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-   -   Proposal: Tor - LA (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=881424)

Burke needs me 02-22-2011 11:32 AM

Tor - LA
 
If burke can't sign MacArthur.. (ie.. he wants too much money)

leafs will look to deal him.


TO LA

MacArthur (rental) he may possibly re-sign with LA
Philly 1st rounder or Bos 1st rounder (Leafs choice)

TO Tor

LA 1st rounder
LA 3rd rounder (ups to 2nd rounder if the jump in 1st's is less than 10 spots)



LA picks up some playoff reinforcements.. leafs get to inch up in the draft.

Shellz 02-22-2011 11:37 AM

Oh wow, no Schenn?

I would do it, I think. I doubt Lombardi will give up his first for him though. Who knows. I could be wrong.

Gentle Ben Kenobi 02-22-2011 11:40 AM

Points for not including Brayden

Whiskeypete 02-22-2011 11:44 AM

just say NO to rentals that result in lost draft picks. the loss of two picks for one late first rounder and a rental is foolhardy. LA has done this for decades and it hasn't worked.

'he may re-sign' with LA imo doesnt mean ****. the cost of two picks for a player that averages approx half a point a game is just throwing assets away

driller1 02-22-2011 11:47 AM

If we were Cup contenders and thought this would push us over the edge, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Given that we aren't contenders this year, what's the point of picking up a rental? And is he really better than Sturm or Poni, the two guys he'd most likely replace in the lineup?

Telos 02-22-2011 11:52 AM

Looks solid, fax me the paperwork. Though I would give it a few games and tempt the trade deadline, but if Sturm doesn't look like he can come back, this trade only drops us a few spots, and we can re-sign the kid. Might as well take a shot, all we do is move down the draft a bit, but keep a pick in the first round and give up a third or second, and I would give that for him.

Ziggy Stardust 02-22-2011 11:58 AM

MacArthur being a RFA, the Kings won't lose him in free agency without receiving compensation. As for the offer, I think it is more than fair. The Kings 1st is in the mid to late range, so they won't be moving down too far (unless it is guaranteed that Boston or Philly advance far in the playoffs).

MacArthur currently has 17 goals and 45 points in 59 games, on pace to finish with 23 goals and 61 points. He is a speedy LW and a top six forward and if offered, I'd listen. This is a trade I certainly would make without hesitation.

Kurrilino 02-22-2011 12:12 PM

I would absolutely listen to this offer.

But i see McArth more like a long term solution not a playoff rental.
So i would talk to him before i do this deal.
The value is there

Please teach your fellow guys how to make proposals

Antropovsky 02-22-2011 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burke needs me (Post 31136268)
If burke can't sign MacArthur.. (ie.. he wants too much money)

leafs will look to deal him.


TO LA

MacArthur (rental) he may possibly re-sign with LA
Philly 1st rounder or Bos 1st rounder (Leafs choice)

TO Tor

LA 1st rounder
LA 3rd rounder (ups to 2nd rounder if the jump in 1st's is less than 10 spots)



LA picks up some playoff reinforcements.. leafs get to inch up in the draft.

Mac is a RFA, so he's not really a rental.

Whiskeypete 02-22-2011 01:59 PM

he isnt really any different than what LA currently has.
-he's 25, he's young and still developing and just entering his prime
-has speed, which is one thing LA needs more or
-an RFA, which would result in a compensatory pick if now re-signed
-NHL career record of 267GP, 61G, 72A, 133 TP = 0.498 pts per game.

the only LW's the Kings really have is Sturm, Smyth and Clifford. everyone else that has skated that position has been moved from RW. so let's look at some numbers to compare.

