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-   -   Sather and the Homegrown Rebuilding of the Rangers (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=984735)

I Am Chariot 09-15-2011 09:18 AM

Sather and the Homegrown Rebuilding of the Rangers
 
Have to give the Rangers and Sather credit... they are doing what they said they would do. Rebuild from within, homegrown at the core...

Ryan Callahan is the Captain of the NEW YORK RANGERS - Homegrown Captain


Look at the Blueline

Stall Girardi McD MDZ Sauer ... Erixon

Dubi Steps LUNDQVIST!!!


Now we did just sign the high profile UFA of the summer- but they are being much smarter about it imo, accenting a truly homegrown core. And it's a solid core....

They will likely need some teams ahead of them to flounder to contend this year but I'm feeling good about the team as a whole, the direction they are building and the fact the bulk of this team is coming up in the Rangers system ... feeling good about the team today

SupersonicMonkey* 09-15-2011 09:23 AM

Lundqvist
Staal
Callahan
Dubinsky
Girardi
McDonagh
Sauer
Stepan
Anisimov
Erixon
Del Zotto

Next year Kreider.

One could make the argument that Boyle is homegrown, as he wasn't really an NHL player till he came here.

Prust, as well.

Zuccarello may make it.

Jabroni 09-15-2011 09:25 AM

Nice to hear from you, Chariot. :handclap:

Agreed with all points.

Mint Berry Crunch 09-15-2011 09:27 AM

Took a while for Slats to get it done, but here we are... :)

chip chipperson* 09-15-2011 09:45 AM

**** glen sather.

Bleed Ranger Blue 09-15-2011 10:58 AM

He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.

GAGLine 09-15-2011 11:12 AM

I'm with you BRB. Prove it on the ice. Results are the only thing he should be judged on.

pld459666 09-15-2011 11:26 AM

.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.

Reading the OP I felt like I was about to be a wet blanket, but you beat me to it.

We have no top line talent and no clear cut #1 defenceman to speak of.

The goalie was drafted the year Sather took over. No one drafted that year has any connection to Sather as he had NO TIME to prepare for that draft.

I like that we have a core of secondary players to support top line guys like Richards and Gaborik, but that's all they are really.

offdacrossbar 09-15-2011 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.

bingo. exactly correct.

this team hasnt got the hardware to be puffing out its chest at all. in fact, sather hasnt done squat.

show me the money.

x BEUKEBOOM x 09-15-2011 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.


Mods:

Can we get this specific quote sticky'd & locked on the NYR front page for reflective thought in a few years time?


Not that it's way off base, as it is cetainly an understandable POV to those of us that have been NYR fans for longer than 10,15,20 years. But I think it sums perfectly a defeatest attitude that the boo birds carried around our stomping ground since the 7 year drought and a POV that quite frankly is probably not waranted anymore, although certainly understandable. But would love to be able to say "Told ya so." When this group of kids lights it up over then next few years.

It's different this time becsue development is different than it was 10 years ago or even 5 years ago. These kids today in the OHL/WHL/QMJHL would walk all over half of the 1990's NHL'ers they are so developed at such a young age, mostly due to the NHL All Stars of the 90's who run or own the teams in those league such as the Hunters, Gilmore, Graves, Sutters, etcs as opposed to Lances Harware Emporium.

SingnBluesOnBroadway 09-15-2011 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.

All of this and it's not as if Sather invented the idea of building from within. The fact that there's a salary cap forced him to go in this direction.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 09-15-2011 11:41 AM

Let's praise Sather when this team actually accomplishes something of importance. As has been said before, rebuilding a team isn't enough to applaud someone who's done nothing but fail. It's taken him a half a decade to put a respectable group in front of a star netminder he got lucky with.

Sather should have been truly commited years ago with this plan. The Jagr era, then Drury era should have never happened. Those veterans should have been pawned off for future assets, or better yet, completely avoided. The half-ass rebuild he went with ultimately delayed the inevitable.

