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-   -   Raptors Discussion: v14: Where the losses are losses and the wins are screwed away from us by the lottery (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=883432)

The Nemesis 02-26-2011 12:02 PM

v14: Where the losses are losses and the wins are screwed away from us by the lottery
 
carry on.

Jaysfanatic* 02-26-2011 01:20 PM

My wayward Son.

Hanta Yo 02-26-2011 01:32 PM

At least we're not the Detroit Pistons...

Buddio 02-26-2011 01:37 PM

lol, playoffs

Transplanted Caper 02-27-2011 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanta Yo (Post 31248497)
At least we're not the Detroit Pistons...

That was disgraceful. Honestly, the biggest d-bag move of the year in the NBA, and there have been A LOT of d-bag moves in the NBA this year. And then for McGrady to laugh at the coach when he got kicked out of the game was just piling on. Detroit should de-activate McGrady the rest of the season.

The Nemesis 02-27-2011 05:21 PM

Is this really happening? And if it is, why can't it happen more often?

Also I like the Johnson-Davis-Johnson frontcourt. No easy buckets for the other team.

The Nemesis 02-27-2011 06:28 PM

nobody is watching this game? They're beating the ****ing Mavericks!

Transplanted Caper 02-27-2011 06:59 PM

This game basically personifies this franchise. Take a 22-3 lead. Yes, 22-3. They are now in the 4th and losing by 13. For all the talk about spending into the luxury tax, if they can't spend their cap money well, spending extra won't help much.

Transplanted Caper 02-27-2011 07:10 PM

Dallas up 20 now, susf.

hotpaws 02-27-2011 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Nemesis (Post 31282057)
Also I like the Johnson-Davis-Johnson frontcourt. No easy buckets for the other team.

And there goes the biggest myth of Raptor land . Amir and Davis are not good defenesivly and Bargs isn't the reason this teams D is so brutal . When your perimiter guys can't stop or even slow down penetration it doesn't matter who your bigs are . Bargs man D is good , his help D is crap but so is the whole teams . I do like JJ's D but he's the only one of the starters today that can guard his position while the rest of the guys are below avg on man D .

That being said , it was a great start to the game but then the Mavs woke up and the beating started .

Suntouchable13 02-28-2011 10:47 PM

With London games against NJ coming up, it got me wondering: why did the NBA decide to go with Toronto and NJ of all teams for these 2 games in Europe?

The Nemesis 02-28-2011 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suntouchable13 (Post 31329224)
With London games against NJ coming up, it got me wondering: why did the NBA decide to go with Toronto and NJ of all teams for these 2 games in Europe?

So that the least # of people possible that the NBA cares about would complain that weekday games are on in the middle of the day?

MrLegend28 03-01-2011 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suntouchable13 (Post 31329224)
With London games against NJ coming up, it got me wondering: why did the NBA decide to go with Toronto and NJ of all teams for these 2 games in Europe?

russian owner vs international team

The Nemesis 03-01-2011 06:16 PM

Amir & Jose have some damn good chemistry.

also I really like James Johnson so far in his time with the Raptors.

Transplanted Caper 03-01-2011 07:07 PM

Jose has been excellent lately. When he's healthy he's a really solid player. He probably couldn't stop Oliver Miller from going around him, but he's very good offensively and protects the ball well.

The Nemesis 03-01-2011 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Transplanted Caper (Post 31345893)
Jose has been excellent lately. When he's healthy he's a really solid player. He probably couldn't stop Oliver Miller from going around him, but he's very good offensively and protects the ball well.


I dunno about that. You could probably give Calderon a cheeseburger to wave at Miller and that would stop him from getting by.

I also wonder if perhaps Jose needs the threat of someone taking his playing time to do better. He was best when TJ Ford pushed him, then he was better again when Jarrett Jack was more directly competing with him for time, and now he's picked up his play again now that Bayless is with the Raptors and has threatened to take some starts.

Hemskyfanboy83 03-01-2011 07:40 PM

I like this James Johnson guy

Transplanted Caper 03-01-2011 07:52 PM

Oh, the Raptors.

Jaysfanatic* 03-01-2011 08:48 PM

Did CP and Jose have out of body experiences today? CP had 7 points, 5 assists while Calderon had 22 points and 16 dimes. Madness.

HappyGilmourr 03-01-2011 11:21 PM

Hey guys I have a few questions.

Andrea Bargnani - How good is this guy? Is the reason he has such a high PPG average because he's the only legitimate option or is this guy becoming an elite player? I no scoring isn't everything and probably why a guy like Monta Ellis isn't categorized with all the high scorers around him but how good is this guy? Can Bargnani be a legit 1st or 2nd option? Is Dirk wayyyy better? Can he ever be as good?

Bayless - Can he be our future starting point guard? Again i'm not that educated on basketball but logic would dictate if Bayless can put up 8.8 PPG in 20 minutes a game he could probably be a 13-14 PPG player when he's matured and getting starting minutes?

Demar Derozan - Does anyone think this guy can be a part of a future big 3?

Our pick - Who could we possibly target in the 4-7 range where our pick will likely land? Any impact players? What position would be looking to upgrade with that number 1 pick?

Our future - how is our rebuild going, and how long is it before we are likely to get back to the playoffs?


If someone could answer these question that would be helpful

wulfio* 03-01-2011 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bozak (Post 31354164)
Hey guys I have a few questions.

Bargnani is good. He's a terrific scorer. Not as prolific in other areas of his game though, he has average man to man defense, but can be out muscled by bigger players, he's BRUTAL in help defense. His ideal position would be the 6th man on a championship team. He would absolutely flourish in that role. I just don't think he's tough enough, or an elite enough of a scorer to be a 1st/2nd option. And if he's not that, he should be coming off the bench, because you don't need a 3rd option 7 footer playing on the perimeter, you need those guys in the paint.

Bayless in my opinion projects to be like a barbosa, awesome penetrator, and scorer, but lacks vision. Again, an awesome 6th man.

Derozan is an enigma. Sometimes he looks like a complete stud, on his way to being an elite guard. Sometimes he looks weak. Too early to tell, but he's got the tools.

our pick, I just hope we luck out and get #1 so we can draft Kyrie Irving; elite PG. Some say he's like CP3. Other than that, I'm only high on terrance jones or perry jones, both good small forwards. But tough to say if they will be elite players.

aside from all that, Davis is probably one of my favourite raps. He's got a good nose for rebounds, and looks like he can be a solid 13-15/10 guy.

We have some nice prospects, but no clear cut elite ballers. Until we get a legit superstar I just don't see how we can compete unless BC puts together a DEEP team of really good prospects like davis/DD/etc.

hotpaws 03-02-2011 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bozak (Post 31354164)
Hey guys I have a few questions.

Andrea Bargnani - How good is this guy? Is the reason he has such a high PPG average because he's the only legitimate option or is this guy becoming an elite player? I no scoring isn't everything and probably why a guy like Monta Ellis isn't categorized with all the high scorers around him but how good is this guy? Can Bargnani be a legit 1st or 2nd option? Is Dirk wayyyy better? Can he ever be as good?

Bayless - Can he be our future starting point guard? Again i'm not that educated on basketball but logic would dictate if Bayless can put up 8.8 PPG in 20 minutes a game he could probably be a 13-14 PPG player when he's matured and getting starting minutes?

Demar Derozan - Does anyone think this guy can be a part of a future big 3?

Our pick - Who could we possibly target in the 4-7 range where our pick will likely land? Any impact players? What position would be looking to upgrade with that number 1 pick?

Our future - how is our rebuild going, and how long is it before we are likely to get back to the playoffs?


If someone could answer these question that would be helpful

Bargs has an elite and rare offensive skill set for his size . For us to max his value he needs to play with certain types of players . He could be a co-num 1 or 2nd option on a good team with the right people around him . The right players and a real coach would do wonders for his game and this team .

Bayliss is pretty much an undersized 2 guard trying to learn the point . He has skills and is a good athlete but i don't know if he can ever run an offense good enough to be a starting pg .

DD is a huge ? for me . He has some skills and looks great at times but seems to really struggle when D's start to focus on him . He's improved from his 1st year which is great but i don't see him having star potential . He also needs to develop other parts of his game .

This draft is weak but there are solid players . Irving is the prize but we will get a solid player at the 4-7 position . I like Barnes , even though he hasn't had the year people thought he would .

As far as our re-build goes , who knows ? One player can turn a team around in the NBA .

Paladin2799 03-02-2011 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotpaws (Post 31358919)
Bargs has an elite and rare offensive skill set for his size . For us to max his value he needs to play with certain types of players . He could be a co-num 1 or 2nd option on a good team with the right people around him . The right players and a real coach would do wonders for his game and this team .

Bayliss is pretty much an undersized 2 guard trying to learn the point . He has skills and is a good athlete but i don't know if he can ever run an offense good enough to be a starting pg .

DD is a huge ? for me . He has some skills and looks great at times but seems to really struggle when D's start to focus on him . He's improved from his 1st year which is great but i don't see him having star potential . He also needs to develop other parts of his game .

This draft is weak but there are solid players . Irving is the prize but we will get a solid player at the 4-7 position . I like Barnes , even though he hasn't had the year people thought he would .

As far as our re-build goes , who knows ? One player can turn a team around in the NBA .