Marco
-32, coming off major knee surgeries
-speed, he possessed it. will he regain his previous form? time will tell
-UFA this summer
-870GP, 238G, 236A, 474TP = 0.544 pts per game

Smyth
-35
-UFA after 2012
-never known for speed, even criticized for his skating over the years
-uncanny ability in front of the net and along the boards to control and maintain possession, helps offset his lack of speed and skating
-1046GP, 351G, 398A, 749TP = 0.716 pts per game

Clifford
-20 a very young player, early in his career and developing
-not in the line up for speed or skating (other than not being a detriment)
-big body, energy line, physical presence and MW enforcer
-55GP, 4G, 5A, 9TP = 0.163 pts per game

Poni
-27
-UFA after this season
-massive frame, strong on his feet, average speed
-can control possession tempo along the boards and in front of net
-the downside is his consistency and willingness to use the assets he has every shift
-532GP, 120G, 154A, 274TP = 0.515 pts per game

Clarke falls in someplace in the Marco & Poni area. similar stats. has a similar make up to Strum and his speed, but doesnt have the size of Poni and Cliff. Smyth is in a completely different tier than all of these guys, even now as he is obviously on the downhill side of his career.

the player Clarke most closely resembles on LA's roster now is Marco. he is a younger version, minus the knee injuries. so moving forward if DL were to make this move and over the summer LA signs or doesn't sign either of them the cost is
LA's 1st
LA's 3rd (2nd if the conditional kicker happens)
LA's ? 'future consideration' for Sturm

that seems a rather steep price to pay for two LW's that are L2, L3 quality

...just my $0.03

two out of three* 02-22-2011 02:01 PM

I know they parted ways with Kaberle and Versteeg.. But the Leafs ARE only 7 points out with a game in hand on Carolina, and play the Islanders tonight. They are not by any means out of it.

So, if they were going to trade MacArthur I feel like they would want at least a roster player. Trevor Lewis, maybe?

Shellz 02-22-2011 02:06 PM

Burke said he's looking for a defeseman. I know Drewiske isn't anything special, but I'm sure he could be had. Unless BB is looking for a top 4 kind of guy.

two out of three* 02-22-2011 02:11 PM

Martinez? We do have three guys ready to step in down in the AHL..

northernKing 02-22-2011 02:20 PM

How about Moller for MacArthur? Moller could step right into the TOR lineup and we know Burke likes him as a player. MacArthur will be a RFA at seasons end and at his positionand age fits in very well in LA's future plans. Could be locked up for around a $2M cap hit on 3-4 yr term.

Josh Deitell 02-22-2011 02:23 PM

Take out the 1st from Toronto and that's probably the type of return they're looking for on MacArthur.

johnjm22 02-22-2011 02:32 PM

Another mediocre 2nd liner? No thanks.

Burke needs me 02-22-2011 02:41 PM

I know they parted ways with Kaberle and Versteeg.. But the Leafs ARE only 7 points out with a game in hand on Carolina, and play the Islanders tonight. They are not by any means out of it.

So, if they were going to trade MacArthur I feel like they would want at least a roster player. Trevor Lewis, maybe?



---
the leafs are OUT OF IT.
7 points under the new system with loser points... is the equivalent of about 12-13 points under the old system. Far too many things have to happen for the Leafs to make it. Plus... BUffalo is playing very well... they may catch Carolina and Atlanta, but probably not Buffalo. have to be realistic here.

--
the trade makes sense for me b/c both teams are taking a risk.
theoretically, the LA pick could end up being higher than Bos/philly pick.
that would be bad for leafs in which case LA get MAC (their leading scorer) for a 2nd round pick >> score a big win for LA.
on the other hand, if LA misses the playoffs, Leafs score a big win (a top 15 pick)

If Philly goes far and LA does okay... the leafs will move up around 10 spots. that seems reasonable from the Leaf perspective I would think.
LA is getting a player who is playing very well and is a cheap salary and costs nothing off the current roster.

kingsfan25 02-22-2011 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjm22 (Post 31140205)
Another mediocre 2nd liner?

I'm not even sure if he'd amount to that on a more competitive team.

BigKing 02-22-2011 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burke needs me (Post 31136268)
If burke can't sign MacArthur.. (ie.. he wants too much money)

leafs will look to deal him.


