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-   -   News Article: Charlie Coyle Will Be X-Factor In Burns Trade (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=966211)

GopherState 08-09-2011 07:47 PM

Charlie Coyle Will Be X-Factor In Burns Trade
 
http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2...nt-burns-trade

This idea (and quote) was brought up in the Granlund proposal thread but figure it should get its own thread. There's a lot of interesting thoughts in the article but personally the main talking point is this:

Quote:

Coyle will be a one of those players to keep an eye on over the next few years. The old axiom for trades is simple: whoever gets the best player wins the trade. For now, Brent Burns is the best player in the trade—but Coyle is the type of player who has the potential to flip that logic on its head. Give him another year in college and another year with Team USA against the world’s best Under-20 prospects and Coyle just may be the best player who comes out of that trade.

That’s exactly what the Wild organization is betting on.

Dr Jan Itor 08-09-2011 07:54 PM

Definitely hope so. I still think Zucker is going to end up being better, but I really like what I'm hearing about Coyle's game. I hope he shows more offensively this year (~40 points would be some nice progression).

squidz* 08-09-2011 08:00 PM

The Zucker/Coyle combo from development camp was amazing. They looked like they had played together for years, and the scrimmages were just another day. I don't care which one turns out better, if they can bring that to NHL ice, things will be looking fantastic for our top 6.

BLBarmada 08-09-2011 08:04 PM

Who holds their Junior rights ?? Or they free to sign with any junior team ?

this providence 08-09-2011 08:04 PM

I think they'd look great together on the same line. If they both make it to the NHL and at this point, I think they both should see time. A lot to like about both of their game's. Physical guys who compliment each other well. Both have great leader and character qualities as well.

I think the Wild will get Coyle to turn pro after this season if all goes well. I believe Zucker will probably stay another year unless he goes gangbusters on the WCHA. Which is a possibility as I really like that Denver squad and believe they've got a strong title chance.

GopherState 08-09-2011 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTLjunior (Post 35801603)
Who holds their Junior rights ?? Or they free to sign with any junior team ?

Who knows or cares. At this point if Minnesota signed Coyle or Zucker (which they aren't going to), they'd assign them to Houston rather than spend an overage year in the CHL. Both can play there.

edgevolution 08-09-2011 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTLjunior (Post 35801603)
Who holds their Junior rights ?? Or they free to sign with any junior team ?

They're not going to juniors anyways. They will sign a two-way deal right out of college and head to Houston.

Dr Jan Itor 08-09-2011 08:38 PM

So, with Koivu and (likely) Granlund as our #1 and #2 centers in the coming years, do we see Coyle as a way to make our 3rd line more of a threat, and have a down-the-middle future of Koivu-Granlund-Coyle? Or should we try to convert him to wing, and see the PF prognostications are valid?

FUBAR McDangles 08-09-2011 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor (Post 35802471)
So, with Koivu and (likely) Granlund as our #1 and #2 centers in the coming years, do we see Coyle as a way to make our 3rd line more of a threat, and have a down-the-middle future of Koivu-Granlund-Coyle? Or should we try to convert him to wing, and see the PF prognostications are valid?

I read somewhere that Coyle played a decent amount of time last year on the right wing. Not sure if it's true or not, I didn't watch much of the Hockey East at all last season.

I'm imagining a Granlund-Koivu-Phillips down the middle with Zucker and Coyle on the same line with any of the centers. I think that would be beyond great.

squidz* 08-09-2011 08:51 PM

Granlund isn't guaranteed to play center, but neither is Coyle. I could see a Zucker - Granlund - Coyle line in the future.

Dr Jan Itor 08-09-2011 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyratoku (Post 35802713)
I read somewhere that Coyle played a decent amount of time last year on the right wing. Not sure if it's true or not, I didn't watch much of the Hockey East at all last season.

I'm imagining a Granlund-Koivu-Phillips down the middle with Zucker and Coyle on the same line with any of the centers. I think that would be beyond great.

Hmmm...

Heatley - Koivu - Setoguchi

Zucker - Granlund - Coyle

Latendresse - Phillips - Larsson

Gillies - Almond - Clutterbuck

If all of our prospects reach their potential, not a bad group.

bear1 08-09-2011 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor (Post 35802815)
Hmmm...

Heatley - Koivu - Setoguchi

Zucker - Granlund - Coyle

Latendresse - Phillips - Larsson

Gillies - Almond - Clutterbuck

If all of our prospects reach their potential, not a bad group.

Thats a big if , Coyle better be worth it cause he was such a big part of the trade CF cant afford another bad trade

firstroundbust 08-09-2011 09:05 PM

It would be insanity to have 6'2", 220 lb. Coyle on the wing. Put him at center, and then slide Granlund and maybe Phillips over to the wing. Coyle is built to put in work along the boards, in the corners, and down low- his presence frees up the other guys to make plays.

