HFBoards

HFBoards (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/index.php)
-   International Tournaments (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Olympics: Delayed Penalty Own-Net Goal (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=744918)

Jonathan Iilahti* 03-02-2010 12:53 AM

Delayed Penalty Own-Net Goal
 
No touch icing possibly presents a weird situation that could cause a rule contradiction. If team A is called for a penalty and the puck goes into their own net from beyond the center line and is touched last by a player from Team B, is it a goal or is it icing?

fronkjonk* 03-02-2010 12:57 AM

So it crosses the goal line into the net?

I would assume a goal, and wasting your time asking was ridiculous.

DL44 03-02-2010 12:59 AM

Can't ice the puck to your own zone....
it would be a goal.

The time it happened in the Canada game... it was a mistake blowing the whistle... the refs crossed themselves up

Stick To Your Guns 03-02-2010 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fronkjonk (Post 24217314)
So it crosses the goal line into the net?

I would assume a goal, and wasting your time asking was ridiculous.

Easy bud it was just a question. I was confused too with that call by the refs.

Jonathan Iilahti* 03-02-2010 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fronkjonk (Post 24217314)
So it crosses the goal line into the net?

I would assume a goal, and wasting your time asking was ridiculous.

Do you think before you post, or just spew the first garbage idea that comes into your head?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DL44 (Post 24217329)
Can't ice the puck to your own zone....
it would be a goal.

The time it happened in the Canada game... it was a mistake blowing the whistle... the refs crossed themselves up

It happens a lot on a delayed penalty when the team with penalty against touches the puck but does not gain possession and play carries on. If that happened and the puck tipped off of one of their sticks and down the ice, it could be icing.

Bandit 03-02-2010 01:03 AM

This is impossible, even in the one remote situation where it could theoretically even happen. The team would have to shoot the puck prior to taking the penalty and the Goalie would have to leave the net before the puck made it down the ice. Never gonna happen.

robdicks 03-02-2010 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217276)
No touch icing possibly presents a weird situation that could cause a rule contradiction. If team A is called for a penalty and the puck goes into their own net from beyond the center line and is touched last by a player from Team B, is it a goal or is it icing?

are you talking about this :




except its tipping off the opponents stick for an icing?

Jonathan Iilahti* 03-02-2010 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robdicks (Post 24217398)
are you talking about this :




except its tipping off the opponents stick for an icing?

Yeah, that's the situation I'm trying to describe.

Bandit 03-02-2010 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robdicks (Post 24217398)

except its tipping off the opponents stick for an icing?

In order to ice the puck you have to intentionally shoot it down the ice, it can't just bounce off your ass when you're not looking if it's shot by the other team and you get called for icing. Shooting it down the ice means control. Control on a delayed penalty means a whistle. Never going to happen.

robdicks 03-02-2010 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217413)
Yeah, that's the situation I'm trying to describe.

i am almost positive that would be a goal then...

because its not icing if its going into the net right? PLUS i believe if the puck goes through the crease icing is negated anyways

Jonathan Iilahti* 03-02-2010 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robdicks (Post 24217430)
i am almost positive that would be a goal then...

because its not icing if its going into the net right? PLUS i believe if the puck goes through the crease icing is negated anyways

It's usually not icing if it's going into the net because the goalie stops it. But technically the icing line is the same line as the goal line.

Germz 03-02-2010 01:16 AM

No way this counts. A puck in the net does NOT automatically count as a goal. For example - it could be kicked in, shot after the whistle, or deflected in by a high stick.

Case in point: does anybody remember when Travis Green kicked the puck from his own blueline into the Lightning net? Daren Puppa wanted the icing call, so he didn't stop it. The puck went straight into the net. It was kicked in, though, and the refs knew that it wouldn't count, so they didn't blow the whistle. It was a race for the puck between Dykhuis and Green. They skated the length of the ice at full steam, and then both went barreling into the empty net. Puppa stepped out of the way at the last moment. Was it icing or not? The video replay was inconclusive. You couldn't tell, from any angle, whether Dykhuis or Green touched the puck first. So they had the faceoff at centre ice.

Good question.

