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-   -   Line Combos: If we get Richards, our first line LW should be Dubinsky (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=935539)

Machinehead 06-27-2011 01:07 AM

If we get Richards, our first line LW should be Dubinsky
 
I've heard alot of talk about filling that spot, most of it centered around Jussi Jokinen. But I think we already have a perfectly capable 1LW. Now you could make the argument that Dubi is not a 1st-liner. At best, probably in between 1 and 2. I'd probably agree. But I still think the guy should be Dubinsky. 4 reasons.

1) Let's keep in mind; not every guy on the first line has to be a first line player. I think a good example is Alex Burrows. Standing alone, I wouldn't call him a first line talent. But with elite linemates, he's shown that he can put up first line goal totals. When you've already got two elite pieces, the third one can be a cut below and still put up the numbers. And FWIW, Dubinsky is more skilled than Burrows imo.

2) Going along with the previous point; we've never seen Dubinsky play with elite talent, or at least not since he was a rookie. Let's give him the chance, fully developed, to play with top talent before we relegate him to the second line. With elite linemates, Dubinsky would not draw top defenders and would be getting far better setups. You'd be adding these factors to a guy that can already score 20 goals. I think with first-liners, Dubinsky could possibly hit another level.

3)This is gonna sound odd, but I honestly question the need. Let's see how it would look if everything went reasonably well with no ridiculous injuries; you're looking at close to 30 from Richards, 35-45 from Gaborik, over 20 from Callahan, 15-20 from Anisimov and Stepan, even if he doesn't repeat what he did last year I'd still look for a solid 10-15 from Boyle. Same from Wolski. Odd contributions from Feds and Prust should be another 15-20. 10-15 from the defense at least. At this point, how many goals does Dubinsky really need? At this stage, anything over 20 would put us at top ten in the league.

4)If you can get it done without bringing in anyone new, for the sake of saving the cap space and preserving chemistry, you do it. I think we can pull this off and keep things in order.

Discuss.

johnnydollaz89* 06-27-2011 01:11 AM

Hey im with ya 100% on this one, Duby worked on the first line with Jagr his rookie season and whose to say he wont with a combo of Richards-Gaborik? Im with ya man and also this may open up a spot for hopefully Hagelin or maybe even Thomas to make the team

Beacon 06-27-2011 01:20 AM

If we are going for the Cup, we should probably sign a top-6 LW. Even if Dubinsky is a 1LW, who is #2? Wolski?

On the other hand, if we are not going for the Cup immediately, then we can give it time to see what we have with guys like Kreider and Hagelin.

asphyXy 06-27-2011 01:24 AM

I'm sure we'll see several players mixed and matched during the course of the year. I really liked the Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan line from last year, and if all three of them play as well as (or better than) last year, I'd like to see that line stay together.

I'd love nothing more than for Wolski to have his skating improve tenfold this offseason and to become a solid top six player (Wolski-Richards-Gaborik?), but on the flip side, he's also a buyout candidate. Unless we get Jussi Jokinen or someone of the like, Dubinsky is sure to get some top line playing time.

This is all dependent on us signing Richards July 1st. Without Richards, I'd call Duby-AA-Cally our #1 line. I expect big things from all three this season.

mullichicken25 06-27-2011 06:39 AM

i think as our roster is currently constructed, he is the best option for that spot

i'd hate to break up the pack line but it may have to happen

personally, i'd like to see boyle as dubi's replacement on that line. I can see him as poor man's dubinsky, and if he plays like the first half of last year with AA and cally on his line it could be pretty nice

dubi - richards - gabby
boyle - AA - cally
wolski - stepan - mza
feds - avery - prust

i'd at least give it a shot if dubi is infact moved up to the top line

beastly115 06-27-2011 06:50 AM

I agree, Duby could be the powerforward on that line. It'll be similar to the Lucic - Savard - Kessel line in Boston a few years ago... except better :D

DubiDubiDoo 06-27-2011 07:03 AM

I have to disagree, we need scoring depth and the Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan line was our best line at times last year. If we can leave them together I think they could really blossom.

I'd much rather take a shot with someone else.

GWOW 06-27-2011 07:06 AM

I put Wolski on his wing. Keep Dubinsky with AA and Cally and let them build chemistry.

