. The major coup for them in that first year was signing on an older Bobby Hull. Later they were able to lure Gordie Howe out of retirement to play with his sons Mark and Marty. To compete the WHA looked to Europe more than the NHL did at the time. In time they began to develop real talent which included two Swedish forwards who eventually wound up in MSG--Anders Hedberg and Ulf Nilsson. With time they began poaching younger and younger talent including quite a number of NHL first round draft picks such as the Rangers own Bobby MacMillan.

The KHL is just getting started. It may be less attactive for most North American born players but in time might become very attractive to European born ones. For Russian born players--to stay home, make more money. Tax free contracts and team owner's with an unlimited money supply. I would worry about Cherepanov. Anisimov and Grachev are in North America because they want to be. I don't get the same vibe from Alexei. At least for the next few seasons he can make a lot more money in his homeland. Expect also the KHL to make up their own rules of conduct as they go along. It's pretty much what the WHA did.

jagrgodr 07-13-2008 06:43 AM

i hope its not an old man's league, i really hope they take all the great european players in the next few years. The NHL isnt that great, and the US as a country is losing its appeal. Come on RUSSIA, steal the euros!

squishy 07-13-2008 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eco's bones (Post 14855421)
I was around when the old WHA began. At first a lot of people thought of them as an annoyance or a joke. The major coup for them in that first year was signing on an older Bobby Hull. Later they were able to lure Gordie Howe out of retirement to play with his sons Mark and Marty. To compete the WHA looked to Europe more than the NHL did at the time. In time they began to develop real talent which included two Swedish forwards who eventually wound up in MSG--Anders Hedberg and Ulf Nilsson. With time they began poaching younger and younger talent including quite a number of NHL first round draft picks such as the Rangers own Bobby MacMillan.

The KHL is just getting started. It may be less attactive for most North American born players but in time might become very attractive to European born ones. For Russian born players--to stay home, make more money. Tax free contracts and team owner's with an unlimited money supply. I would worry about Cherepanov. Anisimov and Grachev are in North America because they want to be. I don't get the same vibe from Alexei. At least for the next few seasons he can make a lot more money in his homeland. Expect also the KHL to make up their own rules of conduct as they go along. It's pretty much what the WHA did.

Great post eco.

And regarding your "making up the rules as they go along" comment -- they already are. For example, they went from a hard salary cap to "players under contract or who have received an offer from the NHL can be offered any amount and it won't count against the cap."

squishy 07-13-2008 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogo (Post 14855419)
Lotta Rangers there

For the record, it's Steve McCarthy, not Sandy.

bmw2004 07-13-2008 09:01 AM

I think it's all about the money that KHL has to offer to all these players. The sponsorship provided from Gasprom and other oil companies is the main factor. In a year or two NHL will not be able to compete with some crazy salaries offered from Russian clubs. Another major reason is the tax differentiation. Per Russian government regulations people only have to pay 13% taxes from their wages.
Money talks guys.

BrianLeetch2 07-13-2008 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw2004 (Post 14855820)
I think it's all about the money that KHL has to offer to all these players. The sponsorship provided from Gasprom and other oil companies is the main factor. In a year or two NHL will not be able to compete with some crazy salaries offered from Russian clubs. Another major reason is the tax differentiation. Per Russian government regulations people only have to pay 13% taxes from their wages.
Money talks guys.

well it could get to the point where we will have just NA players here and the euros playing in russia...with a few exceptions.....KHL could be a problem down the road but not for at least a few years still.....it will get to the point that euros wont even get drafted anymore lol....drafting a guy like ovechkin in the 7th round sounds funny to me

Blueblood 2 07-13-2008 09:43 AM

Wait till Tavares signs for $10million per. Bettman will have a coronary. If not Tavares, it will be some young Canadian star, that will cause a panic north of the border. I think at this point, many North American hockey people just view the migration as opening slots in the league, they believe membership in, is the birth right of their talented youth.

Beacon 07-13-2008 12:50 PM

The Russian people should kiss Putin's rear end for replacing high taxes with a flat tax of only 13% for everyone, no matter how much they make.

