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-   -   Pronger and the Norris (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=753344)

MiamiScreamingEagles 03-22-2010 11:06 AM

Pronger and the Norris
 
http://www.courierpostonline.com/art...s-Trophy-chase

Quote:

PHILADELPHIA Jimmy Watson never won it.
Neither did Mark Howe or Eric Desjardins.

In fact, in the 42-year history of the Flyers no
defenseman ever has won a Norris Trophy as the
best blue-liner in the NHL.

That could change this season.

In the midst of one of his best statistical seasons,
Chris Pronger has gained widespread support as the
game's best all-around defenseman.

"There are a handful of guys you could say that
about every year," said Flyers defenseman Matt
Carle, Pronger's defense partner. "He definitely puts
himself in that position year in and year out."

At 35 years old, Pronger ranks among the top
defensemen in several key categories.
http://www.phillyburbs.com/news/news...efenseman.html

Quote:

The veteran has had one of his finest seasons and could garner another Norris Trophy.

PHILADELPHIA - Earning consideration for the Norris Trophy as hockey's best defenseman is nothing new for Chris Pronger.

The Flyers' backliner has won one - 1999-00 - and been a finalist a number of other times.

At 35, Pronger is still going strong. In his first season with the Flyers, he's put together one of his finest campaigns.

He's tied for third among NHL defensemen with 52 points (the first Flyer defenseman to hit the 50-point plateau since Eric Desjardins in 1999-00), third in plus-minus (plus-22) and third in ice time (25:54).

Mgkibbles 03-22-2010 11:22 AM

At this point Pronger deserves the honor if for no other reason than carrying Carle's dead weight every night.

tytech 03-22-2010 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles (Post 24648028)
http://www.courierpostonline.com/fdcp/?1269270264763



http://www.phillyburbs.com/news/news...efenseman.html

He's tied for third among NHL defensemen with 52 points (the first Flyer defenseman to hit the 50-point plateau since Eric Desjardins in 1999-00), third in plus-minus (plus-22) and third in ice time (25:54).

So it looks like he might end up third in voting???

MiamiScreamingEagles 03-22-2010 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tytech (Post 24648476)
So it looks like he might end up third in voting???

More than likely, the Flyers have instituted a PR campaign utilizing local media to boost the presence of Pronger. It isn't uncommon protocol for such endeavors. Whether the voters are so conditioned to look at stats such as those is possible but there is a more potent way to direct attention and that starts with publicity lobbying.

Larry44 03-22-2010 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mgkibbles (Post 24648215)
At this point Pronger deserves the honor if for no other reason than carrying Carle's dead weight every night.

What games are you watching?

Carle carries a huge burden of skating work in that pairing, helping compensate for Pronger's declining speed.

If Pronger wins the Norris, it'll be interesting to see if he sends Carle up on stage to chase down the trophy and carry it back to the table for him....

CS 03-22-2010 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry44 (Post 24648622)
What games are you watching?

Carle carries a huge burden of skating work in that pairing, helping compensate for Pronger's declining speed.

If Pronger wins the Norris, it'll be interesting to see if he sends Carle up on stage to chase down the trophy and carry it back to the table for him....

Wow. While I think Carle is certainly coming into his own as a defenseman, this is beyond unbelievable.

Pronger and Keith should be and will probably be the top 2 candidates for Norris by year's end. I expect them to give it to Keith. Doughty, Weber, and Green will probably battle for 3rd. Of course Chara deserves mention as well, and it wouldn't be a Norris party if Lidstrom didn't get his say.

dbr2 03-22-2010 11:55 AM

I find it sad Howe never won it. I never got the chance to see him play, live. However what I have seen/heard the guy was great.

sa cyred 03-22-2010 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry44 (Post 24648622)
What games are you watching?

Carle carries a huge burden of skating work in that pairing, helping compensate for Pronger's declining speed.

If Pronger wins the Norris, it'll be interesting to see if he sends Carle up on stage to chase down the trophy and carry it back to the table for him....

Well I guess Carle helps with the speed, while Pronger covers his ass from the 25+ giveaways Carle has per game.

L-train* 03-22-2010 11:58 AM

Tied for third in points, tied for fourth in plus-minus, and sixth on TOI according to NHL.com.

Keith is gonna win, probably... second in points, sixth in plus-minus, second in TOI.

Hell, you could make a case for Green. First in points, second in plus-minus, 10th in TOI.

dbr2 03-22-2010 12:00 PM

I like Keith, a lot. However, I hate Green. The guy needs to just become a forward.

L-train* 03-22-2010 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbr2 (Post 24648756)
I like Keith, a lot. However, I hate Green. The guy needs to just become a forward.

I agree with you. But if you're gonna run purely on stats, he's got a shot.

In reality, from what I've seen of them playing, Keith is #1, Pronger is #2, and Doughty is #3.

chimrichalds18 03-22-2010 12:10 PM

When I think of Green winning the Norris, I cringe. I look at it like this-- there's 18 points separating Green and Pronger. In no way do those 18 points make up for all the other things that Pronger does (better than Green).