KreiMeARiver* 09-15-2011 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop - some people have bought it hook line and sinker without the on-ice credentials to back it up as a successful plan.

In 11+ years he's produced teams that have:

-never finished above a 6th seed in the east
-won a grand total of 2 playoff rounds

Thats all you need to know right there.

Does a pessimist like me feel better about this team than years past? Sure. Fact of the matter is we have nothing to judge it against yet.

We only have the last 11 years, and his horrendous track record when it comes to actual results.

I've been watching for too long and am getting too old to feel good about things that cant be tangibly measured.

The past failures have been documented ad nauseum. We can't worry about the past. All I care about is what is the state of the team RIGHT NOW. And things are looking pretty darn good, if you ask me.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 09-15-2011 11:43 AM

Sbob your name is orange yo. Looks weird.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 09-15-2011 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hightide85 (Post 36722821)
The past failures have been documented ad nauseum. We can't worry about the past, and the future looks extremely bright. All I care about is what is the state of the team RIGHT NOW. And things are looking pretty darn good, if you ask me.

Since history has this mighty tendency to keep repeating itself, you have to acknowledge the past. If the Cap was 10M higher, we wouldn't have this much youth in our line-up. I guarantee it.

And just cause things are looking pretty darn good, doesn't mean they are. Looks are ****ing deceiving.

The goal is to build a championship team. As a homer, I can't deny that I'm excited about today and tomorrow. But as a realist, I still don't think this team is good enough to compete with the big boys around the league.

x BEUKEBOOM x 09-15-2011 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion (Post 36722809)
Let's praise Sather when this team actually accomplishes something of importance. As has been said before, rebuilding a team isn't enough to applaud someone who's done nothing but fail. It's taken him a half a decade to put a respectable group in front of a star netminder he got lucky with.

Sather should have been truly commited years ago with this plan. The Jagr era, then Drury era should have never happened. Those veterans should have been pawned off for future assets, or better yet, completely avoided. The half-ass rebuild he went with ultimately delayed the inevitable.

How much of that is Sather and how much is Dolan or the shareholders?

I was just as much of a Sather basher back in the day too, but that was in part due to the bagage of the Smith/Muckler era and I also realize he didn't do much with Edmonton either in the 90's, but the again, Edmonton was on a pretty strict budget with Joseph & Weight as their prime players. So even then he was handcuffed by ownership.

NYR Sting 09-15-2011 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueCollarBlueBlood (Post 36723027)
How much of that is Sather and how much is Dolan or the shareholders?

I was just as much of a Sather basher back in the day too, but that was in part due to the bagage of the Smith/Muckler era and I also realize he didn't do much with Edmonton either in the 90's, but the again, Edmonton was on a pretty strict budget with Joseph & Weight as their prime players. So even then he was handcuffed by ownership.

Ownership is why Sather drafted pure **** throughout the 90s (and earlier) and for at least half of his time with the Rangers?

What Sather has done is assembled an organization full of solid role players and excellent complimentary players. What he has failed to do to date is develop ANY homegrown franchise players. Not a single true star to build around.

Imagine if Richards wasn't scheduled to be a free agent this summer? Would the outlook for this coming season be nearly as great? No. Why? Because all Sather did was paint himself into a corner where the only chance for the team to take that next step was to sign a UFA, something that was no guarantee.

If Richards isn't available, this team is just as mediocre as it was last year, with no one coming up through the ranks to change that. We have a lot more solid young prospects coming, but no #1 playmaking centers.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 09-15-2011 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueCollarBlueBlood (Post 36723027)
How much of that is Sather and how much is Dolan or the shareholders?

I was just as much of a Sather basher back in the day too, but that was in part due to the bagage of the Smith/Muckler era and I also realize he didn't do much with Edmonton either in the 90's, but the again, Edmonton was on a pretty strict budget with Joseph & Weight as their prime players. So even then he was handcuffed by ownership.

wut?

