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-   -   Proposal: Pit-edm (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=626665)

One Trick Pony* 04-03-2009 07:36 PM

Pit-edm
 
My two favourite teams. Always excites me when these two trade.


To Pittsburgh:
Sam Gagner
1st round pick

To Edmonton:
Jordan Staal


The Pens get a slick young player who can play both center and right-wing. He would be dynamite next to Malkin, and would be a solid option if Sykora decides to walk. They also get a pick somewhere from 10th-12th, and can use that to draft some more top-six wing prospects.

The Oil get a future No. 1 center who can play in every situation.

AK 04-03-2009 07:41 PM

Doesn't really make much sense for either team to do.

Oilers definitely wouldn't do it. Pens may or may not. It depends on what Gagner's next cap hit is estimated at.

One Trick Pony* 04-03-2009 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Letang58 (Post 18861407)
Doesn't really make much sense for either team to do.

Oilers definitely wouldn't do it. Pens may or may not. It depends on what Gagner's next cap hit is estimated at.

I can easily see him putting up 60-75 points with the personnel on the Pens. So that would probably be a 3.5 Million dollar range.

I think Shero would jump all over this.

Free Willy 04-03-2009 08:12 PM

edm would never do it

Joey Moss 04-03-2009 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Willy (Post 18862096)
edm would never do it

nope.

Big McLargehuge 04-03-2009 08:21 PM

Also my two favorite teams...and no way Edmonton does that one.



I'm hoping that that's what Shero would be asking for it he were to shop Staal, but I don't know if there's any GM willing to give up that much...and in which case I'm more than happy keeping Staal on the Penguins.

bzer 04-03-2009 08:26 PM

I don't get the point of these deals.
Teams aren't gaining much as these players deliver similar type of play to their teams.

Are teams swapping players to generate revenue?

oilerfan17 04-03-2009 08:30 PM

I've never been a fan of Staal, so this definitely gets a "no" from me. The guy's a player, but his value is really inflated due to draft position and last name.

BrindamoursNose 04-03-2009 09:38 PM

Edm tells Pitt to move along

Rowdy Roddy Peeper 04-03-2009 11:25 PM

Pittsburgh would have no need for Gagner even if he completely fulfills his potential. The same can't be said for Staal.

I really don't see how a mid-round first is supposed to push the value of the Oilers package far above Staal either.

Roof Daddy 04-03-2009 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Champagne Wishes (Post 18864992)
Pittsburgh would have no need for Gagner even if he completely fulfills his potential. The same can't be said for Staal.

I really don't see how a mid-round first is supposed to push the value of the Oilers package far above Staal either.

And I have no idea why you need to have an avatar that is clearly David Schwimmer playing poker, but instead of cards he's holding a Sears catalogue, but you do.

Just seems funny to me that Pittsburgh would have no need for a player like Gagner to play with one of their big 2. In the end though I realize Talbot, Kennedy, Cooke and Dupuis are all superior options:nod:

Uh, back to reality, I fully agree that it would cost Gagner +, but that + isn't a top 10 pick in this draft. Bring it down a notch and I'd do it from an Oil perspective.

Big McLargehuge 04-04-2009 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof Daddy (Post 18865171)
And I have no idea why you need to have an avatar that is clearly David Schwimmer playing poker, but instead of cards he's holding a Sears catalogue, but you do.

Greenzo slaps his forehead in your direction.

thadd 04-04-2009 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by One Trick Pony (Post 18861218)
My two favourite teams. Always excites me when these two trade.


To Pittsburgh:
Sam Gagner
1st round pick

To Edmonton:
Jordan Staal


The Pens get a slick young player who can play both center and right-wing. He would be dynamite next to Malkin, and would be a solid option if Sykora decides to walk. They also get a pick somewhere from 10th-12th, and can use that to draft some more top-six wing prospects.

The Oil get a future No. 1 center who can play in every situation.

Edmonton says yes. Penguins say no.

Dr Quincy 04-04-2009 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by One Trick Pony (Post 18861218)
My two favourite teams. Always excites me when these two trade.


To Pittsburgh:
Sam Gagner
1st round pick

To Edmonton:
Jordan Staal


The Pens get a slick young player who can play both center and right-wing. He would be dynamite next to Malkin, and would be a solid option if Sykora decides to walk. They also get a pick somewhere from 10th-12th, and can use that to draft some more top-six wing prospects.

The Oil get a future No. 1 center who can play in every situation.

Overpayment for Staal.

Zubrus Coffee Maker 04-04-2009 09:05 PM

it seems we have quite a conundrum going here

Rowdy Roddy Peeper 04-04-2009 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof Daddy (Post 18865171)
And I have no idea why you need to have an avatar that is clearly David Schwimmer playing poker, but instead of cards he's holding a Sears catalogue, but you do.

You, sir, have led a sheltered life. Or not sheltered enough.

Quote:

Just seems funny to me that Pittsburgh would have no need for a player like Gagner to play with one of their big 2. In the end though I realize Talbot, Kennedy, Cooke and Dupuis are all superior options:nod:
It isn't a question of talent, it's a question of skillset and position.

