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Oi'll say! 08-27-2011 12:15 AM

Teemu Hartikainen
 
I read a Brownlee article about Teemu today, he was wondering if the ahl would be a big step backwards for the kid. No big knock on his article, but I think it would be great for Harski to play in the AHL and get an increased offensive role.

His stats are here ( Teemu http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...php?pid=112587 ), fwiw he got 42 points in 66 games playing his first season in NA. IMO that's excellent for a guy who I was lead to believe started off in a checking role and was definitely physical and had a knack for getting under the opposition's skin.

Could Hartikainen be that kind of player with the right combination of size, strength, tenacity and just enough skill to be effective on a line with a superstar player? We have two number 1 picks here now, if for example RNH turns into a legit threat to hit 100+ points a few times in his career would Teemu be good enough to ride shotgun like K Stevens ( http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p...y.php?pid=5177 ) did with Mario? (minus the 250 pims of course)

At 21 K Stevens was still in college and he had an ok career, and imo Harski's 20 year old season in the ahl was comparable to what Stevens' 20 yr old season was in college.

K Stevens 20 yrs old 1985-86 Boston College H-East 42gp, 17g-27a-44pts
Hartikainen 20 yrs old 2010-11 Oklahoma City Barons 66gp, 17g-25a-42pts

If Harski was to play in the ahl next season what could we realistically expect from him? Is he getting bigger, faster, stronger, is his skill level increasing? Confidence? Defensive game?

K Stevens 21 yrs old 1986-87 Boston College H-East 39gp, 35g-35a-70pts
Hartikainen 21 yrs old 2011-12 Oklahoma City Barons ??gp, ??g-??a-??pts

Stevens went supernova at 21, I'm not expecting the same from Harski. I think he'd need 95 points in the ahl to rival Stevens' super season and it's not realistic. But can he get up near 1ppg over a whole ahl season in 2011/12?

If this season turns out to be the high point in Teemu's career this is officially the worst thread ever :laugh:

I think 1st line is a stretch because he doesn't fight, but I'm officially pimping him as a strong candidate for high end 2nd line potential.

Tavaresmagicalplay* 08-27-2011 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oi'll say! (Post 36239998)
Could Hartikainen be that kind of player with the right combination of size, strength, tenacity and just enough skill to be effective on a line with a superstar player?

A la Tomas Holmstrom?

Seriously the Tomas Holmstrom comparisons are pretty spot on. He's a terrible skater, he does most of his damage in front of the net, average shot, below average hands, tenacious. Only difference is Hartikainens a bit more physical. Been a fan of the guy for a while. He'll be a good one for us. One of the few locks for a top 9 spot for the future.

Bryanbryoil 08-27-2011 12:51 AM

I wonder where the below average hands stuff comes from? Kid looked like he had pretty decent hands from what I saw of him last year.

Ragss 08-27-2011 12:58 AM

I agree, he has pretty decent hands and I didn't see his skating as some big downfall like everyone seems to say. Besides that, he doesn't have to do much skating between the corner and the front of the net. I really, really like this kid. Ever since I saw him in the WJC a few years ago I've been dying to see him in the NHL and he didn't disappoint last season. I won't be too hurt if he goes back to the A for a season, I mean as Tambo has said they are taking the Detroit approach and aren't worried about keeping him down there for another season. Whatever the case, I think Harski will be a really solid NHLer for years to come.

Bryanbryoil 08-27-2011 01:01 AM

He'll get a big role in OKC and hopefully he continues to improve and maybe he looks like a top 6 guy instead of a top 9 guy.

thadd 08-27-2011 04:27 AM

Should be a first liner on the AHL club. As much as I'd like to see him playing in Edmonton I'd much rather like to see him get a sick load of minutes to develop his offense further if it's possible. He's already a pretty good 2-way player. If we can develop him into a 30G/30A assist power forward he'll be one of the biggest surprises come Edmonton's way since... well... maybe Shawn Horcoff(Before the big contract.)