Bleed Ranger Blue 09-15-2011 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueCollarBlueBlood (Post 36722703)
Mods:

Can we get this specific quote sticky'd & locked on the NYR front page for reflective thought in a few years time?


Not that it's way off base, as it is cetainly an understandable POV to those of us that have been NYR fans for longer than 10,15,20 years. But I think it sums perfectly a defeatest attitude that the boo birds carried around our stomping ground since the 7 year drought and a POV that quite frankly is probably not waranted anymore, although certainly understandable. But would love to be able to say "Told ya so." When this group of kids lights it up over then next few years.

It's different this time becsue development is different than it was 10 years ago or even 5 years ago. These kids today in the OHL/WHL/QMJHL would walk all over half of the 1990's NHL'ers they are so developed at such a young age, mostly due to the NHL All Stars of the 90's who run or own the teams in those league such as the Hunters, Gilmore, Graves, Sutters, etcs as opposed to Lances Harware Emporium.

I would LOVE for you to prove me wrong/tell me told ya so/do whatever it is an incessant cheerleader like yourself wants to do to the realist portion of the fanbase.

Fact is - YOU CANT, and thats really the whole point of my post.

What you can do is blindly declare how special this group of youngsters are and, like I said, Im not interested in that. Im interested in results.

Boom Boom Geoffrion* 09-15-2011 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Sting (Post 36723155)
Not a single true star to build around.

Aside from Lundqvist, you're absolutely correct. Still can't fully credit Sather for even drafting him, since he probably had no idea who he even was at the time.

I Am Chariot 09-15-2011 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 68MGQR10 (Post 36719175)
Nice to hear from you, Chariot. :handclap:

Agreed with all points.

You too buddy... I'm ready for a new season!!!

Here's to a GREAT INJURY FREE SEASON!!

RGY 09-15-2011 11:58 AM

The haters will continue to hate.

I Am Chariot 09-15-2011 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey (Post 36719113)
Lundqvist
Staal
Callahan
Dubinsky
Girardi
McDonagh
Sauer
Stepan
Anisimov
Erixon
Del Zotto

Next year Kreider.

One could make the argument that Boyle is homegrown, as he wasn't really an NHL player till he came here.

Prust, as well.

Zuccarello may make it.


I accept Prust and Boyle as part of the core...

I Am Chariot 09-15-2011 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue (Post 36721515)
He deserves no such credit.

He has created the illusion that this team is headed in the right direction by hanging onto the younger players and allowing them to develop -

I guess you cant make everyone happy...

NYR Viper 09-15-2011 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYR Sting (Post 36723155)
Ownership is why Sather drafted pure **** throughout the 90s (and earlier) and for at least half of his time with the Rangers?

What Sather has done is assembled an organization full of solid role players and excellent complimentary players. What he has failed to do to date is develop ANY homegrown franchise players. Not a single true star to build around.

Imagine if Richards wasn't scheduled to be a free agent this summer? Would the outlook for this coming season be nearly as great? No. Why? Because all Sather did was paint himself into a corner where the only chance for the team to take that next step was to sign a UFA, something that was no guarantee.

If Richards isn't available, this team is just as mediocre as it was last year, with no one coming up through the ranks to change that. We have a lot more solid young prospects coming, but no #1 playmaking centers.

Hank, Staal, Callahan. They all seem to be very good players any team would LOVE to have.

Dubinsky, Stepan, Anisimov, Sauer, McDonagh, Erixon. He had a hand in all of them.

Saying he isn't doing a good job now is biased from the first half of his reign with the Rangers. This is one of the best young teams in the league. Killing him because he works for an Original 6 Team who has money to spend is silly. The Rangers will always have money to spend. Richards was a player they felt they needed so they brought him in.

Some teams tank and draft the Stamkos' or the Kane's of the league. The Rangers don't tank and instead fill every other slot on their roster with home-grown players and add one or 2 pieces as they see fit.


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