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06-21-2004, 09:45 AM
Join Date: Oct 2002
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Originally Posted by Edge
While i disagree {and can give contradictory facts to what NYIsles1 is saying} I do agree that the league salaries are out of whack. It's not signing the stars that hurts, it's having to pay 21 year olds a million dollars at the NHL level and keeping your average talent for a million dollars that hurts.
Actually, it's both. And it depends what an owners opinion of a star is. Bobby Holik
Alexei Yashin ect, granted that market thinking created some of the problems now because it set a payroll market.

Edge, it is a fact the Flyers owners said they are losing money. Detroit always claim they have to make the finals to break even and enough newspaper reports here claim the garden is losing money on it's sports teams and are making programming cuts and laying off employees. Msg even cut out most Liberty basketball telecasts.

And the fallout from the Jets war is only beginning. Jet's Journal was pulled from Msg.

San Jose cut it's payroll drastically made the semi-finals and claim to lose ten million dollars. The Kings accountant-fan was allowed to investigage their book by the club because he did not believe the numbers and after an audit agreed a team in the new Staples Center was losing 20-30 million a year. Chicago/Boston are limited in what they can spend because they have priced out their fans like most markets.

Originally Posted by Edge
The biggest problem with the league is owners who don't have a clue. Dolan will throw money at whatever is out there if he wants, because all he knows is what someone who {understandably} is going to tell him.
The biggest problems is owners losing money who continue to overspend with very high payrolls and drive up the market because they cannot control themselves and what every advantage they can get, which is why that option has to be taken away from them. No luxury tax, no flexible cap, a floor as well as a ceiling when it comes to salaries, prospects with no cash allowed in trades to be exchanged and a reduction in ticket prices for the fans.

In a sport doing horrible vs sports already with caps the strictest standards need to be in place. Dolan loses money and continues to make those no-brainers deals like Jagr, Bure, Kovalev. Wang lost 23 million a year ago and added Ronning after dumping Wiemer and has raises to give where he must break up his team and he is hardly alone.

Originally Posted by Edge
Take nothing away, but expanding into Columbus and Nashville and Atlanta was a bad idea when you know your league is in trouble and THAT is going to be a big argument from the players standpoint.
I will give you the Atlanta market because they simply seem indifferent to sports.

Why they cannot sellout baseball playoff games says a lot. However someone twice decided Atlanta was a good enough NHL market, let's see them in a playoff and see how that market responds. We saw Carolina fade after going to the finals so it's fair to say that market may well be a mistake.

Columbus and Nashville look like excellent expansion markets. The Jackets draw SRO for monday night preason games and it seems the only teams they beat every year are the Islanders and Rangers. Meanwhile what do those 5pm Sunday pre-season Ranger games do at Msg? About 5,000 fans while every sports fan in the market is watching football or key baseball games?

What's a bad idea is when these new markets are priced out of name players because other markets overspend on top of losing revenue because they cannot control themselves. Those markets need some of the few name players. Again, Columbus has been a very successful expansion story and they have never even competed for a playoff spot. Minnesota speaks for itself.

Originally Posted by Edge
Bottom line is hockey as a whole {owners and players} have shot themselves in the foot.

Stupidity on both sides have ruined chance after chance to take hockey to the next level.
If your going to tell me about ten years ago (I disagree) and that a three month strike was hockey best chance it's fair to say they never had chance because it did not take much. ABC/FOX spent years showing New York on their infrequent telecasts, it failed with horrible ratings as the best teams were ignored and the fans never warmed up or learned about the next generation of star players. Espn has had enough of showcasing hockey and has better programming. A few weeks on NBC will change nothing.

Hockey had some great semi-finals this year that should have taken the sport to the next level. Philadelphia (a big hockey market) did not produce great ratings vs Tampa Bay desite an excellent series. The finals proved in canada it did not matter whether it was Tampa or New York in the finals, the ratings were the same with their fans.

Originally Posted by Edge
Refs who dont call penalties, league officials who can't stop expanding, players who don't realize just how tight a profit margin hockey works on and finally a league marketing department who can't figure out what to do with their product because they were only hired as part of the good ol' boy network. Hockey has lacked something the other sports have, it's lack creative minds to drive the product. Too many people in the hockey business are too bland to create enough interest
Why should any player not ask for what he is worth? The players did not create this market and these owners should have been more responcible, they kept adding big contracts and raising prices and now were at a point where it's impossible to raise either. The refs are the same old story. I cannot answer for the league's marketing what I can say is this is a baseball market year round in New York and their news is more important with the public and seven million people will attend baseball.

The league seems ready to not even send either New York team to the West Coast any longer.

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