View Single Post
11-27-2009, 10:41 PM
Canadiens Fan
Registered User
Canadiens Fan's Avatar
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 737
vCash: 500
Came across this little nuggest about Howe and Mortson.

Globe and Mail, October 29th, 1951

The crowd of 13,611 saw the great winger, Howe, at his dazzling best on the second goal early in the second period. Coming out on the run from the bench, he picked up the puck inside the blue-line, rounded Gus Mortson and stick handled the puck around Rollins and into the cage.

Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post

Ebbie Goodfellow-Doug Wilson vs. Zdeno Chara-Cling Johnson

I didn't think I'd get to say this, but I will take great pleasure in doing so: I have the best #1 in this series. And by quite a margin too, I think.

As far as Chara and Goodfellow comparison; Chara's Hart record (Goodfellow's 1,3,4 is likely better than anything Chara's got) is likely not near as good. Goodfellow came in an easier era to win the Hart, but still. Goodfellow didn't win that many AST's, but that likely comes from spending the start of his career as a highscoring centre.
You're defensive comparision almost entirely relies on offensive statistics. Of course, that is merely one aspect of being a blueliner. Let's look at the first pairings in totality, and not just one aspect.

All-Star selections

Zdeno Chara - First Team 2 times, Second Team 2 times
Ching Johnson - First Team 2 times, Second Team 2 times
Ebbie Goodfellow - First Team 2 times, Second Team 1 time
Doug Wilson - First Team 1 time, Second Team 2 times

Chara-Johnson = 8 all-star nominations
Goodfellow-Wilson = 6 all-star nominations

Hart Trophy Voting

Chara - 2004 (25th place), 2006 (19th place), 2008 (14th place), 2009 (8th place)
Johnson - 1928 (5th place), 1932 (2nd place)
Goodfellow - 1937 (3rd place), 1940 (1st place)
Wilson - 1982 (9th place)

Chara-Johnson = 6 Hart Trophy placements
Goodfellow-Wilson - 3 Hart Trophy placements

Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Goodfellow was a hard-nosed guy who was also know as a "big defensive star".
Can you please prove this ?? I just went through the entire Globe and Mail archive as well as my books and you're write up and was unable to find much on Goodfellow's defensive attributes.

Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
I think he can go up against Chara in intangibles as well; and particularly with playoff records, Goodfellow as an edge.
From a scoring perspective, a small edge, not as much as you claim.

Goodfellow regular season points per game average = .58
Goodfellow playoff points per game average = .36

Chara regular season points per game average = .42
Chara playoff points per game average = .32


Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
I will give the edge in to Johnson in the intangible department. Speed and suitability to play opposing offences goes to Wilson; Johnson being described as "slow footed" likely doesn't have the speed to keep up with my top line and play the game he wants.
I would argue that suitablity to play opposing offenses is in the favour of Ching Johnson, not Wilson.

Globe and Mail, April 5th, 1937

Complete value for their 4 to 0 win. Rangers beat Maroons from net to net all the way. Their speed was dazzling, their craft devastating, and the jolts, hooks, and "holds" handed out by their Ching Johnson-led defense utterly demoralizing to the frantic Maroon front lines.
Globe and Mail, April 9th, 1937

A moment later Ching Johnson stopped Bruneteau's drive ... