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-   -   News Article: Predicting Production: Cole Hard Facts (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=972113)

neofury* 08-21-2011 03:09 PM

Predicting Production: Cole Hard Facts
 
It isn't written by me just this writer on hockeybuzz. Some of them are half decent.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Steve...acts/139/37491

Steven Hindle wrote it. Some interesting stuff, long summer so hopefully some people will enjoy the read.

onice 08-21-2011 03:20 PM

I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

neofury* 08-21-2011 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 36094593)
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

I don't necessarily think they're expecting more production. More-so they're expecting the line to click better overall. The last two seasons Cammy being injured really made that line suffer. Now if he's injured we have relatively good people in the top 6 still. Andrei gets bumped up and voila Cammy-Plek-AK go back for example if Cole goes down. There are more options in general this year and I think that was the goal of the org. Plus I think Cole is a better fit on that line, you are right though production and injuries are a question mark. Hopefully the chemistry is there.

Estimated_Prophet 08-21-2011 03:58 PM

I like the signing as he is exactly the type of player that was needed.

The writer is probably mistaken by predicting PP production for Cole. Cole has below average hands and doesn't excel in "half-court" offensive situations. His production has always come from the transition/breakout game where he uses his phenomenal speed to overtake defenders and crash the net.

I would prefer to see Kostitsyn on the PP and Cole on the PK. With Cole and Plekanec on the PK would see a ton of shorthanded break aways.

neofury* 08-21-2011 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet (Post 36095411)
I like the signing as he is exactly the type of player that was needed.

The writer is probably mistaken by predicting PP production for Cole. Cole has below average hands and doesn't excel in "half-court" offensive situations. His production has always come from the transition/breakout game where he uses his phenomenal speed to overtake defenders and crash the net.

I would prefer to see Kostitsyn on the PP and Cole on the PK. With Cole and Plekanec on the PK would see a ton of shorthanded break aways.

Sounds like an interesting idea honestly. I like how this team is stacked this year. We have a ton of depth in case of injuries, even Aaron Palushaj could make the jump hence why I don't think Pouliot was ever considered.

Estimated_Prophet 08-21-2011 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neofury (Post 36095605)
Sounds like an interesting idea honestly. I like how this team is stacked this year. We have a ton of depth in case of injuries, even Aaron Palushaj could make the jump hence why I don't think Pouliot was ever considered.

Gauthier/Gainey are trying to create a culture of proessionalism and winning on this roster. Players who don't buy in (Latendresse, Sergei, Pouliot, Grabovski) are dispatched and players like Gill and Darche are kept.

When an organization successfully creates a winning culture (Red Wings, Patriots, Spurs) it is easier to bring in highly skilled but high maintenance players who then have little choice but to conform to the winning team-first atmosphere. We are not there yet but are well on our way.

I love the direction that the organization is headed......just have to tolerate the bean-counter posters who can't find a metric to quantify the value of intangibles such as these.

Hackett 08-21-2011 08:25 PM

I dont expect the world out of cole. If he fits the habs mould and puts up 45 points, I think you got a decent year out of him.

The habs strength is in numbers, not star players. They will need to rely on a balanced attack.

overlords 08-21-2011 08:37 PM

I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.

neofury* 08-22-2011 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by overlords (Post 36100985)
I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.

Great analogy :laugh:

Yeah definitely the way I see it if you can have one power forward on each of the top 3 lines you're set.

Stjonnypopo 08-22-2011 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neofury (Post 36107819)
Great analogy :laugh:

Yeah definitely the way I see it if you can have one power forward on each of the top 3 lines you're set.

It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.

neofury* 08-22-2011 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo (Post 36108113)
It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.

Agreed, point I was making is that having Pacioretty and Cole on the top two lines is pretty awesome.

Andrei is like a poor mans power forward so for the third line it all works out.

hototogisu 08-22-2011 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stjonnypopo (Post 36108113)
It's not about every team having the same formula of Sniper - Playmaker - Power Forward though, it's about our team needing to have some power guys.

A balanced attack has always been key:

http://redrobotblog.files.wordpress....ockey-team.jpg

PricePkPatch 08-22-2011 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neofury (Post 36108467)
Agreed, point I was making is that having Pacioretty and Cole on the top two lines is pretty awesome.

Andrei is like a poor mans power forward so for the third line it all works out.

He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success

neofury* 08-22-2011 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PricePkPatch (Post 36108631)
He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success

Exactly. One thing that does frustrate me about Andrei is he's shown flashes of being able to be a good power forward but he really doesn't use those skills as often as he should. I don't personally think it's laziness so much as hockey sense.

He lacks that extra second of time a lot of power forwards have that give them that jump.

macavoy 08-22-2011 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 36094593)
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

You make a good point but Andre spent little time on that line and was productive when he was there. The problem as the article points out is more along the lines of "the Latendresse/Pouliot/Kostitsyn/Moen/Darche train that has run through that open wing on the Canadiens top line has been more of a hindrance than a help"

PricePkPatch 08-22-2011 09:04 AM

If we believe the Hurrican board, Cole has great top speed and can go on breakaways very efficiently.