Even tho Bargs is not a superstar, he is a player that allows us to build a very good team around an unconventional style. His ability to hit 3's from a 7 footer is almost unheard of, and if we structure the team around that it makes us very very hard to defend against. If bargs goes to the 3pt line most defenders are not used to following the bigman to the line and instead will collapse to the paint.

If bargs had a hard rebounding PF and C to insulate his inability to play defense, bargs would be a great option to put out when we sub out scoring talent in the other parts of our lineup due to fouls or minutes/rotation. ie: when we take out derozan we lose scoring, so put in bargs to allow someone to still have a good shot/scoring touch to compensate against the replacement. He would be playing starting minutes, but have players that could cover for his faults. Kind of like having a fast PMD paired with a heavy physical DMan. Structuring this team around Bargs should be interesting to see.

Nasty Nazem 03-02-2011 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bozak (Post 31354164)
Hey guys I have a few questions.

Andrea Bargnani - How good is this guy? Is the reason he has such a high PPG average because he's the only legitimate option or is this guy becoming an elite player? I no scoring isn't everything and probably why a guy like Monta Ellis isn't categorized with all the high scorers around him but how good is this guy? Can Bargnani be a legit 1st or 2nd option? Is Dirk wayyyy better? Can he ever be as good?

Bayless - Can he be our future starting point guard? Again i'm not that educated on basketball but logic would dictate if Bayless can put up 8.8 PPG in 20 minutes a game he could probably be a 13-14 PPG player when he's matured and getting starting minutes?

Demar Derozan - Does anyone think this guy can be a part of a future big 3?

Our pick - Who could we possibly target in the 4-7 range where our pick will likely land? Any impact players? What position would be looking to upgrade with that number 1 pick?

Our future - how is our rebuild going, and how long is it before we are likely to get back to the playoffs?


If someone could answer these question that would be helpful

Bargnani is a great scorer but he is still learning. At times he gets too happy settling for jumpers when realistically he can blow by defenders and if they put small quick defenders on him, he can post or easily shoot over them. Hard to teach him to do that all now but if he learned that when he was younger, he would be unbelievable. He should realistically be a power forward, personally I would move him to small forward because that's what he plays like and he is a terrible defender as a center and doesn't rebound enough, you can live with Bargnani playing below average defense at SF but not at center when you need to help your teammates and get into blocking lanes and rebound. He also has good size so while he wouldn't have that lateral quickness, he can make up for it with size and he does play better defense one on one.

I am not really impressed by Bayless at all. Sometimes, he looks like a good scorer but he is incredibly inconsistent and doesn't use his teammates enough. I don't him see him much better than a 7th option on a contending team.

Loved the way DeMar worked his ass off and developed a solid jumper, I don't think he needs the 3 in his arsenal but I would like to see him work on his rebounding and defense. His defense has been improving since the beginning of the year though. He won't be a star or anything but could be a solid #2/#3 option on a contender.

I hate this draft, I like Irving but with that injury I don't know how good he will be and he might be the only one that can become a franchise player. Jones has franchise potential but I've heard he has a low motor/poor work ethic and doesn't have that killer mentality which honestly sounds to me like Bargnani. Barnes game is turning out and is projected to be a top 10 pick so I wouldn't mind him but I don't think he has that franchise potential anymore but is a good all-around guy. I've heard Terrence is a guy with great work ethic and he is a solid all-around player but just doesn't have the upside of a franchise player. Williams is a good player as well though I am not sure exactly what he is, he sort of plays power forward and small forward because he doesn't have great size but he's good a decent shot and can post up. I've heard Sullinger is a beast and has the upside of Kevin Love but do we really need another PF? I don't think so.

My preference: Irving first, Barnes, Jones, Terrence, Williams (if he can play SF at the next level).

gymineer 03-02-2011 12:12 PM

Could a lockout be good for Toronto?
 
The Blue Jays and Leafs clearly didn't emerge on top following their respective lockouts, could the Raptors be the exception?

Could we benefit from the impending lockout if it wiped out an entire season, or a large part of it?

The first thing I look at is the way the NHL handled the draft and how strong Pittsburgh and Washington became thanks to back to back automatic high picks. If the Raptors have a top 5 pick this year, and a season gets wiped, do they get a top 5 next year?

The other thing to notice was how veteran players struggled to return following the NHL lockout, while young players were able to compete more than ever before following the layoff. Boston immediately comes to mind as a team that wouldn't be able to return as strong a team following a lockout as they had going into it due to the age of their core players.

Lastly, we've been riddled with injuries this year. They vary in nature and severity, but a year to rest/ practice/play only as needed could make for a strong resurgent Toronto NBA team.

Ultimately, as a fan of the team, I'd rather see them play. But looking back, Penguins fans probably feel pretty good about the NHL lockout. Plus the Raps could come back as the huskies. Or at least put feathers on their mascot.


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