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-   -   Hitting in Elitserien (merged) (http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=999115)

Hybbe 10-06-2011 03:55 PM

Hitting in Elitserien (merged)
 
... would be lynched if he lived in Canada.

http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportblade...cle13740957.ab

For non-swedes too lazy to use google translate: what he basically suggests in his conclusion is that hitting should be completely taken out of the game in order to avoid serious injuries.

Sometimes I have to be reminded about why I don't read aftonbladet, and Ros does the job quite well. :laugh:

KRM 10-06-2011 04:14 PM

So not only will I not open the article, but completely boycott the paper from now on.

Jonimaus 10-06-2011 04:35 PM

Doubt he really means that they should ban all hits from the game. I'm more thinking he means, this will always happen, and the only thing one could do to prevent it would be to ban all hits, not that it should be done.

Ribban 10-07-2011 12:45 AM

It seems like it might be a self correcting problem in a few years anyway.

Systemfel 10-07-2011 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ribban (Post 37569265)
It seems like it might be a self correcting problem in a few years anyway.

The exciting hits are basically gone already in the SEL. Now anytime there's a big hit, there's a big uproar and Aftonbladet's writers go nuts.

21 10-07-2011 08:01 AM

Ros is suffering from split personality.

Ros on his twitter account 6/10:
"Avery to SEL. Would be wonderful."

http://twitter.com/#!/Rosenrasande

His Beardliness 10-07-2011 09:41 AM

Stupid sensationalism.

And who was it that wrote fighting should be allowed and that everything would be a-okay then?

SurMartin 10-07-2011 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 21 (Post 37573187)
Ros is suffering from split personality.

Ros on his twitter account 6/10:
"Avery to SEL. Would be wonderful."

http://twitter.com/#!/Rosenrasande

:biglaugh:
I think most people stopped calling Ros a journalist a long time ago.

SthlmNYI 10-07-2011 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRM (Post 37534927)
So not only will I not open the article, but completely boycott the paper from now on.

Welcome aboard.

Ribban 10-08-2011 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Systemfel (Post 37572633)
The exciting hits are basically gone already in the SEL. Now anytime there's a big hit, there's a big uproar and Aftonbladet's writers go nuts.

If you say so (I no longer watch enough SEL to have an educated opinion). But, I believe the # of big hits in the NHL, for example, will decline drastically as well. I can't find the link to a TSN article that I read last season, or maybe offseason, discussing the trend of less "physical penalties," and whether it is a good or bad thing for hockey in general and the NHL in particular. The stats were nicely outlined and illustrated the trends well.

At any rate, as the game is getting faster, the "big" hits are tougher to execute, hence they might jeapordize one's own team, as it more or less means that a defender is now out of position whether he nails the other guy or not.

In Sweden, I honestly feel, that the examples of "scandalous" "molestations" & "assaults" on ice ( :sarcasm: ) we see in Swedish hockey today, should tell us that we are not as successful as we should be in teaching our young players to be prepared and absorb checks. Part of it is the larger ice surface, which let's you get away with less attention to head & body positioning, but in general, people are taught to hold on to the puck for too long (keeping possession), which makes them easier targets.

As I watched the NYR - LA game tonight (TiVO), the NBC clowns were discussing the MZA hit from behind and how it most likely will result in a couple of games suspension. They were saying that it wasn't a matter of how hard or soft the hit was, but rather the lack of respect shown by MZA when hitting a guy from behind, with no intent to seperate the opponent from the puck (the puck was nowhere near).

I can't say I disagree with their assessment of MZA's idiotic move (Mike Milbury argues the opposite, which really supports my idea of being on the right track). I mean, why would MZA be suspended only if the other guy gets hurt, but walk away without or with a lesser penalty if the check doesn't result in an injury? That's not "protecting" the players. That's simply utilizing an eye for an eye, or maybe a Crosby for a goon. In that case, scrap all suspensions and bring in the no-skills-goons to have bench clearing brawls all night, every night, to "settle the issues." This might entize Milbury and a handful of other rednecks, but I believe it would be terrible news for the business of hockey.

Checking might very well be more or less gone from all of hockey in just a few years because it yields no benefit then, much like big open ice hits are today just as rare as mid-range backhand shots.

Everlasting 10-09-2011 07:53 AM

They should make all players come togheter for a day and listen to people who suffer from cuncusions so they all know what the effects can be. Its one thing to read about it, and another the hear people who have suffered from it talk about it.
Maybe even do some activites that are related to this or something like that.. like a fieldtrip :D

Maybe that can change the perspective of some players. And offcourse, diciplinnämnden has to go and the punishments need to be more fearfull. Longer and more expensive.

Chraa 10-10-2011 10:59 AM

The Bertilsson hit
 
Found no thread about Simon Bertilssons hit on Jonas Berglund, so I'll start one. Aftonbladet reports that Bertilsson will be suspended for 4 games and get 3 additional games as a fine (will be able to play but won't get payed).

Thoughts about the hit and the suspension? Personally I think it's ridiculous that Bertilsson gets 7(!!!!) games for this hit. It's not blindside, it's not directly to the head and he keeps his elbow down. It is interference though. But otherwise than the interference part (which wouldn't be an issue if Berglund had touched the puck) it's a beauty of a hit.

Meanwhile Ölvestad, a repeat offender, gets 3 games for a flying elbow to the head.

Disciplinnämnden keeps on embarrassing themselves. It's clear that the media and their lynchmob mentality has influenced this decision.

The hits:

and Ölvestads:


Also Renberg crying like this is embarrassing. His Luleå bias couldn't be anymore obvious.

