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-   -   Coyotes That Fell Off The Map (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=701718)

Tom Polakis 11-09-2009 09:19 AM

Coyotes That Fell Off The Map
 
I don't know how often you all go to the main NHL board, but there is currently a thread titled "Players that fell off the map" discussing those players who were destined for greatness and just stopped producing at their prime age. There is a disproportionate number of Coyotes on this list. The usual suspects include Mikael Renberg, Robert Reichel, Oleg Tverdovsky, Ladislav Nagy, etc.

The thing about the Maloney era is that we haven't seemed to make any of these types of acquisitions during his tenure. I don't see any of these types of names on our current roster, unless you want to pick on Mueller after his promising rookie season.

PhoPhan 11-09-2009 10:26 AM

You could maybe make the case for Jokinen, but his descent probably started before he got to Phoenix.

knowsthegame 11-09-2009 12:01 PM

Recent EX Coyotes seem to be doing quite well overall lately:
Steven Reinprecht leads in goals in Fla
Freddy Sjostrom and Nigel Dawes playing regular shift in Cal
Derek Morris logging top minutes in Bos playing with Chara
Carcillo got 2 goals in 1 game last week for Philly
Even Scatcher is playing (can't remember which NHL team)

Piokinen 11-09-2009 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knowsthegame (Post 22038492)
Recent EX Coyotes seem to be doing quite well overall lately:
Steven Reinprecht leads in goals in Fla
Freddy Sjostrom and Nigel Dawes playing regular shift in Cal
Derek Morris logging top minutes in Bos playing with Chara
Carcillo got 2 goals in 1 game last week for Philly
Even Scatcher is playing (can't remember which NHL team)

he is in Nashville now.

Lisin is doing also pretty well in NY
Jokinen is still on the decline in Calgary while Prust is doing pretty well there with 4p in 11 with a + 5.
Fedoruk is still Fedoruk and Hale is still Hale but he is + 3 in 11 games with 3 assists playing 20 minutes a night:amazed:

Naych_PHX 11-09-2009 12:10 PM

Nick Boynton to an extent. Robert Esche awhile back.

rt 11-09-2009 12:34 PM

Renberg actually experienced a bit of a resurgence after leaving Phoenix. Same for Tverdovsky. Boynton had already fallen way off before he ever got here. Reichel put up a point per game here, and then took off to the Czech Republic because he couldn't bring himself to play for the Coyotes any longer(put up a point per game in the Czech league, too). Things quickly declined when he returned to the NHL two years later, but it was, after all, two years later. Ladislav Nagy's decline can be blamed on injuries. Hrdina was fairly inconsistent before he ever got here. Still, he had his last good season the year before we traded for him. So I guess he would count. Mike Johnson is one guy that definitely completely fell off the face of the planet inexplicably. I guess sitting out a season with injury, and then sitting out the next season due to the lockout can be blamed to an extent.

Travis Green is probably a guy who you could say dried up and blew away in the desert. Sergei Berezin, too. He was a consistent twenty or thirty goalscorer before he got here, completely busted, bounced around a bit failing out of the NHL, went back to Europe, sucked for a while, and then hung 'em up. Berezin is probably the best example we have.

PhoPhan 11-09-2009 12:55 PM

Brian Savage?

Tony Amonte?

Petr Nedved?

knowsthegame 11-09-2009 01:04 PM

Brian Boucher and Alex Auld still playing back up roles.
Abisher went back to Europe. Don't know if he's playing there or not.
Cujo hasn't announced retirement, but pretty sure his career is finished.

rt 11-09-2009 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhoPhan (Post 22039320)


Oh yeah. I remember the day they signed Amonte. I had always hated him from his Chicago days, and I was really hoping for Theo Fleury. Still, not yet hardened by the constant ******** that emanated from the franchise in those days, I bought the snake oil, and got so very excited.

I was pissed at the return we got for Langkow, who was my favorite Coyote at the time, but super excited about signing Nedved. I resigned myself to the fact that while Langkow > Saprykin and Gauthier, Langkow < Nedved, Saprykin, Gauthier. Well, turns out I was wrong. So typical of Mike Barnett. "Well, we can sign Nedved, but we'll have to dump Langkow. I guess we'll just move him for the first crap offer that comes along." :shakehead

Tom Polakis 11-09-2009 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rt (Post 22038995)
Mike Johnson is one guy that definitely completely fell off the face of the planet inexplicably...


Yeah, he was one of my favorite players to see going into corners in the offensive zone. I'd put that 02-03 Nagy-Langkow-Johnson line above any the Coyotes ever put together, including Tkachuk-Roenick-Drake. Hockeydb.com shows Johnson playing in Germany last season, and nothing this year at age 33.

mouser 11-09-2009 02:18 PM

Sergei Berezin. Thankfully he was only here a brief while.

Sinurgy 11-09-2009 02:35 PM

Jesus, from now on whenever some yahoo comes on here and starts spouting off about how Phoenix doesn't deserve a team, blah, blah, blah, we should just point them to this thread. How can you possibly expect to build a huge loyal fan base with that kind of history.

I can't believe how in denial I've been this whole time. We're "that" team!

AnalogMan 11-09-2009 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinurgy (Post 22040682)
Jesus, from now on whenever some yahoo comes on here and starts spouting off about how Phoenix doesn't deserve a team, blah, blah, blah, we should just point them to this thread. How can you possibly expect to build a huge loyal fan base with that kind of history.

I can't believe how in denial I've been this whole time. We're "that" team!