Spawn 08-27-2011 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thadd (Post 36242016)
Should be a first liner on the AHL club. As much as I'd like to see him playing in Edmonton I'd much rather like to see him get a sick load of minutes to develop his offense further if it's possible. He's already a pretty good 2-way player. If we can develop him into a 30G/30A assist power forward he'll be one of the biggest surprises come Edmonton's way since... well... maybe Shawn Horcoff(Before the big contract.)

I think him developing into a 20/20 guy would be pretty awesome and a big surprise.

I've got nothing wrong with him starting the year in the minors. Then again I don't have a huge issue with him being a 4th line guy here this year either. I think both would help to develop different aspects of his game.

Lay Z Boy GM 08-27-2011 05:02 AM

He needs to at least start the year in OKC. We can't go from saying everyone needs to earn their spot to giving spots away to questionable players a year later, we need to be consistent.

I think Harti could be a PPG player this year in the AHL. Even if his offense stays about the same at least he could work out any kinks in game.

I have a good feeling about Teemu. His hands are great by the way, that was the first thing I noticed about him (kinda hard not to when he undressed a goalie during the preseason, it might have been the rookie tourney in Penticton now that I think about it). I can't recall much from when he got some games in with the Oilers so I don't remember how well he skated, I do remember that he wasn't shy about throwing hits around at all.

Right now I see a guy that can score 20 goals a season on the right line, a guy that will punish opponents physically and hopefully cause all kinds of mayhem in front of the net, and if we're lucky he can kill penalties. I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being a 50+ point player though, and I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up on the 2nd line either.

It just hit me that we could have a 3rd line of Hartikainen - Lander - Omark/Hamilton/Pitlick

Our depth is going to be very good in a couple years.

The Perfect Human* 08-27-2011 05:27 AM

Neither Hall or RNH are going to be effective enough to be the Lemieux/Datsyuk that make Hartikainen a K.Stevens/Holmstrom-type (extremely effective complimentary players).

If Hartikainen's going to be a real difference-maker, he's going to have to find a way to move past C.Hamilton for the 3LW spot, or somehow crash-and-bang his way past MPS into the 2LW spot.

I honestly don't see him having a role beyond soft ES minutes as the 4LW, while seeing heavy PP minutes as a net-front presence. It's an efficient use of a specific role player.

Lay Z Boy GM 08-27-2011 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 (Post 36242216)
Neither Hall or RNH are going to be effective enough to be the Lemieux/Datsyuk that make Hartikainen a K.Stevens/Holmstrom-type (extremely effective complimentary players).

If Hartikainen's going to be a real difference-maker, he's going to have to find a way to move past C.Hamilton for the 3LW spot, or somehow crash-and-bang his way past MPS into the 2LW spot.

I honestly don't see him having a role beyond soft ES minutes as the 4LW, while seeing heavy PP minutes as a net-front presence. It's an efficient use of a specific role player.

It's too premature to say for sure. Hall is already really hard to contain and it's only going to get worse as he gets older. RNH looks like he could be a master at finding people on the ice, as well as dangling pretty well himself. If they gel well together at all I think they could be a very dynamic duo and Hartikainen could potentially fit in there. However I think Hall is basically going to fill that role himself (the kid has Iginla written all over him), and much more, so Eberle/Hemsky/Pajaarvi could still fit on that line. But like I said it's really early to tell, we're talking about lines consisting of very young players and it's too early to accurately project them.

The Perfect Human* 08-27-2011 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lay Z Boy GM (Post 36242248)
It's too premature to say for sure. Hall is already really hard to contain and it's only going to get worse as he gets older. RNH looks like he could be a master at finding people on the ice, as well as dangling pretty well himself. If they gel well together at all I think they could be a very dynamic duo and Hartikainen could potentially fit in there. However I think Hall is basically going to fill that role himself (the kid has Iginla written all over him), and much more, so Eberle/Hemsky/Pajaarvi could still fit on that line. But like I said it's really early to tell, we're talking about lines consisting of very young players and it's too early to accurately project them.

Well Hall and Hartikainen are never going to be 2 guys that play well together on a line. Both are LW's, and on top of that Hartikainen doesn't compliment Hall's style well. It's similar to why Holmstrom never saw extended time with Shanahan and Hull - he wasn't a good compliment for those two snipers.

RNH is the one guy I see possibly having a chance to turn Hartikainen into a decent winger - basically carrying a "dead weight" player around to help spread the depth around the top-9. Hartikainen would be a good player, regardless of his slow speed, to work hard along the boards to retrieve pucks, and to open up space for RNH (like Holmstrom/Clowe/Eriksson have done for Datsyuk/Couture/Richards in the recent past). You give him one good winger and Hartikainen, and you suddenly you have a solid line to work with that lets you put Hall/Eberle on another line.

eg) with RNH at Datsyuk-like prime:

Hall-Horcoff-Eberle = LINE 1
Paajarvi-RNH-Hartikainen = LINE 2

Lay Z Boy GM 08-27-2011 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 (Post 36242266)
Well Hall and Hartikainen are never going to be 2 guys that play well together on a line. Both are LW's, and on top of that Hartikainen doesn't compliment Hall's style well. It's similar to why Holmstrom never saw extended time with Shanahan and Hull - he wasn't a good compliment for those two snipers.

RNH is the one guy I see possibly having a chance to turn Hartikainen into a decent winger - basically carrying a "dead weight" player around to help spread the depth around the top-9. Hartikainen would be a good player, regardless of his slow speed, to work hard along the boards to retrieve pucks, and to open up space for RNH (like Holmstrom/Clowe/Eriksson have done for Datsyuk/Couture/Richards in the recent past). You give him one good winger and Hartikainen, and you suddenly you have a solid line to work with that lets you put Hall/Eberle on another line.

eg) with RNH at Datsyuk-like prime:

Hall-Horcoff-Eberle = LINE 1
Paajarvi-RNH-Hartikainen = LINE 2

Looking at it again I think Hartikainen - RNH - Eberle could be a really good line some day. Harti could make some space for RNH and Ebs, while hopefully potting some goals himself. I also just like the idea of RNH and Eberle together, they would be a very smart duo with loads of skill, they just need someone to play physically on that line. Hall could do that though.

Philly85 08-27-2011 07:05 AM

Did I just see Mario Lemieux's name mentioned for some reason? And Kevin Stevens for that matter. I think everyone needs to just relax and temper things for a moment. Just sit back and watch things unfold as they may. If Hartski turns out to be a fan favourite 4th line banger who can chip in 5-10 goals we should all be happy. Still a lot left to see, long ways to go.

Fourier 08-27-2011 07:40 AM

Personally, I have always liked the idea of finding pairs that work together and then adding complementary players to the mix.

How flexible is Hartikainen? Could he play the right side?

Fourier 08-27-2011 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 (Post 36242266)
Well Hall and Hartikainen are never going to be 2 guys that play well together on a line. Both are LW's, and on top of that Hartikainen doesn't compliment Hall's style well. It's similar to why Holmstrom never saw extended time with Shanahan and Hull - he wasn't a good compliment for those two snipers.

RNH is the one guy I see possibly having a chance to turn Hartikainen into a decent winger - basically carrying a "dead weight" player around to help spread the depth around the top-9. Hartikainen would be a good player, regardless of his slow speed, to work hard along the boards to retrieve pucks, and to open up space for RNH (like Holmstrom/Clowe/Eriksson have done for Datsyuk/Couture/Richards in the recent past). You give him one good winger and Hartikainen, and you suddenly you have a solid line to work with that lets you put Hall/Eberle on another line.

eg) with RNH at Datsyuk-like prime:

Hall-Horcoff-Eberle = LINE 1
Paajarvi-RNH-Hartikainen = LINE 2

Hartikainen's skating improved a lot last year. It is no longer a significant concern. The same could be said of Lander. I am very impressed with the impact that individualized skating programs have had on the Oiler prospects.