The Penguins quite obviously have their top 2 centers lined up for the foreseeable future. Gagner is a natural center. If he were kept in his natural position, he'd be as "held back" as Staal on the 3rd line but without providing near the same defensive benefits, and if he were moved to the wing, not only would he have to adjust to a new position, he'd still be a pass-first player, which is the last thing this team needs more of.

Quote:

Uh, back to reality, I fully agree that it would cost Gagner +, but that + isn't a top 10 pick in this draft. Bring it down a notch and I'd do it from an Oil perspective.
There's no reason to renegotiate a deal that didn't work at all in the first place. We do not need a Gagner in the slightest, skilled and promising though he may be.

GeoffreyPaul 04-05-2009 12:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof Daddy (Post 18865171)
And I have no idea why you need to have an avatar that is clearly David Schwimmer playing poker, but instead of cards he's holding a Sears catalogue, but you do.

Just seems funny to me that Pittsburgh would have no need for a player like Gagner to play with one of their big 2. In the end though I realize Talbot, Kennedy, Cooke and Dupuis are all superior options:nod:

Uh, back to reality, I fully agree that it would cost Gagner +, but that + isn't a top 10 pick in this draft. Bring it down a notch and I'd do it from an Oil perspective.


Personally, I feel that Shero would have to think about the deal. But I feel that it is clear that he has very high hopes for Staal. And if Staal continues his current play into the playoffs, his trade value goes up from there.

But I feel that Staal will be a Penguin until at least next years trade deadline. He benefits the Penguins by being there.

TheCH* 04-05-2009 12:24 AM

More like Staal for Gagner straight up.

GeoffreyPaul 04-05-2009 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheCH (Post 18884200)
More like Staal for Gagner straight up.

Staal has more value do to his defensive game and his playoff experience.

One could make the argument that both of their upsides offset each other. But being as Staal is now starting to take off since his line is being put into a more offensive role, and if his play continues through the playoffs, then his value goes up.

If it were straight-up, the Shero never does it as this trade would not do anything more than what we are already sitting on. Adding a first rounder would be something to think about, be even then, it doesn't help us now.

shoop 04-05-2009 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thadd (Post 18874740)
Edmonton says yes. Penguins say no.

Shero would be an absolute fool to turn down the deal in the OP.

The Oilers are still looking at a top 10 pick this season.

Straight up is a reasonable deal. Either Shero or Tambo could ask the other guy to throw in a 4th or 5th rounder and not be completely off-base.

Stall's contract doesn't appear to be a particularly good one. $4M a year for the next four years.


Gagner + a 1st for Staal would be one of the most lopsided trades in league history.

GeoffreyPaul 04-05-2009 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoop (Post 18884405)
Shero would be an absolute fool to turn down the deal in the OP.

The Oilers are still looking at a top 10 pick this season.

Straight up is a reasonable deal. Either Shero or Tambo could ask the other guy to throw in a 4th or 5th rounder and not be completely off-base.

Stall's contract doesn't appear to be a particularly good one. $4M a year for the next four years.


Gagner + a 1st for Staal would be one of the most lopsided trades in league history.

To your last comment, no, not even close.

To your other comments, no, still not close as far as even value.

People forget what Staal brings to the table currently. Most look at his stats and cap hit and make their judgment. They do not look at how he was used under Therrien, who he has played or how he has played since Bylsma has become the head coach. Not to mention his potential.

I personally do like Gagner, but he doesn't have playoff experience (Which does hold value when you're talking about young players and a team who is trying to get there). If Edmonton were to trade for Staal, they would have to overpay to get him in some sense. In fact, I bet that most teams would because I really don't believe that Staal will be traded any time soon. Which is the overall consensus around Pittsburgh now.

Rowdy Roddy Peeper 04-05-2009 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoop (Post 18884405)
Shero would be an absolute fool to turn down the deal in the OP.

Either a fool, or a GM who understands his club's strengths and weaknesses and wants to ice a contending team now rather than collect a stable of unproven young talent that won't improve his team for at least another couple of years, if ever.

Quote:

Straight up is a reasonable deal. Either Shero or Tambo could ask the other guy to throw in a 4th or 5th rounder and not be completely off-base.
Why, for the love of all things holy, would a playoff team with two elite playmaking talents at center trade a huge, effective defensive presence for another playmaking center that's no more productive, and that they don't need?

Value aside...why?

Quote:

Stall's contract doesn't appear to be a particularly good one. $4M a year for the next four years.
You figure that 20+ goal and 40+ point scorers with Staal's defensive play are pretty common, do you? Let alone one with Staal's potential to do much more?

By all means, go pick one up for yourself. Elsewhere.

The Polak* 04-05-2009 01:23 AM

Staal + 1st for Gagner and maybe EDM thinks about it

YellHockey* 04-06-2009 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Polak (Post 18884846)
Staal + 1st for Gagner and maybe EDM thinks about it

Thinks? Who in the Oiler organization is capable of that process?

Valic 04-06-2009 11:36 AM

I wouldn't trade Gagner straight up for Staal, let alone throw in a likely top 10 pick.


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