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CrossCheck 10-04-2011 07:29 AM

Steve Downie / Ryan Shannon
 
Has he lost his place on your top 6?

And with the league LOOKING for players doing crazy things, is he going to be relegated to your bottom for agitating and not much?

I really love the ability of this hard nosed yet talented player but it seems like you guys have too much offensive up front for him to be contributing...

What u think?

Felonious Python 10-04-2011 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrossCheck (Post 37435057)
Has he lost his place on your top 6?

And with the league LOOKING for players doing crazy things, is he going to be relegated to your bottom for agitating and not much?

I really love the ability of this hard nosed yet talented player but it seems like you guys have too much offensive up front for him to be contributing...

What u think?

Boucher mixes things up a lot, so a losing a 'top-six' spot isn't necessarily the end of the world for him. He'll still get his chances with Stammer and Marty, as they have proven chemistry together.

The burden of proof, IMO, is on Connolly to prove he belongs in the NHL, especially on a line with Stammer and Marty. Early on, Downie should still hypothetically have a regular place on the PP before Connolly.

I'm also not completely sold on Purcell just yet, so Downie may also find a place with Vinny.

Follower of Yzlam 10-04-2011 02:18 PM

Whether he is on our top 6 I don't think factors in whether or not he has top six talent. There's a possibility both Malone and Downie could be on the third line centered by Moore, which would basically mean a third line that can score.

optionthree 11-04-2011 08:49 PM

A month in and he's got two points in twelve games while being -8. What's going on?

Rschmitz 11-04-2011 09:29 PM

Difference in linemates. Difference in play style.

Doctor Drej 11-04-2011 09:31 PM

He's a great tweener. He can play the grinding role about as effectively as they come and can hold his own on the Top 6 with Stamkos/Marty..etc.

His +/- is kind of a stinker given his track record of being a plus player on this team but that's not really his fault.

He hasn't "lost" any spot, he's just being played where we need him most right now. He's fine.

Still All In 11-05-2011 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by optionthree (Post 38982649)
A month in and he's got two points in twelve games while being -8. What's going on?

Been mixed with interesting linemates and found himself taking stupid penalties again.

I won't really give him the benefit of the doubt - he plays that game on the edge but lately he has been crossing over it and he needs to clean it up.

Felonious Python 11-05-2011 05:52 AM

#boom

tightightight 11-05-2011 02:58 PM

Downie seems a little off so far this year. He got like what 9 minutes of ice time last game?

Felonious Python 11-05-2011 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Contender (Post 39004615)
Downie seems a little off so far this year. He got like what 9 minutes of ice time last game?

He's also playing with Shannon.

Ten88Nineteen 11-05-2011 04:26 PM

There was an article about this somewhere, and in it Boucher mentioned that the idea was to spread the lines out a bit more. If anything, it seems like he's giving Downie a bit more responsibility by expecting the same level of production from him without playing alongside superstar players.

Obviously it hasn't worked out that great so far, though. That line will eventually be solid - Moore can work miracles if he has to.

snowden 11-05-2011 04:48 PM

Downie and Shannon together is a disaster. So many bad passes and it is quite evident they have 0 chemistry. Moore and Downie need someone else to gel with for them to start producing.

Felonious Python 11-05-2011 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ten88Nineteen (Post 39007261)
There was an article about this somewhere, and in it Boucher mentioned that the idea was to spread the lines out a bit more. If anything, it seems like he's giving Downie a bit more responsibility by expecting the same level of production from him without playing alongside superstar players.

Obviously it hasn't worked out that great so far, though. That line will eventually be solid - Moore can work miracles if he has to.

I don't think he's expecting the same production out of Downie without the Stammer and Marty. Boucher has said he's pleased with Stammer's production without Marty, however.

What I've been seeing is that if one player is bad, the whole line gets pulled for a bit. A year ago, Boucher might have switched the lines around, but it's probably too early in the process to do that successfully.

Shannon is the hold-up man in this situation.

LightningStrikes 11-05-2011 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Felonious Python (Post 39009455)
I don't think he's expecting the same production out of Downie without the Stammer and Marty. Boucher has said he's pleased with Stammer's production without Marty, however.

What I've been seeing is that if one player is bad, the whole line gets pulled for a bit. A year ago, Boucher might have switched the lines around, but it's probably too early in the process to do that successfully.

Shannon is the hold-up man in this situation.

He really hasn't many options left: Our top two lines are great so except for the occasional 91-4-26 shift I wouldn't suggest to break them up. Our 4th line aka the TNA line is doing well too. Ritola wasn't a solution on the LW with Moore and Downie and neither has been Shannon so far. It's still early though.

It really depends on Shannon, IMO. He has the speed, skill set and hockey IQ to become the Bergenheim replacement we were hoping for: High energy forward with a scoring touch. His game might be less physical than Bergenheim's but he seems smarter with the puck.

He's one of the very few new guys, he has to get into the system and develop chemistry with "total strangers" while the majority of the team knows the system and their linemates by heart. Once he's taken that step, the line will get going and if Downie stops taking stupid penalties he should get close to 15+ goals / 40+ points again.