Paralyzer 08-27-2011 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 (Post 36242216)
Neither Hall or RNH are going to be effective enough to be the Lemieux/Datsyuk that make Hartikainen a K.Stevens/Holmstrom-type (extremely effective complimentary players).

If Hartikainen's going to be a real difference-maker, he's going to have to find a way to move past C.Hamilton for the 3LW spot, or somehow crash-and-bang his way past MPS into the 2LW spot.

I honestly don't see him having a role beyond soft ES minutes as the 4LW, while seeing heavy PP minutes as a net-front presence. It's an efficient use of a specific role player.

Hall was saying in an interview that RNH will have a bigger impact this year than Hall did last year. That tells me both will be very dominant this year and Hall will be a supporter rather than the show hog.

Groucho 08-27-2011 11:24 AM

I would like to see Teemu get top six minutes in OKC this year and only be called up for injury duty

Latex* 08-27-2011 12:35 PM

I'll be extremely happy if Härski becomes a 3rd liner. 4th liner would be good also. He does not have the offensive instincts to play in a top 6 role.

I just hope he has a nice NHL career.

The Dayvan Cowboy 08-27-2011 01:21 PM

Didn't Teemu break Kurri's record for goals by an 18 year old in the SM-liiga? I'm almost sure he did. Either way, he broke some record set by Kurri in fairly impressive fashion so while we can't expect him to be a point getter, it isn't really fair to say he has bad hands or no offensive instinct.

Oilbleeder 08-27-2011 01:25 PM

To be honest, my biggest hope is that either he or Hamilton become a Marchand type player for us.

Physical presence, compliment player on a line, cycles, has decent hands to which he puts up 15-20 goals a season.

I'm really impressed with how much his skating has improved the past 2-3 seasons.

Tavaresmagicalplay* 08-27-2011 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Dayvan Cowboy (Post 36247458)
Didn't Teemu break Kurri's record for goals by an 18 year old in the SM-liiga? I'm almost sure he did. Either way, he broke some record set by Kurri in fairly impressive fashion so while we can't expect him to be a point getter, it isn't really fair to say he has bad hands or no offensive instinct.

Well I just go by what I see and also what finnish fans have told me as well. He doesn't capitalize on a lot of his chances. I can't look up my threads because I have a bunch of infractions but it's in one of the threads I made.

Ice Whole 08-27-2011 02:01 PM

I always picture Hartsky being like a Smyth/Holmstrom kind of player. I wonder if we will ever see a Hall-RNH-Hartsky line in the future. I think it will be tried at least once.

JessikaLovejoy 08-27-2011 02:10 PM

I think Hartikainen won over a lot of guys last season. In post-season interviews, I remember hearing Whitney, Gagner, Hall, and Horcoff mention him specifically as a young player that really stepped up and contributed.

I'd like to see him start down in the AHL and get some solid minutes down there in every situation.

Toydarian 08-27-2011 02:56 PM

If Gagner ends up progressing and becomes a solid 50-60 point 2nd line center, I wonder if we could see something like in the next few years

Paajarvi - Gagner - Hartikainen

Abu 08-27-2011 05:17 PM

I think that Härski won't play even a one game in AHL anymore. When I saw him play 2 seasons away in KalPa, he was just that good and he has developed in theese past 2 summers, so it would be an horrible mistake to put him to the minors.

OT: In KalPa the coach Pekka Virta wanted KalPa to play a kind of game, that no team has played before. In the offensive zone, KalPa didn't drive straight to net, but into the corners. There KalPa would hold the puck and move at the same time and play long attacks. After 1 to 2 minutes of attack, the players of opposite team were excausted (and think about when KalPa did that in every attack in the game, then in the end of an third period many teams were so tired that they didn't keep up with KalPa at all). After that KalPa would try drive to the net and either score or at least make the tired opposite team to take a penalty. In this type of game Hartikainen was the best. He would literally hold the puck alone for two minutes and no defender couldn't check him down because of his amazing balance. Then he would rise to the net and either score or make the defender draw a penalty.


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