The economy skyrocketed after that and their tax revenue doubled within 2 years despite having a tax that's a third of the previous (people stopped cheating on taxes and everyone began investing).

And now the low taxes mean that instead of losing all their hockey players (not just to the NHL, but even to places like Switzerland), Russia is not only taking back their own guys, but stealing players from around the world.


Quote:

Originally Posted by bmw2004 (Post 14855820)
I think it's all about the money that KHL has to offer to all these players. The sponsorship provided from Gasprom and other oil companies is the main factor. In a year or two NHL will not be able to compete with some crazy salaries offered from Russian clubs. Another major reason is the tax differentiation. Per Russian government regulations people only have to pay 13% taxes from their wages.
Money talks guys.


Beacon 07-13-2008 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrianLeetch2 (Post 14855877)
well it could get to the point where we will have just NA players here and the euros playing in russia...with a few exceptions.....KHL could be a problem down the road but not for at least a few years still.....it will get to the point that euros wont even get drafted anymore lol....drafting a guy like ovechkin in the 7th round sounds funny to me

The league expanded on the assumption that Euros will play here. If they all leave, how about the wealthy teams buy out the Islanders and the Edmontons and the Tampas?

Without Euros, a 30-team league would be unsustainable. Even WITH Euros, 30 teams is too much. Proof that 30 teams is too much? An easily playoff team like the Rangers had Hollweg playing as a regular. If Euros leave, he'll be a 3rd liner on a good team and a borderlin power forward on a team like Columbus.

Don't believe me? Look at our team in 2006-07 and take out all the Euros. Then see where Hollweg winds up.

eco's bones 07-13-2008 05:48 PM

For some Europeans the Olympics are the ultimate hockey championship--maybe even for some the European world championships are equivalent to the Stanley Cup. The KHL's scheduling and nearer locations may be more friendly for them to compete in these tournaments--so it may even be that money while still a major reason might not be the 'only' major reason for deciding where their future is. Again I would worry about Cherepanov who has sent a lot of mixed signals over the course of the last couple years--even Anisimov (if it were to happen) being blocked for too long by less talented but more experienced veterans might sour on North America. Everything so far from Grachev is encouraging but the NHL would be better off taking this threat seriously because if the money and the rinks are there the players will come.

Nemchinov13 07-13-2008 08:49 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong (I hope our Czech contributors will do so), but some Extra Liga clubs like Plzen and Sparta Praha have expressed their interest in joining the KHL in the future. Who knows, KHL might just cover not only Russia, but the major Euro hockey nations as well. Kazakhstan, Latvia and Belarus already have their teams in the League.

KRM 07-14-2008 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nemchinov13 (Post 14861615)
Correct me if I'm wrong (I hope our Czech contributors will do so), but some Extra Liga clubs like Plzen and Sparta Praha have expressed their interest in joining the KHL in the future. Who knows, KHL might just cover not only Russia, but the major Euro hockey nations as well. Kazakhstan, Latvia and Belarus already have their teams in the League.

Yes , but the KHL has cap floors and such, don't know the rules are since I doubt that the Kazakhstan, Latvia and Belarus team can come up to these numbers. But the only two teams (Frölunda and Färjestad) in Sweden who are close to cap floor have already been invited.

Nemchinov13 07-14-2008 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krm500 (Post 14864878)
Yes , but the KHL has cap floors and such, don't know the rules are since I doubt that the Kazakhstan, Latvia and Belarus team can come up to these numbers. But the only two teams (Frölunda and Färjestad) in Sweden who are close to cap floor have already been invited.

Frölunda got invited? Sweet! That's the team with whom Henke became Elit-Serien champion, right?

About Kazakhstan, Latvia and Belarus.

Kazakhstan is represented by Barys Astana (Chernyshov Division), Latvia is represented by Dynamo Riga (Kharlamov Division) and Belarus is represented by Dynamo Minsk (Bobrov Division).

Speaking of Old Men, Ray Emery, formerly the Stanley Cup finalist with Ottawa Senators has signed a 1-year $2M deal with Atlant Mytischi (Bobrov Division).


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