Woski-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-AA-Callahan
Avery/Hagelin-Stepan-MZA
Fedotenko-Boyle-Prust

Staal-Girardi
MacD-Sauer
MDZ-Erixon

Dubinsky scores a lot of grinding goals, deflections, wraparounds and snap/slapshots. He's not good at all shooting off the pass, and it seems like he's got really tough luck converting gimme chances around the net (wide open nets, posts etc).

Richards isn't a home-run pass kind of guy, so Dubi's speed wont come into play as much. He's like Savard in that he threads the needle in close traffic. I think WW can score 20-25 goals and his wing, and that is just fine.

Vitto79 06-27-2011 07:15 AM

I have also been putting X winger in the spot to keep the Packline together but I do agree that it is inevitable that Dubinsky, Richards, Gaborik would be the way to go

After that I am not sure what will happen as I see both Anisimov and Stepan as 2nd line Cs. Callahan has played with AA more.

I have Woilski slotted into the 6th F spot but Boyle and Zuke could easily slide into more time on the top two lines

Swept In Seven 06-27-2011 08:01 AM

I agree that Dubinsky should be our top line LW. The only issue I have with that is that we have to break up the Pack Line :cry:. I say Dubi as the top line LW, unless we can get an absolute steal in free agency.

SupersonicMonkey* 06-27-2011 08:13 AM

I agree with Dubi on the top line LW with Richards and Gaborik.

But for specific reasons.

1- to keep Richards and Gaborik honest. Meaning, provide that balls-to-the-wall energy and physicality.

2- use the physical play and puck posession down low to create space for Richards and Gaborik.

3- provide net presence, screening the goaltender, destracting the defense, getting rebounds.

Rust Heisenberg 06-27-2011 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mullichicken25 (Post 34161285)
i think as our roster is currently constructed, he is the best option for that spot

i'd hate to break up the pack line but it may have to happen

personally, i'd like to see boyle as dubi's replacement on that line. I can see him as poor man's dubinsky, and if he plays like the first half of last year with AA and cally on his line it could be pretty nice

dubi - richards - gabby
boyle - AA - cally
wolski - stepan - mza
feds - avery - prust

i'd at least give it a shot if dubi is infact moved up to the top line

boyle on the 2nd line... avery as a center... and dubinsky as our first line lw? our team would be in a lot of trouble if these lines were the case :help:

the line that stuck out last season that will probably stick next year is avery-boyle-prust. it really clicked for us in the playoffs. it will be our 3rd or 4th line depending on the teams we play.

as for who we will put on the 1st line if we were able to get richards... it would most likely be ryan callahan. dubinsky does not have the talent needed to be on that line. callahan doesn't really either but he's got more than dubinsky. it is also a respect thing and if callahan is our next captain (which is most likely) he will likely be placed on the 1st line at least to begin the year.

as for wolski, i think he will be bought out. we have cheaper, home grown prospects, who project to be more of an asset for our team than wolski (grachev, thomas). *edit* yea nevermind, i didn't realize grachev was traded... oops.

stepan is likely going to be our 2nd line center. unless he doesn't improve on faceoffs and anisimov improves significantly (not saying he necessarily needs to improve a lot, although there is always room for improvement) i can't see him not being on the 2nd line.

SERE 24 06-27-2011 10:21 AM

To me, it looks like:

Dubinsky - Richards - Gaborik
- Anisimov - Callahan
- Stepan - MZA/Avery
Prust - Boyle - ??/Fedetenko
Staal - Girardi
McDonagh - Sauer
Del Zotto/Erixon/???
Lundqvist
Biron

Do we keep Wolski and go Wolski - Stepan - MZA on the third line?
Where does Avery fit? Christensen? Neither is likely to play on the second line. Does MZA play on the wing with Anisimov and Cally and we get a line of Wolski - Stepan - Avery?

Defensively, Del Zotto gets another chance, for sure. Is Erixon ready for a shot? Do we go with McD/Sauer/MDZ/Erixon? I'm sure everyone would be comfortable with a cheap veteran in that mix, even though they may all be 'ready'.

It seems likely we land Richards. The stars seem to be aligning on that front. Will Wolski still be here, and will he play? Will we sign another forward - I think we need one, even if it's a cheapish 1-3 year deal, to have a truly competitive roster. Do we sign a vet d-man? Bring back Eminger for the spot? I think we need to have at least one vet on the bottom pairing.

CHGoalie27 06-27-2011 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DubiDubiDoo (Post 34161577)
I have to disagree, we need scoring depth and the Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan line was our best line at times last year. If we can leave them together I think they could really blossom.

I'd much rather take a shot with someone else.

Not only that, but to the OP's Burrows comparison, I think the Sedins failed because Burrows was on their line. They should've had someone clearing some room.

I wouldn't want Dubinsky with Gaborik and Richards, I'd want Avery, Fedotenko, Prust, or a banging FA they will sign. Balance. Chicago and Boston says we need at least one physical type on each line. OR have Red Wings skill.

Either way, keep the Pack line as is. We finally have a line showing chemistry, to hell with anyone trying to break it up (not reallly wishing hell on you guys, but yknow??)

NYR Viper 06-27-2011 11:07 AM

I know this may sound really crazy, but what about Boyle as a complimentary player on that first line?

Boyle-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan
Wolski-Stepan-Thomas/MZA
Fedotenko-______-Prust
Avery, Christensen

I really think Boyle will continue to progress and even if he "only" scores 20 goals, he is a big body who can create room for his teammates and play solid defensive hockey.

NYR Viper 06-27-2011 11:08 AM

Double Post

we want cup 06-27-2011 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 (Post 34169575)
I know this may sound really crazy, but what about Boyle as a complimentary player on that first line?

Boyle-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan
Wolski-Stepan-Thomas/MZA
Fedotenko-______-Prust
Avery, Christensen

I really think Boyle will continue to progress and even if he "only" scores 20 goals, he is a big body who can create room for his teammates and play solid defensive hockey.

If he could fill the role that Troy Brouwer filled while playing with Toews and Kane for parts of this season, I think that would be great.

CHGoalie27 06-27-2011 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 (Post 34169575)
I know this may sound really crazy, but what about Boyle as a complimentary player on that first line?

Boyle-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan
Wolski-Stepan-Thomas/MZA
Fedotenko-______-Prust
Avery, Christensen

I really think Boyle will continue to progress and even if he "only" scores 20 goals, he is a big body who can create room for his teammates and play solid defensive hockey.

No problem with that!!!!!!!!

I still want Boyle-Avery-Gaborik, damn that line looked awesome for the 15 mins it was together!

Again, never forget what Byfuglien did for Kane and Toews. I wouldn't hate Boyle-Richards-Gaborik
The BR(A)G Line

NYR Viper 06-27-2011 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHGoalie72 (Post 34171399)
No problem with that!!!!!!!!

Even if Boyle doesnt work out on the 1st line, the moral of the story is that if Fedotenko is brought back, the Rangers are set on LW. They dont need to sign Gagne or Jokinen.

NYR Sting 06-27-2011 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 (Post 34169575)
I know this may sound really crazy, but what about Boyle as a complimentary player on that first line?

Boyle-Richards-Gaborik
Dubinsky-Anisimov-Callahan
Wolski-Stepan-Thomas/MZA
Fedotenko-______-Prust
Avery, Christensen

I really think Boyle will continue to progress and even if he "only" scores 20 goals, he is a big body who can create room for his teammates and play solid defensive hockey.

The only options that are on the roster today for the LW spot on a Richards-Gaborik line are Dubinsky and Boyle (who I suggested, with the possibility of then signing a Jeff Halpern to center the 4th line).

You have to have some kind of physical presence. Dubinsky is a better, more physical player, so I'd prefer that, especially if we keep Prospal (who could play with Cally and Artie). If we don't keep Prospal and don't sign any LW free agents, then Boyle might be a solid choice so that we could keep Dubi on the 2nd line.

NYGBleedBlueNYR 06-27-2011 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey (Post 34162769)
I agree with Dubi on the top line LW with Richards and Gaborik.

But for specific reasons.

1- to keep Richards and Gaborik honest. Meaning, provide that balls-to-the-wall energy and physicality.

2- use the physical play and puck posession down low to create space for Richards and Gaborik.

3- provide net presence, screening the goaltender, destracting the defense, getting rebounds.