I can't wait to see Markov feed him his Magical Passes to the neutral zone and then hope to see him rush the zone.

MM425 08-22-2011 09:15 AM

Honestly, I think Cole is a perfect fit for this team. He compliments our other players styles very well and could be a big boost to the PP.

I predict a 25/25ish season from him which would be solid.

Jigger77 08-22-2011 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 36094593)
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

I like to think of him as an improvement over Pouliot rather than an improvement over Akost.

PricePkPatch 08-22-2011 10:31 AM

I just realized; (groan) the kinds of puns we'll see if Cole makes the NHL Headlines..

"Knocked out Cole"
"Cole chills Garden"
"Cole-blooded scorer"
"Switching line Cole-Turkey"


... I think I'll get an infraction

habfaninvictoria 08-22-2011 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PricePkPatch (Post 36108631)
He makes it up with alternate skills. I say it again: 3rd line is our key to success

We don't have an elite scorer so we need to have 3 effective lines. For the past 15 + years we haven't had either. The addition of Cole gives us at least 7 20 Goal players. Gionta and Cammy should pot 30+. Cole and Pleks with 25+. Patches, AK, and Desharnais with 20+. That whole paradigm disappears without AK or Cole.

Ozymandias 08-22-2011 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onice (Post 36094593)
I had reservations when this signing was made and that article hasn't dispelled any of them.

If Habs fans think that Cole is going to be an immense improvement over Andrei on that line, I think they'll be disappointed. Cole is a nice complementary player and so is Andrei.

But I hope I'm wrong and Cole lights it up.

Because you want to define him that way.

Cole is added depth to our top 9. And it's this addition coupled with a few young players rising that will make Cole a good signing.

We have 7 players in Plex, Cam, Gio, Gomez, AK, Markov and Subban who are all good for at least 40 points on a full season.

But now, you can add Cole, and three young players in Pac, Eller or DD, which at least one of them should reach 40 on a full season.

So our range is at least 7 players at 40 points and that's a very reserved scenario. Habs could very well finish with 9 of them.

Good offense doesn't just come from high-end talent, it can also come from deep talente depth offense.

Cole also adds a potential 20 goal scorer, which gives us 5 guys who are all good for at least 20 goals in a full season, and at least one of the four young players in Pac, Subban, Eller and DD, could reach 20 goals.

Since the lockout, teams that have over 4 x 20 goals scorers and/or over 6 x 40 points producers, are usually a lock for the playoffs and have an offense at least a little over 3 GPG.

If Habs finish with 5 x 20+ goal scorers and 8 x 40+ point producers, you can bet they'll be in the top 5 in the east. And it is a likely scenario, unless we get an overload of injuries, worst than last season.

matCH penalty 08-22-2011 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PricePkPatch (Post 36110671)
I just realized; (groan) the kinds of puns we'll see if Cole makes the NHL Headlines..

Kostitsyn-Plekanec-Cole... The Cole Slav line. :snide:

Jakomyte 08-22-2011 04:08 PM

Heading into next year after acquiring Cole gives me a bit more optimism that the Habs can take another step forward in terms of their offensive consistency.

I remember during the dark years of the late 90s/early 2000s when it seemed like the Habs only really had one scoring line, which was Koivu's line. The difference between those teams, and Habs teams that have been sneaking into the playoffs since the early-mid 2000s has been consistently having a second scoring line, which in my mind started in 2003-2004 when Ribeiro/Ryder broke out and provided a second line after Koivu-Zednik.

Going into next season, I feel the Habs are really starting to build towards that skilled forward depth that teams like Philly and Chicago have that have made them so successful recently. I see us as potentially having 9 forwards that could play in the top 6 (Cammalleri, Plekanec, Cole, Pacioretty, Gomez, Gionta, Kostitsyn, Eller, Desharnais). I'm excited to see whether this roster can provide the team with a bit more scoring to add on top of solid D and great goaltending.

Lafleurs Guy 08-22-2011 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by overlords (Post 36100985)
I think Cole will bring more than goals and assists to the habs. I've used this analogy before, but I think of the Cole signing as finally getting that long skinny piece in tetris when you've been waiting for it. We've got every other dimension in our forward core. We've got speed, sniping ability, puck handling, playmaking etc.. but what Cole brings we sorely lack. I won't only be looking at how Cole plays, but how it changes the playstyle/productivity of whoever he's playing with.

I didn't like the signing due to Cole's age but I agree with what you've said here. It's nice we finally got a guy with some physical edge to him and I hope he can set a nice example for some of the younger guys like MaxPac.

TheBuriedHab 08-23-2011 06:59 AM

I think the best thing Cole brings is more depth up front. When Pacioretty went down last year we had such a gaping hole up front that nobody else could fill. Now we aren't spread out so thin that one injury can cripple our forward depth. We added a competent top 6 player, with size that fleshes out the top 9 very nicely.


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