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-   -   The Kariya screwjob? (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=966737)

Walkingthroughforest 08-10-2011 07:04 PM

The Kariya screwjob?
 
A lot of hate is thrown around here by Ducks fans about the departure of Paul Kariya from Anaheim to Colorado in 2003 after losing Game 7 of the SCF's and taking an 8.8 million dollar paycut.
But what isn't said is the fact that Anaheim didn't pick up the qualifying offer on his contract, which payed him 10 million dollars per season, freeing Kariya to free agency.
To me, it seems that after suffering through that franchise and finally seeing a light at the end of the tunnel, the Ducks not picking up his qualifying offer was a huge slap to the face and allowed him to become a UFA 3 years earlier then the CBA allowed at the time.
Why are Ducks fans more upset at Kariya and not the management of the Ducks? After Kariya finally led them to the closest they'd ever been to the cup, they decide to drop his option and expect to sign a discount?

What the Faulk 08-10-2011 07:08 PM

Because Kariya certainly wasn't worth that kind of contract.

I find it hilarious that he signed with Nashville coming out of the lockout for 500k less than the Hurricanes offered him.

Walkingthroughforest 08-10-2011 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Anton (Post 35829025)
Because Kariya certainly wasn't worth that kind of contract.

I find it hilarious that he signed with Nashville coming out of the lockout for 500k less than the Hurricanes offered him.

At the time, Kariya was still considered one of the best players in the game. And premier players made that sort of money, especially in environments where winning wasn't a tradition.

Static 08-10-2011 07:12 PM

Kariya made a handshake agreement with Brian Murray that Murray wouldn't qualify him at that number so that they could bring in Selanne, or other help, to the team with Kariya at a more reasonable price. Kariya of course turned his back on that deal.

He got his, so whatever.

Unholy 08-10-2011 07:13 PM

This won't end well. If your question was more towards why some Ducks fans acted the way they did, why didn't you post this on the Ducks board? :help:

thenextone 08-10-2011 07:14 PM

The Ducks hoped to negotiate a deal that would pay him less than $10M a season, which they thought they couldn't afford at the time.

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkingthroughforest (Post 35828949)
A lot of hate is thrown around here by Ducks fans about the departure of Paul Kariya from Anaheim to Colorado in 2003 after losing Game 7 of the SCF's and taking an 8.8 million dollar paycut.
But what isn't said is the fact that Anaheim didn't pick up the qualifying offer on his contract, which payed him 10 million dollars per season, freeing Kariya to free agency.
To me, it seems that after suffering through that franchise and finally seeing a light at the end of the tunnel, the Ducks not picking up his qualifying offer was a huge slap to the face and allowed him to become a UFA 3 years earlier then the CBA allowed at the time.
Why are Ducks fans more upset at Kariya and not the management of the Ducks? After Kariya finally led them to the closest they'd ever been to the cup, they decide to drop his option and expect to sign a discount?

The Ducks didn't extend a qualifying offer because, at least it's believed, that they had made a gentleman's agreement for a longer-term contract.

Tavaresmagicalplay* 08-10-2011 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Great Anton (Post 35829025)
Because Kariya certainly wasn't worth that kind of contract.

I find it hilarious that he signed with Nashville coming out of the lockout for 500k less than the Hurricanes offered him.

Yes he was. If you look at how much money Doug Weight made he was easily worth that.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sojourn (Post 35829205)
The Ducks didn't extend a qualifying offer because, at least it's believed, that they had made a gentleman's agreement for a longer-term contract.

Care to elaborate? Where did this information come from?

Brodeur 08-10-2011 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Static (Post 35829139)
Kariya made a handshake agreement with Brian Murray that Murray wouldn't qualify him at that number so that they could bring in Selanne, or other help, to the team with Kariya at a more reasonable price. Kariya of course turned his back on that deal.

He got his, so whatever.

Do you have an article about this handshake agreement? Bryan Murray seemed to indicate the opposite when they finally decided not to qualify Kariya:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/07/01/sp...ref=paulkariya

Quote:

''It's tough financial times in our business, and we have to do some restructuring,'' General Manager Bryan Murray said. ''We will still try to negotiate a contract with him.''

Murray sounded unsure of the chances of getting Kariya to come back for next season. ''He did not give us the right of first refusal.'' he said. ''He was obviously disappointed.''
Not sure if I'd classify it as a "screwjob". The Ducks had trouble fielding a competitive club while having a ~39 million payroll with Kariya taking up 10 million.

They essentially used the money they had earmarked for Kariya on Sergei Fedorov who signed a 5 year, 40 million dollar deal (perhaps ironically, Fedorov got paid 10 million that first year).

Most of the bitterness from Ducks fans seems to related to why Kariya didn't arrange the Teemu reunion in Anaheim instead of Colorado.

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tavaresmagicalplay (Post 35829291)
Care to elaborate? Where did this information come from?

From people within the organization. Could I provide links? No. It happened years ago, and I'm not inclined to search through a lot of old articles.

I'm past it. I was shocked at the time, and maybe I felt a little betrayed, but it's history. Kariya really wasn't worth that kind of money to Anaheim anymore. He was a PPG player at the time. It had been a couple of years since he was in the top 10 in points.

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brodeur (Post 35829309)
Not sure if I'd classify it as a "screwjob". The Ducks had trouble fielding a competitive club while having a ~39 million payroll with Kariya taking up 10 million.

They essentially used the money they had earmarked for Kariya on Sergei Fedorov who signed a 5 year, 40 million dollar deal (perhaps ironically, Fedorov got paid 10 million that first year).

Most of the bitterness from Ducks fans seems to related to why Kariya didn't arrange the Teemu reunion in Anaheim instead of Colorado.

Don't get me started on Fedorov. I think Anaheim signed him just to put another face on the franchise. That didn't turn out too well, but I'm sure he sold some tickets.

Tavaresmagicalplay* 08-10-2011 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sojourn (Post 35829487)
From people within the organization. Could I provide links? No. It happened years ago, and I'm not inclined to search through a lot of old articles.

I'm past it. I was shocked at the time, and maybe I felt a little betrayed, but it's history. Kariya really wasn't worth that kind of money to Anaheim anymore. He was a PPG player at the time. It had been a couple of years since he was in the top 10 in points.

I don't know. The previous quote by Murray sheds some new light on it but fair enough.

OilerTyler 08-10-2011 07:35 PM

Ducks fans should be mad at Selanne for luring him to Colorado

mooseOAK* 08-10-2011 07:39 PM

If Kariya was hurt by not getting that qualifying offer then that was his problem and not Anaheim's.

Walkingthroughforest 08-10-2011 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mooseOAK (Post 35829833)
If Kariya was hurt by not getting that qualifying offer then that was his problem and not Anaheim's.

If you were the face of a pitiful the franchise for nearly 10 years and your team was finally starting to succeed, wouldn't you be a little pissed that management wasn't honouring the contract they agreed to?

SabresFan44 08-10-2011 07:45 PM

http://thesportsdomain.files.wordpre...l-screwjob.jpg

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkingthroughforest (Post 35829903)
If you were the face of a pitiful the franchise for nearly 10 years and your team was finally starting to succeed, wouldn't you be a little pissed that management wasn't honouring the contract they agreed to?

Oh give me a break. Now you're just talking trash on Anaheim. Kariya made a crapload of money playing for Anaheim. Don't try to make him out to be the victim. They didn't owe him anything, and I certainly don't believe he owed them either.

He left because he felt Colorado gave him a better opportunity to win the Cup. That's the long and the short of it. And please don't try to tell Anaheim fans that Kariya led Anaheim in those 2003 playoffs. We know better. This entire board should know better. No one talks about Kariya's amazing 2003 playoff run. They talk about one goal of his.