HockeyTownUSA 11-06-2011 08:41 AM

I feel bad that Shannon has to play with Downie.

stammerhammer91 11-06-2011 09:18 AM

Yea downie has been playing with moore and shannon but i don't know, i want shannon to work out but it always seems like he is just one step behind or one play behind. I reallly like the lineup better when jones is on that line so i will continue to hope that he gets in the lineup but no matter what i see us having to pick up an extra forward at the ttrade deadline. Downie hasn't been playing bad but he hasn't really been playing good either. He is just kind of out there hitting every once in a while. I will say that i don't see him winning as many puck battles as last year. He is a playoff performer though :)

BoltSTH 11-06-2011 10:03 AM

Malone and Connolly are taking up the banging/puck retrieval roles on the top lines, so Downie has to be on the 3rd line.

The 3rd line is the only one not showing any chemistry. I would rather have Jones or Tyrell instead of Shannon.

HockeyTownUSA 11-06-2011 10:28 AM

Why is Shannon being made the scapegoat all of a sudden? Downie has 13 games in and 2 points and one was a PP goal. Horrible. Who are you pointing the finger at for his overall bad play when Shannon was out of the line up for 5 games. Unjustified IMO.

I'd rather see Downie sit for a few games. Deserves to.

Felonious Python 11-06-2011 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HockeyTownUSA (Post 39049501)
Why is Shannon being made the scapegoat all of a sudden? Downie has 13 games in and 2 points and one was a PP goal. Horrible. Who are you pointing the finger at for his overall bad play when Shannon was out of the line up for 5 games. Unjustified IMO.

I'd rather see Downie sit for a few games. Deserves to.

Downie never really racked them up with Marty and Stammer either. I mean 10 goals and 30 points for guy who plays on the first line ain't all that great.

Shannon's name is getting mentioned because Downie-Moore-Shannon seem to be a bit of an item now, but Shannon's lack of picking up the system quickly enough leads to Boucher sitting the entire line a bit more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snowden (Post 39007957)
Downie and Shannon together is a disaster. So many bad passes and it is quite evident they have 0 chemistry. Moore and Downie need someone else to gel with for them to start producing.

Outside of some guys who will just 'click' with each other, chemistry is developed over time.

So again, Shannon's troubles are two-fold. One, learning the new system, and two, developing chemistry with complete strangers in that new system.

Doctor Drej 11-06-2011 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HockeyTownUSA (Post 39049501)
Why is Shannon being made the scapegoat all of a sudden? Downie has 13 games in and 2 points and one was a PP goal. Horrible. Who are you pointing the finger at for his overall bad play when Shannon was out of the line up for 5 games. Unjustified IMO.

I'd rather see Downie sit for a few games. Deserves to.

Uhh no.

Downie contributes in alot of other ways than just points. Shannon over Downie? C'mon now.

stammerhammer91 11-06-2011 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HockeyTownUSA (Post 39049501)
Why is Shannon being made the scapegoat all of a sudden? Downie has 13 games in and 2 points and one was a PP goal. Horrible. Who are you pointing the finger at for his overall bad play when Shannon was out of the line up for 5 games. Unjustified IMO.

I'd rather see Downie sit for a few games. Deserves to.

For players on the 3rd line, it is not all about getting points. A lot of it is about bringing energy and shutting down the oppenent as well. The odd goal here or there helps out a lot but points aren't everything, especially for downie

Still All In 11-06-2011 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HockeyTownUSA (Post 39049501)
Why is Shannon being made the scapegoat all of a sudden? Downie has 13 games in and 2 points and one was a PP goal. Horrible. Who are you pointing the finger at for his overall bad play when Shannon was out of the line up for 5 games. Unjustified IMO.

I'd rather see Downie sit for a few games. Deserves to.

Because hes terrible defensively? You can paint your pro-Shannon argument however you want but the truth is he hasn't been good. Theres more than just putting up points which is why Teddy sat too.

I Am Beat You 11-06-2011 09:16 PM

Shannon doesn't deserve to carry Downie's jockstrap, and I'd prefer to see the latter back in the top 6. In my opinion he's more effective as a complementary forward with more skilled guys as opposed to being with the likes of Moore and Shannon. It seems like sometimes people forget how young Downie is and how much room for improvement he has. He hasn't looked as solid in the passing department as he did last year, but I think his puck possession and ability to win pucks along the wall is starting to return to where it was. Also, there is no chemistry on that 3rd line. Shannon has been crappy and I don't think Downie and Moore have ever had good chemistry (yes, I remember the playoffs). It's tough to fault anyone specifically when an entire line simply doesn't gel.

Jones has been underwhelming too. I was really looking forward to him making the team, but his play hasn't been at the level I expected it to be. I wouldn't mind seeing Tyrell get called up, and he and Pyatt could contend for the 12th forward spot if Jones doesn't pick it up soon.

Follower of Yzlam 11-06-2011 09:39 PM

Downie looked absolutely amazing tonight. Maybe Tyrell in for Shannon? Meh, I don't know... that's the only forward out of 12 that isn't working out, which isn't that bad when you get down to it.

Still All In 11-06-2011 10:01 PM

Tyrell isn't in Tampa.


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