HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   Philadelphia Flyers (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=21)
-   -   Injury Report: Jim McCrossin (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=656757)

qwertysac 06-30-2009 03:58 AM

Jim McCrossin
 
I'm just curious about other peoples opinion about him.

Now that Reggie Lemelin is gone (finally), anybody else think that Jim McCrossin should go next?

Am i the only person who feels that it's a bit weird that so many players on the team get similar injuries (especially groin) and also that players keep coming back ahead of schedule from serious injuries?

Or is that all just a coincidence and bad luck which has nothing to do with McCrossin? :help:

Lab Monkey 06-30-2009 04:52 AM

its seemed to me for years now that McCrossin has been a major issue with this team, time after time players are coming back way to early or getting injured by things that just shouldn't happen (groin injuries). Somebody should be held accountable for the what is it now 1000 man games lost due to injury in the last 2-3 seasons?

Dig Out Your Soul 06-30-2009 07:35 AM

So McCrossin's not injured?

LEIFey 06-30-2009 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul (Post 20149571)
So McCrossin's not injured?

yeah, i'd be lying if i said my fingers weren't crossed.

DeadPhish5858 06-30-2009 08:07 AM

He kinda looks like a much older Mats Sundin.

JLHockeyKnight 06-30-2009 08:31 AM

This makes sense. Not. Let's blame McCrossin for the injuries rather than the physical style of hockey they play.

As much as I'm not a fan of McCrossin, the only thing you can blame him for is re-injuries or mis-diagnosis. Can't really blame him for the large amount of groin injuries. Lots of teams have groin injuries, it comes from the new NHL and faster game. I remember the first season back from the lockout players were going down left and right from groin problems. Still, the other injuries comes down to the fact that they play "Flyers hockey."

GKJ 06-30-2009 08:41 AM

The risk you take when you play the way we play.

Opus 06-30-2009 09:32 AM

This thread is utter and complete bull****.

Everybody likes to point the finger and at what point are the player accountable??? This is a ****ing joke.

Luca Sbisa said in an interview that he tweaked his groin in camp last year and didn't tell the Flyers training staff.

----> Link

If the players aren't forward, honest and upfront about some of their hampering injuries, what the **** do you want the training staff to do???

JLHockeyKnight 06-30-2009 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Opus (Post 20150360)
This thread is utter and complete bull****.

Everybody likes to point the finger and at what point are the player accountable??? This is a ****ing joke.

Luca Sbisa said in an interview that he tweaked his groin in camp last year and didn't tell the Flyers training staff.

----> Link

If the players aren't forward, honest and upfront about some of their hampering injuries, what the **** do you want the training staff to do???

I was wondering how long it was gonna take for you to chime in.

Opus 06-30-2009 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight (Post 20150490)
I was wondering how long it was gonna take for you to chime in.

5-1/2 hours from the OP.

I'd make a horrible paramedic.

Sawdalite 06-30-2009 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go kim johnsson 514 (Post 20149900)
The risk you take when you play the way we play.

I agree with that... If you want a team that goes all out and is an aggressive hitting team rather than a passive one, expect more injuries.

But that is only the answer to why the Flyers are one of the more injured teams in the NHL, IMO... As alluded to on here already, the hard hitting game, played by big and fast moving speedier men has to be a major factor also.

BUT to point fingers at McCrossin as a contributor to the amount and length, as well as the sometimes too early return is to me wrong... Trainers and conditioners, as well as doctors, rely greatly on what the players/patients tell them. They can take only so much from the tests and physical responses; much of their treatment and decisions, after the initial treatment and regiment, is decided on going by what players tell them as to how and what they are feeling... and this also can be said initially, when they are first aware of the injury/problem. If players don't keep a dialogue going with them about their condition, how can the trainer or physician know of discomfort, unless there are obvious signs? For a great example; Sbisa, back in the earlier part of the season felt discomfort in his groin which he chose not to disclose, for one reason or another -- not to be taken out of the lineup? Being a foolish teenager? Who knows why? -- It as only now been discovered... How can McCrossin be in any way responsible? The same can be said for a player such as Primeau or Roenick who swear that they have no ill effects and are are ready and able to play.

Also, we must take into consideration that there was less information on many things in the past... what now seems like a no brainer, was not the case when the events occurred.

Just my take on it................

Sawdalite 06-30-2009 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Opus (Post 20150360)
This thread is utter and complete bull****.

Everybody likes to point the finger and at what point are the player accountable??? This is a ****ing joke.

Luca Sbisa said in an interview that he tweaked his groin in camp last year and didn't tell the Flyers training staff.

----> Link

If the players aren't forward, honest and upfront about some of their hampering injuries, what the **** do you want the training staff to do???

Exactly correct.

TheKingPin 06-30-2009 10:35 AM

People coming back too early is on the doctors, not the training staff. And def on the players if they lie like opus said. I do feel like this area could use a change in that maybe pregame stretching etc needs improvement with all these groin pulls.

CantSeeColors 06-30-2009 10:57 AM

The desire of a player to come back from an injury too soon is the same desire that got them to the NHL in the first place. That's never going to change, especially by pointing the finger at the training staff.

Opus 06-30-2009 11:20 AM

While we're at it, let's send Derek Settlemyre to the firing squad.

It's disgusting how many times Carter is high and wide. Certainly not the players fault, never is...let's blame somebody else. I'm pretty sure if we hired a new equipment manager, Carter would be good for about 150 goals.

Inexcusable.

Jester 06-30-2009 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheKingPin (Post 20151147)
People coming back too early is on the doctors, not the training staff. And def on the players if they lie like opus said. I do feel like this area could use a change in that maybe pregame stretching etc needs improvement with all these groin pulls.

Recent research suggests that stretching has no impact on stopping strains and pulls...go figure. However, it seems to make sense given that the majority of the time you see an injury it's when the player is exerting himself and the muscle is contracting.

The trainers and training staffs of the world -- who do very good and important work -- get put way too high up as far as what they are actually doing and capable of doing. Trainers help train guys...they are not medical doctors, they are not qualified to tell you if a guy's head is OK from a concussion, they are not qualified to go in and look at a knee...they're qualified to come up with training regimes, etc.

Jester 06-30-2009 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Opus (Post 20151870)
While we're at it, let's send Derek Settlemyre to the firing squad.

It's disgusting how many times Carter is high and wide. Certainly not the players fault, never is...let's blame somebody else. I'm pretty sure if we hired a new equipment manager, Carter would be good for about 150 goals.

Inexcusable.

You do wonder if Carter should consider using a stick with a bit less loft to it.

UseYourAllusion 06-30-2009 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester (Post 20152000)
Recent research suggests that stretching has no impact on stopping strains and pulls...go figure. However, it seems to make sense given that the majority of the time you see an injury it's when the player is exerting himself and the muscle is contracting.

Do you mean just stretching before a game? Or stretching as part of exercise to become more flexible? I'm pretty sure that the latter is quite effective.

Jester 06-30-2009 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UseYourAllusion (Post 20152057)
Do you mean just stretching before a game? Or stretching as part of exercise to become more flexible? I'm pretty sure that the latter is quite effective.

Apparently not.

I know it destroyed my understanding of what I was doing before every game and practice I've done my entire life, but it was in some medical journal or whatever and a (qualified) friend was telling us about it before we played a hockey game a while back.

Now, obviously if you are hyper-flexing a muscle you might do damage if you're not stretching for flexibility, but as noted...that's not when most of these injuries are happening...they're happening when a guy is running or exerting himself and the hammy/groin doesn't like the contraction (not the flex).

Murphy7 06-30-2009 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Opus (Post 20151870)
While we're at it, let's send Derek Settlemyre to the firing squad.

It's disgusting how many times Carter is high and wide. Certainly not the players fault, never is...let's blame somebody else. I'm pretty sure if we hired a new equipment manager, Carter would be good for about 150 goals.

Inexcusable.

I thought Carter shot high and wide because as he looked up at the net, he was scoping out the chick in Section 120, Row 2, Seat 1.

Players get hurt, plain and simple. No one on this side of the glass knows what kind of job McCrossin is doing. Only the players and team staff can know. Besides, one of the biggest injury problems is concussions (as far as long-term devastation). There's not much that can be done to prevent concussions as far as training.

Sawdalite 06-30-2009 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester (Post 20152000)
Recent research suggests that stretching has no impact on stopping strains and pulls...go figure. However, it seems to make sense given that the majority of the time you see an injury it's when the player is exerting himself and the muscle is contracting.