70+ points is impressive, yes, but that shouldn't fool hockey writers.

Clown Baby 03-22-2010 12:13 PM

Prongers offense doesnt even compare to his D.

Duncan Keith -- 2.74 GAON/60
Mike Green -- 2.55 GAON/60
Niklas Lidstrom -- 2.20 GAON/60
Zdeno Chara -- 2.13 GAON/60
Drew Doughty -- 2.10 GAON/60

and then theres Chris...

Chris Pronger -- 1.83 GAON/60

A 1.83 GAA per 60 minutes, with Matt Carle as his defensive partner, and Ray Emery, Michael Leighton, and Brian Boucher as his goaltender. Just let that sink in for a moment.

HoverCarle* 03-22-2010 12:15 PM

glad he is getting consideration. He may not win, but as long as he is top 5 candidate, it's fair

Bryz4shiz 03-22-2010 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clown Baby (Post 24648930)
Prongers offense doesnt even compare to his D.

Duncan Keith -- 2.74 GAON/60
Mike Green -- 2.55 GAON/60
Niklas Lidstrom -- 2.20 GAON/60
Zdeno Chara -- 2.13 GAON/60
Drew Doughty -- 2.10 GAON/60

and then theres Chris...

Chris Pronger -- 1.83 GAON/60

A 1.83 GAA per 60 minutes, with Matt Carle as his defensive partner, and Ray Emery, Michael Leighton, and Brian Boucher as his goaltender. Just let that sink in for a moment.

Dayum

CS 03-22-2010 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clown Baby (Post 24648930)
Prongers offense doesnt even compare to his D.

Duncan Keith -- 2.74 GAON/60
Mike Green -- 2.55 GAON/60
Niklas Lidstrom -- 2.20 GAON/60
Zdeno Chara -- 2.13 GAON/60
Drew Doughty -- 2.10 GAON/60

and then theres Chris...

Chris Pronger -- 1.83 GAON/60

A 1.83 GAA per 60 minutes, with Matt Carle as his defensive partner, and Ray Emery, Michael Leighton, and Brian Boucher as his goaltender. Just let that sink in for a moment.

I think that stat reel is a pretty big slap in the face to all the Chris Pronger haters on the main board who don't give him any kind of shot at the Norris.

Even so, I think they'll give it to Keith. He's young, he's on Chicago, and he's a "good guy."

DrinkFightFlyers 03-22-2010 12:28 PM

It doesn't just go to the guy with the best stats. It's the best defenseman award. The voters tend to look more at their defensive prowess first then look to offense as a tie-breaker. For instance, Chara beating Green last season. Green had more than twenty more points than Chara and pretty better stats in every other category as well except TOI. I'm not saying that makes Pronger a lock by any means, but I think he has a pretty good shot.

Morinisbear 03-22-2010 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clown Baby (Post 24648930)
Prongers offense doesnt even compare to his D.

Duncan Keith -- 2.74 GAON/60
Mike Green -- 2.55 GAON/60
Niklas Lidstrom -- 2.20 GAON/60
Zdeno Chara -- 2.13 GAON/60
Drew Doughty -- 2.10 GAON/60

and then theres Chris...

Chris Pronger -- 1.83 GAON/60

A 1.83 GAA per 60 minutes, with Matt Carle as his defensive partner, and Ray Emery, Michael Leighton, and Brian Boucher as his goaltender. Just let that sink in for a moment.

But, what is his Save %? jk

That's a great stat and I wish the voting did become this technical, but I doubt anyone will even acknowledge those numbers. Could be wrong though....I'd love to see him take it!

dbr2 03-22-2010 12:31 PM

I remember when I used to hate Pronger. Now that he's a Flyers I love him. I discovered it was a hate for him because he wasn't a Flyer.

Jester 03-22-2010 12:32 PM

If Pronger hadn't gone in the tank during the stretch of suck, he'd likely be a front-runner for the award.

FlyHigh 03-22-2010 12:42 PM

Even with that stretch of suck, his defensive play this season has been unbelievable.

I mean, he's leaps and bounds above the other Norris contenders in that category.

I personally wouldn't give it to him because of the 17-20 game stretch, but he has been amazing.

CantSeeColors 03-22-2010 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jester (Post 24649236)
If Pronger hadn't gone in the tank during the stretch of suck, he'd likely be a front-runner for the award.

The fact that he's already passed 50 points despite that stretch is simply mind boggling to me. We'd be looking at a 70 point season without that to go along with the best defensive play I've seen in a long time. Incredible.

CantSeeColors 03-22-2010 05:58 PM

Now that I think about it, **** the Norris. Pronger for Hart.

HoverCarle* 03-22-2010 05:59 PM

I think the top 3 should be:

Doughty
Keith
Pronger

in no order. Don't really mind who wins there

Larry44 03-22-2010 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CantSeeColors (Post 24655168)
Now that I think about it, **** the Norris. Pronger for Hart.

Now you're talking. First ever Hart Trophy winner on a non-playoff team?


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