Hybbe 10-11-2011 10:24 AM

Bertilsson's hit really is borderline. It reminds me a bit of Kronwall's hit on Havlat except Berglund reaches for the puck and puts himself in a very vulnerable position. Seven games is ridiculous imo, but I suppose that Bertilsson could've let up a bit.

Ölvestad's hit looked pretty vicious. A very dangerous play.

I don't have any team affiliation, but I used to like Luleå when I was a kid and Renberg was one of my biggest hockey heroes, but even I can tell his bias from a mile away in this situation. :)

Systemfel 10-11-2011 10:30 AM

I don't think there's anything wrong with the hit itself, it's a great bodycheck, IMO. Berglund just doesn't have the puck and sort of forces his own head into Bertilsson's torso. Should have been one game at the most.

Also, when someone says, "Gotta keep your head up," that's not necessarily someone defending the hit in question, but rather just some safety advice for everyone. Keep your head up, pay attention, and you don't get hit in the ****ing head. The best open-ice hits ARE on players who aren't aware what's going on. I still think those are beautiful. I don't like what's happening in the NHL now, they're removing pretty much all responsibility from the player at the receiving end.

Ölvestad's hit was way more dangerous. He came flying from Luleå's goal to make the hit, and he clearly jumped.

Ribban 10-11-2011 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robin929 (Post 37674033)
They should make all players come togheter for a day and listen to people who suffer from cuncusions so they all know what the effects can be. Its one thing to read about it, and another the hear people who have suffered from it talk about it.
Maybe even do some activites that are related to this or something like that.. like a fieldtrip :D

Maybe that can change the perspective of some players. And offcourse, diciplinnämnden has to go and the punishments need to be more fearfull. Longer and more expensive.

... at least they need to do away with the comittee, handing out sanctions based on "feel" and "grey zone."

In their defense though, I think they get too much **** from everybody. If the leagues' management took their responsibility and put together clear documents outlining what infraction yield what sanction, decisions could be made much faster and with more consistency. Without such documents or with limited guidelines in such documents, the results will be thereafter. Nine times out of ten, it seems as if the Swedes see the NHL do something, and immediately they try to mimick it without having the necessary foundation in place, or even the understanding of how to execute the concept of what they're looking at overseas.

Failure to plan is a plan to fail.

DenmarkHockey29 10-11-2011 11:13 AM

In hockey you can:

Hit (yes)
hip check (yes)
make a clean hardt hit (yes)
make a hit where you hit the opponents head (NO!)

Ola 10-12-2011 03:19 AM

Michael Sundlöv lol

Petey21 10-13-2011 07:39 AM

Only in Sweden...

Would this result in a penalty. And I'm not talking about a diving call either... :laugh:

http://blogg.allehanda.se/therese/fi...de-svanen2.gif

His Beardliness 10-13-2011 11:02 AM

LOL was that Silfverberg?

What a joke penalty. The ref sees the whole thing. How the **** can he possibly blow anything but diving?

Petey21 10-13-2011 12:13 PM

Yes, that was Silfverberg. I hope for his own good that he won't ever try that whenever he makes it across the pond, as I have a feeling North Americans aren't too impressed by such drama. ;)

Tollefsen got 2 minutes for interference and Silfverberg got nothing, although a diving or misconduct would clearly be in order. And what's not seen in that sequence is that he also remained laying on the ice for quite a while, flapping around as if he had been ran over by a train.

Sif 10-18-2011 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Petey21 (Post 37846267)
Only in Sweden...

Would this result in a penalty. And I'm not talking about a diving call either... :laugh:

http://blogg.allehanda.se/therese/fi...de-svanen2.gif

And only in Sweden would Madsen's check to the head result in nothing. Guess they try to even things out.

Everlasting 10-18-2011 11:05 AM

Almost everyone or everyone who is responsible for diciplinnämnden and domarkåren should be fired and replaced. Sounds a little harsh but their system doesnt work at all and only makes SEL less attractive.

Its the only way.

Harks 10-18-2011 02:16 PM

I think the problem here is there is no consecvences if you hit someone.
Yes you get some games off but if you change the fighting-rule to 5 min major and you know you gonna get hurt you'll think twice when getting an oppertunity. This could be a messure to get some small restraints on this matter.

Sure some of these hits are accidents but I wouldn't like to fend of a guy like Tollefsen if he had the green light.
You nowa'days never see someone jumping the checker after a faul hit like before.
Then you get suspended as long as the one who makes the hit which doesn't make any sense.

^
|
|
http://galusaustralis.com/wp-content.../chewbacca.jpg


Personally I'm all for keeping your head up but you have to show respect for your apponents in some situations.

Everlasting 10-18-2011 03:09 PM

Your thoughts are all good but youre missing a BIG problem.

The people who are in charge of these stuff will never do something like that. You see, they will just continue this cirkus like they have always done. They are conservative and moral rtards who rather doing some that will fix that they wont do anything.

Fighting will never be approved in the league as long as they are in charge.
There will never be any real and fair consequences.
Players will continue to getting unfair suspensions.
The league is going in a "hits = bad" direction.
SEL is becoming less attractive.

The system doesnt work and need to be replaced. And the current gen who is in controll are doing nothing to sort this out. And they wont either. Lets get real. They should all get fired.

Another problem is the evolutaionary attitude that so many people have. Yeah, it might have worked to shape our society but it took hundres of freaking years. Revolutionary is the way to go here.

Systemfel 11-10-2011 03:05 PM

Hockey hits is the subject on tonights "Debatt" (Swedish debate TV show about issues in society)...


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