This is pretty much exactly what I think. A guy to do some of the dirty work for our two most skilled guys. Dubi's possession game should really help setup the rest of the line IMO. I think Dubi's game will elevate to a whole new level on this line.

That said it doesn't make him a 1st line LW just because he's there. We still need a top flight W, just to play on our 2nd line IMO. R or L, I think we could aptly use both. Having Cally on our "third" line would greatly help our scoring depth.

CHGoalie27 06-27-2011 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 (Post 34171507)
Even if Boyle doesnt work out on the 1st line, the moral of the story is that if Fedotenko is brought back, the Rangers are set on LW. They dont need to sign Gagne or Jokinen.

I don't want either anyway.

I mean Gagne would be great if it weren't for the injury prone thing.

...totally Sting36e, I'm of the school that every line needs at least one big body(that hits, no Joe Thornton who will never win silver by playing like a weakass).

Tawnos 06-27-2011 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sting36e (Post 34171527)
The only options that are on the roster today for the LW spot on a Richards-Gaborik line are Dubinsky and Boyle (who I suggested, with the possibility of then signing a Jeff Halpern to center the 4th line).

You have to have some kind of physical presence. Dubinsky is a better, more physical player, so I'd prefer that, especially if we keep Prospal (who could play with Cally and Artie). If we don't keep Prospal and don't sign any LW free agents, then Boyle might be a solid choice so that we could keep Dubi on the 2nd line.

At first I was going to say Wolski could be up there, but then I realized what you were saying about physical presence. I actually think Wolski would work pretty well on a line with Callahan anyway. So I'm right there with you.

Prospal is done. He can't skate and I want no part of him on this team, as much as I like him as far as his attitude and presence are concerned.

mullichicken25 06-27-2011 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenjets36 (Post 34162805)
boyle on the 2nd line... avery as a center... and dubinsky as our first line lw? our team would be in a lot of trouble if these lines were the case :help:

the line that stuck out last season that will probably stick next year is avery-boyle-prust. it really clicked for us in the playoffs. it will be our 3rd or 4th line depending on the teams we play.

as for who we will put on the 1st line if we were able to get richards... it would most likely be ryan callahan. dubinsky does not have the talent needed to be on that line. callahan doesn't really either but he's got more than dubinsky. it is also a respect thing and if callahan is our next captain (which is most likely) he will likely be placed on the 1st line at least to begin the year.

as for wolski, i think he will be bought out. we have cheaper, home grown prospects, who project to be more of an asset for our team than wolski (grachev, thomas). *edit* yea nevermind, i didn't realize grachev was traded... oops.

stepan is likely going to be our 2nd line center. unless he doesn't improve on faceoffs and anisimov improves significantly (not saying he necessarily needs to improve a lot, although there is always room for improvement) i can't see him not being on the 2nd line.

a number of things:

first, i never remember avery-boyle-prust sticking out...i remember fed-boyle-prust sticking out and avery getting bounced around the lineup as well as healthy scratched

second, im reasonablly certain avery has played center in the past

third, i think you're the first person i've ever seen claim cally is more talented than dubi...also im not sure how putting last year's goal and assist leader on the first line is such an outlandish idea

fourth, any respect that is shown by starting cally on the first line because of the letter on the front of his jersey is imediately lost when he gets demoted

5th, cally's a rw...hence him and dubinsky were on the same line

6th, asuming stepan will be above AA on the even strength depth chart is bit pre-mature to say the least...i'd actually be more surprised (assuming richards is signed) if he's not on the 3rd line

CHGoalie27 06-27-2011 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mullichicken25 (Post 34171921)
a number of things:

first, i never remember avery-boyle-prust sticking out...i remember fed-boyle-prust sticking out and avery getting bounced around the lineup as well as healthy scratched

second, im reasonablly certain avery has played center in the past

third, i think you're the first person i've ever seen claim cally is more talented than dubi...also im not sure how putting last year's goal and assist leader on the first line is such an outlandish idea

fourth, any respect that is shown by starting cally on the first line because of the letter on the front of his jersey is imediately lost when he gets demoted

5th, cally's a rw...hence him and dubinsky were on the same line

6th, asuming stepan will be above AA on the even strength depth chart is bit pre-mature to say the least...i'd actually be more surprised (assuming richards is signed) if he's not on the 3rd line

ONLY because it's breaking up established chemistry.


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