Posted this in another thread, and it tells anyone anything they ever need to know on why the Coyotes have sucked ass since they've been in Phoenix:

PLAYERPICK #YEAR
Juha Gustaffson2-43 1997
Patrick DesRochers1-141998
Ossi Vaananen2-431998
Scott Kelman1-151999
Kiril Safronov1-191999
Brad Ralph 2-531999
Krys Kolanos1-192000
Alexander Tatarinov2-532000
Fredrik Sjostrom1-112001
Matthew Spiller2-312001
Martin Podlesak2-452001
Jakub Koreis1-192002
Ben Eager1-232002
David LeNeveu2-462002
Tyler Redenbach3-772003
Blake Wheeler1-52004
Logan Stephenson2-352004
Enver Lisin2-502004
Martin Hanzal1-172005
Pier-Olivier Pelletier2-592005
Peter Mueller1-82006
Chris Summers1-292006
Kyle Turris1-32007
Nick Ross1-302007
Brett MacLean2-322007
Joel Gistedt2-362007
Mikkel Boedker1-82008
Viktor Tikhonov1-282008
Jared Staal2-492008

rt 11-09-2009 03:12 PM

You left off Dan Focht. Bobby Smith probably read his name, laughed like Beavis, and picked him in the first round just so he could say his name into a microphone.

pyregretzky 11-09-2009 05:33 PM

Are you trying to make me remember the Brett Hull era? :(

yakko 11-09-2009 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyregretzky (Post 22042978)
Are you trying to make me remember the Brett Hull era? :(

Shouldn't there be a minimum number of games to call it an era?

SniperHF 11-09-2009 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yakko (Post 22043281)
Shouldn't there be a minimum number of games to call it an era?

Maybe normally, but he might be the biggest name to ever play for the team while in Phoenix.

wpgyotes 11-09-2009 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SniperHF (Post 22043327)
Maybe normally, but he might be the biggest name to ever play for the team while in Phoenix.

Unfortunately he was just a big body when he arrived here.

SniperHF 11-09-2009 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wpgyotes (Post 22043941)
Unfortunately he was just a big body when he arrived here.

Yep, but I've been chewing on it more since I posted that and can't think of any other player with more impact to the NHL as a whole to play for the Yotes. Kinda depressing.

Bandit34 11-09-2009 08:00 PM

Mike Leclerc. He was one of our better players when he was here but I dont remember what has happened to him after we traded him for Reinphrect.

XX 11-09-2009 08:39 PM

Ramzi Abid.

yakko 11-10-2009 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bandit34 (Post 22044846)
Mike Leclerc. He was one of our better players when he was here but I dont remember what has happened to him after we traded him for Reinphrect.

That's a really good one. I did some cursory searching and it really looks like he completely fell off of map after that season. I was reminded of him when the Coyotes signed Pyatt. The scouting reports seemed similar (good 3rd/4th liner, looks like a top 6 guy some shifts).

Drake Berehowsky looked like he was going somewhere until he came to Phoenix. Didn't he wear a letter in Nashville or Vancouver? I remember thinking that he did when he came to Phoenix and hoping he had some leadership skills. He put up pretty good points for a defenseman the couple of years before coming to Phoenix and played a physical game too.

Chootoi 11-10-2009 08:16 AM

Danny Markov. Man I missed that guy when he left, he was fun to watch. I think he went to Detroit for a bit and then that was it for him.

I don't think he was really on the map to begin with, but I remember when Joakim Lindstrom first came and he scored like 5 goals right off the bat and was schooling goalies in the shootout... by the end of the year he was just another smelt.

Radoslav Suchy is another that comes to mind. He played 4-5 solid years here and rarely missed any games, then I think he went to Columbus for a bit and I believe that was it for him too.

mouser 11-10-2009 10:56 AM

Back around 2001 I did some sessions with a professional management coach, a lot of stuff on understanding personality styles and how to manage different types of people as well as adjust your own personality style for different roles.

He had a story he liked to tell how he met a young Coyotes player one summer that was living with a family he knew. Talking with the player, one of the things he asked him was what he practiced on over the summer. Skating? Nope. Conditioning? Nope. Positioning? Nope. Talking further the player told him [paraphrased] 'I have this gift of being able to put a puck into a 6" square upper corner of the net while skating at full speed', so he spent the summer working on his best aspect--his shot--while ignoring many of his deficiencies.

The moral of the story was supposed to be how we tend to focus on training people's deficiencies, when there is sometimes more merit in focusing on training their strengths. I never did get the opportunity to confirm the player's name with this coach, but I'm pretty sure I know who it was, and that player didn't last terribly long with the Coyotes after I heard the story. Anyone want to take a guess who it was?

Chootoi 11-10-2009 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mouser (Post 22050682)
Back around 2001 I did some sessions with a professional management coach, a lot of stuff on understanding personality styles and how to manage different types of people as well as adjust your own personality style for different roles.

He had a story he liked to tell how he met a young Coyotes player one summer that was living with a family he knew. Talking with the player, one of the things he asked him was what he practiced on over the summer. Skating? Nope. Conditioning? Nope. Positioning? Nope. Talking further the player told him [paraphrased] 'I have this gift of being able to put a puck into a 6" square upper corner of the net while skating at full speed', so he spent the summer working on his best aspect--his shot--while ignoring many of his deficiencies.

The moral of the story was supposed to be how we tend to focus on training people's deficiencies, when there is sometimes more merit in focusing on training their strengths. I never did get the opportunity to confirm the player's name with this coach, but I'm pretty sure I know who it was, and that player didn't last terribly long with the Coyotes after I heard the story. Anyone want to take a guess who it was?

Kolanos? He could always pick cherries off a tree with his shot.


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