FUBAR McDangles 08-09-2011 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by firstroundbust (Post 35803147)
It would be insanity to have 6'2", 220 lb. Coyle on the wing. Put him at center, and then slide Granlund and maybe Phillips over to the wing. Coyle is built to put in work along the boards, in the corners, and down low- his presence frees up the other guys to make plays.

There are big wingers out there. David Backes, Milan Lucic, Dustin Penner, Corey Perry, Ovechkin...they're all somewhere around Coyle's build. There are successful huge wingers out there.

Doesn't mean he should become a winger. I have no idea :laugh:

llamapalooza 08-09-2011 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyratoku (Post 35803713)
There are big wingers out there. David Backes, Milan Lucic, Dustin Penner, Corey Perry, Ovechkin...they're all somewhere around Coyle's build. There are successful huge wingers out there.

Doesn't mean he should become a winger. I have no idea :laugh:

Let's not forget Latendresse. He's huge! :laugh:

rynryn 08-10-2011 03:35 PM

Ideally we'll have several guys who are comfortable playing different positions...really gives Fletcher some more options when talking trades IMO.

Victorious Secret 08-10-2011 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamapalooza (Post 35803877)
Let's not forget Latendresse. He's fat! :laugh:

Aha. Fixed.

BLBarmada 08-10-2011 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GopherState (Post 35802115)
Who knows or cares. At this point if Minnesota signed Coyle or Zucker (which they aren't going to), they'd assign them to Houston rather than spend an overage year in the CHL. Both can play there.

Well I care, and they wouldn't be OAs I they played this year.

Theyre 19 an both free to sign with any CHL team, they should do that in order to get used to the pro schedule.

Dr Jan Itor 08-10-2011 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTLjunior (Post 35824891)
Well I care, and they wouldn't be OAs I they played this year.

Theyre 19 an both free to sign with any CHL team, they should do that in order to get used to the pro schedule.

Stastny, Toews, Parise, Stepan, Okposo, etc... didn't hurt them.

If they want to stay in college, which it appears they do, then they should stay. If they need to get used to a pro schedule, then a year in Houston should do the trick.

Rabid Husky 08-10-2011 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTLjunior (Post 35824891)
Well I care, and they wouldn't be OAs I they played this year.

Theyre 19 an both free to sign with any CHL team, they should do that in order to get used to the pro schedule.

Players develop in college just fine.

this providence 08-10-2011 05:08 PM

I want them in college developing different aspects of their games and physical condition, not spending the majority of their time traveling and playing game after game. Not to mention both are in very good programs. It would be absolutely foolish for them to step down a notch and go to the major junior level.

Rabid Husky 08-10-2011 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by this providence (Post 35825835)
I want them in college developing different aspects of their games and physical condition, not spending the majority of their time traveling and playing game after game. Not to mention both are in very good programs. It would be absolutely foolish for them to step down a notch and go to the major junior level.

I also really hate the "they should get used to a pro schedule" part of the argument. They played in juniors before college so its not like they haven't played a big schedule before and its not like they are going to forget that because they played in college for a few years.

squidz* 08-10-2011 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rabid Husky (Post 35826073)
I also really hate the "they should get used to a pro schedule" part of the argument. They played in juniors before college so its not like they haven't played a big schedule before and its not like they are going to forget that because they played in college for a few years.

The other thing is it assumes that 1) college is just a few hockey games on the weekend, and maybe practice during the week. College football players might not go to class, but in general the hockey players do, and 2) that there's no value to getting a college degree because they've apparently got things made in the NHL. Even prospects as highly touted as Coyle are far from guaranteed to make it in the NHL.

rynryn 08-10-2011 05:25 PM

it would be interesting (but a pain in the ass to create) if there was a doc that has all the first round players for a decade or so and their developmental league stats to see how they match up once they hit the nhl. I always hear stuff like goals don't mean as much coming from the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League referenced in a vague sort of way and I was wondering if there was a really simple data sheet out there outlining how stats from dev leagues correlate with NHL stats vs players from other dev leagues.

that was probably as confusing as it seemed in my head. I apologize.

squidz* 08-10-2011 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rynryn (Post 35826295)
it would be interesting (but a pain in the ass to create) if there was a doc that has all the first round players for a decade or so and their developmental league stats to see how they match up once they hit the nhl. I always hear stuff like goals don't mean as much coming from the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League referenced in a vague sort of way and I was wondering if there was a really simple data sheet out there outlining how stats from dev leagues correlate with NHL stats vs players from other dev leagues.

that was probably as confusing as it seemed in my head. I apologize.

I'm not familiar with any substantial public information of that type. It would be a perfect thing for a stats student to do for their big project. If you had access to all the data, it would probably be relatively trivial to do the analysis on.


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