TO LA

MacArthur (rental) he may possibly re-sign with LA
Philly 1st rounder or Bos 1st rounder (Leafs choice)

TO Tor

LA 1st rounder
LA 3rd rounder (ups to 2nd rounder if the jump in 1st's is less than 10 spots)



LA picks up some playoff reinforcements.. leafs get to inch up in the draft.

I like it in concept. Those equating Mac to Poni or Sturm need to relax a little bit as stats don't tell the whole story for, while he is small in stature, Mac plays with more stones than both those guys.

Deano gave up a 2nd round pick for Brad Richardson straight up. He also added a pick to get "one-and-done" Jeff Halpern while providing the Bolts with its current 3rd leading scorer.

Mac is better offensively than Richardson.
Do I need to explain Halpern v. Mac?

The value as presented is fair. We are talking at worst a 2nd round pick and dropping 9 spots in the first round of what is considered a weaker draft year. If Lombardi really wants someone in the 20-30 range and he is sitting at 27-30, he can attempt to move up at that point like he always does.

You lose nothing of value off of the current roster and gain a guy who fits the age demographic of this Kings squad and who you have a good shot at keeping due to his RFA status.

I'd do it. What about this as a counter offer:

LA sends: 1st rounder + Drewiske
TOR sends: Mac and the PHI/BOS 1st rounder of their choice.

I removed the caveat of a 2nd rounder being added. Leafs get a d-man who is ready to play every night but is currently not able to crack the #2 ranked defense in the league and the Kings have a bevy of young blueliners with more potential in the pipeline. They also get more ammunition when it comes to packaging 1st rounders to move up in the draft.

Kings deal from a position of strength and pick up a nice player. I'd do both of the proposed deals, mine and the ops as there is very little risk to them.

As for the comparison to a younger Sturm, you easily make this deal for a 25 year old, injury free Marco Sturm.

MxK1NGS 02-22-2011 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust (Post 31136911)
MacArthur being a RFA, the Kings won't lose him in free agency without receiving compensation. As for the offer, I think it is more than fair. The Kings 1st is in the mid to late range, so they won't be moving down too far (unless it is guaranteed that Boston or Philly advance far in the playoffs).

MacArthur currently has 17 goals and 45 points in 59 games, on pace to finish with 23 goals and 61 points. He is a speedy LW and a top six forward and if offered, I'd listen. This is a trade I certainly would make without hesitation.

He was playing with Kessel and Grabovski on Toronto. Coming to LA I can see him getting a ton more points with Kopitar and Williams. I do this deal in a heartbeat. Seems like a fair one too.

Ollie Weeks 02-22-2011 06:59 PM

I like it. New favourite Leafs poster, you have been acknowledged.

T2M 02-22-2011 07:35 PM

I too like the deal, although I don't know if Burke would (BigKing's proposal is probably closer to what might go down were this deal to happen). That being said, I think we all have to applaud a reasonable, intelligent, well considered trade proposal from a Leafs fan who isn't trying to pry Brayden Schenn from us for nothing. That can only mean one thing--he's a closet Kings fan. It's ok, you can tell us, we all know how it feels to be a Kings fan.

nocturn 02-22-2011 08:08 PM

Mac just added #18 tonight. Nice little wrister from the left circle/slot.

Rorschach 02-23-2011 12:11 AM

Like the player, like the deal...

...but it's not what we need right now.

We need a 1st line winger, not another 2nd line winger. We already have a ton of guys who can score 20ish goals.

- R

Kurrilino 02-23-2011 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rorschach (Post 31160136)
Like the player, like the deal...

...but it's not what we need right now.

We need a 1st line winger, not another 2nd line winger. We already have a ton of guys who can score 20ish goals.

- R

This guy has already 17 without a playmaking center.
I highly doubt he is just "another" 20 goal scorer he can pass too.
Like i said, this offer is kinda fair


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