Pinkfloyd 08-10-2011 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkingthroughforest (Post 35828949)
A lot of hate is thrown around here by Ducks fans about the departure of Paul Kariya from Anaheim to Colorado in 2003 after losing Game 7 of the SCF's and taking an 8.8 million dollar paycut.
But what isn't said is the fact that Anaheim didn't pick up the qualifying offer on his contract, which payed him 10 million dollars per season, freeing Kariya to free agency.
To me, it seems that after suffering through that franchise and finally seeing a light at the end of the tunnel, the Ducks not picking up his qualifying offer was a huge slap to the face and allowed him to become a UFA 3 years earlier then the CBA allowed at the time.
Why are Ducks fans more upset at Kariya and not the management of the Ducks? After Kariya finally led them to the closest they'd ever been to the cup, they decide to drop his option and expect to sign a discount?

Because the decision not to qualify him was the right one. He wasn't a 10 million dollar player. Kariya led the team during the regular season but that playoff run was 99.5% on the back of Giguere. They still tried to re-sign him but at a rate that was suitable for their financial pre-lockout situation and would help the team overall. The fact that Kariya wouldn't work with the team is probably why the fans were upset with him. If he is a true leader, he has to take the lead and do what's best for the team and he didn't do that.

Tavaresmagicalplay* 08-10-2011 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd (Post 35830121)
Because the decision not to qualify him was the right one. He wasn't a 10 million dollar player. Kariya led the team during the regular season but that playoff run was 99.5% on the back of Giguere. They still tried to re-sign him but at a rate that was suitable for their financial pre-lockout situation and would help the team overall. The fact that Kariya wouldn't work with the team is probably why the fans were upset with him. If he is a true leader, he has to take the lead and do what's best for the team and he didn't do that.

What superstar player has ever taken a paycut ever? Steve Yzerman never even took a paycut.

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OilerTyler (Post 35829729)
Ducks fans should be mad at Selanne for luring him to Colorado

Or at management for trading Selanne to begin with. :/

Unholy 08-10-2011 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tavaresmagicalplay (Post 35830181)
What superstar player has ever taken a paycut ever? Steve Yzerman never even took a paycut.

See Teemu Selanne

Steve Holt 08-10-2011 07:54 PM

To be a captain and almost lead your team to the promised land, only to leave for what was seen as greener pastures? Yeah, I'd be extremely pissed if I were a Ducks fan.

Sojourn 08-10-2011 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tavaresmagicalplay (Post 35830181)
What superstar player has ever taken a paycut ever? Steve Yzerman never even took a paycut.

How about Lidstrom?

Selanne? Hell, Niedermayer took less to play in Anaheim with his brother. I could probably keep going.

Epsilon 08-10-2011 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sojourn (Post 35830035)
Oh give me a break. Now you're just talking trash on Anaheim. Kariya made a crapload of money playing for Anaheim. Don't try to make him out to be the victim. They didn't owe him anything, and I certainly don't believe he owed them either.

He left because he felt Colorado gave him a better opportunity to win the Cup. That's the long and the short of it. And please don't try to tell Anaheim fans that Kariya led Anaheim in those 2003 playoffs. We know better. This entire board should know better. No one talks about Kariya's amazing 2003 playoff run. They talk about one goal of his.

It's funny how getting plastered by Scott Stevens actually made people remember Kariya's 2003 playoffs as something much more than it was. Even the goal he scored afterwards was just a garbage time goal that didn't have any bearing on the actual outcome. He got outscored by a 40 year old Adam Oates (in his 2nd last NHL season) and finished with similar point totals to Mike LeClerc and Rob Niedermayer.

I actually don't think Ducks fans were the ones most upset about this, considering they lost a good player in Kariya. I actually remember most of the whining on this board coming from fans of small market teams, who were complaining about how it was "unfair" for Kariya and Selanne to sign with Colorado at "below-market rates".

Pinkfloyd 08-10-2011 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tavaresmagicalplay (Post 35830181)
What superstar player has ever taken a paycut ever? Steve Yzerman never even took a paycut.

Joe Thornton's new contract is a pay cut.


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