The trainers and training staffs of the world -- who do very good and important work -- get put way too high up as far as what they are actually doing and capable of doing. Trainers help train guys...they are not medical doctors, they are not qualified to tell you if a guy's head is OK from a concussion, they are not qualified to go in and look at a knee...they're qualified to come up with training regimes, etc.

I believe that the discussion morphed into the players injuries as they pertain to the control of the organization... and just how much the organization is to blame for the occurrences and severity, and how early returning effects them.

I believe that some people would like us to believe that the trainers and medical people under Homer's ultimate command is negligent, and replacing them would reduce the injury problem... I greatly disagree.

I agree totally with you that trainers are just that, trainers... It is their job to be educated and apply that education to both instruct/educate the players on how they can better their bodies and conditioning, and assist them in their workouts... as well as attend to their needs. The trainers can only work with the current information, and sometimes that information proves to have been incorrect.

The trainers do not have the responsibility that some people think they do... That said, if Homer feels that McCrossin isn't the best person for that position, I believe that he will replace him as he has with others.

sa cyred 06-30-2009 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester (Post 20152154)
Apparently not.

I know it destroyed my understanding of what I was doing before every game and practice I've done my entire life, but it was in some medical journal or whatever and a (qualified) friend was telling us about it before we played a hockey game a while back.

Now, obviously if you are hyper-flexing a muscle you might do damage if you're not stretching for flexibility, but as noted...that's not when most of these injuries are happening...they're happening when a guy is running or exerting himself and the hammy/groin doesn't like the contraction (not the flex).

I can confirm on this. I am a college athlete (soccer) and have been playing for years. It wasn't until 3-4 years ago I heard of this. Streching actually gives you a better chance of pulling something. I remember them explaining it to us, but I cant remember the exact words. All I know is that my last year playing highschool soccer, on club team, and my college team all stopped streching before games. I do alittle stetching here and there, but nothing over the top like some tell you to do. It is better to do plyometrics before hand.

Jester 06-30-2009 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sa cyred (Post 20152951)
I can confirm on this. I am a college athlete (soccer) and have been playing for years. It wasn't until 3-4 years ago I heard of this. Streching actually gives you a better chance of pulling something. I remember them explaining it to us, but I cant remember the exact words. All I know is that my last year playing highschool soccer, on club team, and my college team all stopped streching before games. I do alittle stetching here and there, but nothing over the top like some tell you to do. It is better to do plyometrics before hand.

Well, I think you're definitely supposed to stretch AFTER, but the before flexibility thing has been shot down. And I think the post-workout stretching is more about keeping the muscle fresh and not tightening up more than anything else.

JLHockeyKnight 06-30-2009 12:44 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong.

I thought "building" muscle was actually "rebuilding" muscle. Whenever you work out you're constantly tearing muscle (really really small) so when you work out and rest your body heals, and like callist skin the muscle comes back bigger, stronger, etc. So when you stretch beforehand, you're creating small tears early in your muscles to allow more room to move and flex, so that your muscles don't lock up and you get a big tear (serious injury). So overstretching can be bad, but I don't think stretching is all bad?

Does that make sense or am I talking out my ass? Can't remember where I heard that or read it, but that's the impression I was always under.

sa cyred 06-30-2009 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester (Post 20153161)
Well, I think you're definitely supposed to stretch AFTER, but the before flexibility thing has been shot down. And I think the post-workout stretching is more about keeping the muscle fresh and not tightening up more than anything else.

Thats correct. I didnt add in the after thing, because I thought the discussion was just on static stretches before games. I knew I read something about it. Heres the link/part:

http://www.pilatesrunner.com/drillswarmup/warmup2.htm
Quote:

Stretching reduces strength and sporting performance for 1 and sometimes up to 24 hours
A Canadian study found muscle strength reduced for 1 hour after static stretching(2) . The same study found static stretching reduced performance (tested jump) and dynamic running and jumping stretches improved performance. Also, 20m sprint times were slower after static stretches. A University of Hawaii study with 30 PE students doing a 1 rep max of knee flexion and knee extension found static stretching reduced strength in flexion 7.3% & in extension 8.1%(3).
(Tightening after a game hurts like a b*tch)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:20 PM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.