Bandit 03-02-2010 01:19 AM

Are you guys sure you're Canadian?

robdicks 03-02-2010 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217447)
It's usually not icing if it's going into the net because the goalie stops it. But technically the icing line is the same line as the goal line.



although the leafs were on a pp... so i guess that doesnt help haha

robdicks 03-02-2010 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217447)
It's usually not icing if it's going into the net because the goalie stops it. But technically the icing line is the same line as the goal line.

sure but if the puck goes through the crease icing is supposed to be waived off no?

glucker 03-02-2010 01:43 AM

guys, it's not icing if it goes into the net... just think back to any empty net situation, where the defending team shoots it at the net from their own zone... they're not going for an icing, they're going for the goal. In fact, I'm fairly certain I've seen empty net goals from across the ice before.

robdicks 03-02-2010 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glucker (Post 24217747)
guys, it's not icing if it goes into the net... just think back to any empty net situation, where the defending team shoots it at the net from their own zone... they're not going for an icing, they're going for the goal. In fact, I'm fairly certain I've seen empty net goals from across the ice before.

yeah of course ur right haha... i think the op is trying to say the auto-icing would negate that... but yeah if it goes it it wouldn't be icing

HarlemsFinest 03-02-2010 01:52 AM

meh i thought it was just if the goalies left to play the puck or if it's coming towards him.

if it comes towards the goalie, it's a shot, no?

Jonathan Iilahti* 03-02-2010 02:05 AM

The more I think about this, the more idiotic my question seems. Obviously it would be a goal. I think I'm drinking too much.

Stripes 03-02-2010 04:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217367)
It happens a lot on a delayed penalty when the team with penalty against touches the puck but does not gain possession and play carries on. If that happened and the puck tipped off of one of their sticks and down the ice, it could be icing.

1. If a player on the offending team touches the puck intentionally, that is a controlled action and play is stopped to call the penalty.

2. If a player on the offending team touches the puck unintentionally (IE: a blocked shot), it's not icing. Icing has to be an intentional clearing of the puck down the ice from your own side of centre ice.

3. Just for the record, no physical action of the team about to be penalized can have anything to do with the puck going into the non-offending team's empty net. The non-offending team has to put it into their own net completely via their own actions. Seeing the Shane O'Brien gaffe in this thread, even though he was pressured by a Phoenix forward, it stood because his action on the puck was the only action that put the puck into the net.

Quote:

Originally Posted by topher0805 (Post 24217447)
It's usually not icing if it's going into the net because the goalie stops it. But technically the icing line is the same line as the goal line.

No, it's not. It's the goal line. The goal line is used for icing purposes. "Icing line" is not a term in hockey.

Quote:

Originally Posted by robdicks (Post 24217613)
sure but if the puck goes through the crease icing is supposed to be waived off no?

Not anymore. In the NHL, once they modified the goal crease in the mid-late 90s, it was pointless to have that rule. It also no longer exists in the Hockey Canada rulebook. I couldn't tell you off the top of my head if USA Hockey and the IIHF still wave off icing through the crease.

Dolemite 03-02-2010 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robdicks (Post 24217430)
i am almost positive that would be a goal then...

because its not icing if its going into the net right? PLUS i believe if the puck goes through the crease icing is negated anyways

I was at that game. It was a goal.

Sanderson 03-02-2010 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stripes (Post 24218251)
3. Just for the record, no physical action of the team about to be penalized can have anything to do with the puck going into the non-offending team's empty net. The non-offending team has to put it into their own net completely via their own actions.

Funny enough, in international hockey even that is only possible for about two or three years now. Before that, a delayed penalty against team A meant that team A couldn't score, even if team B put it into their own net.

If a team accidentally put the puck into their own net, the goal would have been waived off. Play would have stopped and the penalty would have been handed out.

They changed it to allow such goals in summer 2007 I think.

Modo 03-02-2010 08:05 AM

Dallas nearly had an own-goal in the playoffs vs. Vancouver; Turco was pulled for the extra attacker, and Modano missed a pass to the point, which caromed off the boards and headed back towards the open Stars net.

Missed by inches. :laugh:

Shwag33 03-02-2010 08:36 AM

Once again, how can you get called for icing to your own zone.


The only way this could happen is:

1. Someone on team A shoots the puck down the ice.
2. Team A takes a penalty after this puck is shot.
3. Team B manages to realize this penalty in such a time that the goalie is pulled WHILE the puck is traveling at its own net.

Yeah, ummmm never ever going to happen.

Espher 03-02-2010 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by czwalga (Post 24219305)
Once again, how can you get called for icing to your own zone.


The only way this could happen is:

1. Someone on team A shoots the puck down the ice.
2. Team A takes a penalty after this puck is shot.
3. Team B manages to realize this penalty in such a time that the goalie is pulled WHILE the puck is traveling at its own net.

Yeah, ummmm never ever going to happen.

1. Someone on Team A shoots the puck down the ice.
2. Team A takes a penalty while the puck is in transit.
3. Team B has already pulled their goalie, as it is late in the third period and they are down a goal.

That being said, it's not an own-goal at this point. ;p


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:47 AM.

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com, A property of CraveOnline, a division of AtomicOnline LLC ©2009 CraveOnline Media, LLC. All Rights Reserved.