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09-24-2004, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by PhillyNucksFan
what are you talking about? i dont think i refered to Carolina/Fedorov "incident"
Exactly. You completely ignored it. But when the topic is "Who ruined the NHL", don't you think it should at least be mentioned?

Dont change topic as I was saying, like the article suggested, the very first deal that breaks out this outrageous signings of huge contracts. Leave alone on WHY Kariya wants to demand Sakic Money.. Your point here is hardly related to what the article is suggesting. The article is merely suggesting that what Rangers did jump started all these huge signings, and it used kariya as one of the examples to demonstrate how and the aftermath.
Yes, Kariya used the Sakic-offer to demand more money.
But my point was that Sakic - back in 97 - was worth a lot more than a very young Paul Kariya. Disney could have said "Bring us a Stanley Cup like Sakic did and then we can talk about 7 mil".
So, the Rangers might be the initiator but don't you think Disney made some faults, too?

56???? Was that last year??? Why do you look at last year's salary and not the season he has had before he signed??
I believe 01-02 was his last season with the devils and he had a very good year of 25/29 of 54 points and +/- 7... Please correct me if I am wrong, you believe that this player, for what he does, is worth $8+ M/year!?!?!?!!?!? Please, I have had read a lot of debates before here on whether Holik is worth 8M, and quite frankly, the general response was.. "Holy ****, rangers wayyyy overpaid this guy".

Good luck making an argument on Holik is worth $8M/year!
Show me where I said he is worth 8 mil... I never said that.
I don't know why I shoud refer to past (Devils) stats, but anyway: 56 or 54 does not really matter.
Again, you missed my point. You said he is a defensive forward, and that is simply not true. A defensive forward makes less than 54 or 56 points. A defensive forward is not a leading scorer even on a bad team like the Rangers last year.

NJ and T.O wanted to pay him 8M??? If NJ offers the same contract, why didnt Holik take it to stay? Please, Dont tell me because Rangers play exciting hockey and NJ is dull. (they are though). NJ obviously offered less at the time. I am not sure if you are familiar with the negotiation management. Rangers drove up his value by putting out rumours of signing him at 8M and that was one of the reasons why others would even consider offering 8M.. if Rangers offered him at say, 5M, do you honestly believe T.O or NJ would offer him 8M still!?!?
There a thousands of articles around the net to proof that both NJ and TO offered about 8 mil for Holik. I'm too lazy to search you a link. If you don't believe me, go search for yourself.
Holik decided not to stay in NJ because the Rangers finally offered some extra one or twohundret thousands. I'm not Holik, I don't know but there may have been other reasons as well.
Point here is, while 8 mil is vastly overpaying even for a great 2-way second line center with grit like Holik (and I never denied that), it was his asking price on the FA market.
Or do you believe the Rangers are paying him 8 mil for pleasure if they could have had him for 5?

You should love it, because it IS the rangers who started all these signing franzy. Now, I am not saying Rangers is the only team at fault here, but they DID set the bar there on numerous markets of the players. Do I want them off the NHL? No, because they are one of the original 6, and NY after all is a huge market. Then are you asking me for the solutions? well, there are at least 100 other experts working out on the CBA right now, if I do know the answer, I wouldnt be here answering your comments.
What's with Fedorov? What's with Gratton?
"Now, I am not saying Rangers is the only team at fault here". But to me, that's what it sounds like.
Yes, the Rangers did some "shocking" things within the rules of the CBA - but they're not the only team. And this article just focuses on the Rangers and on no one else...

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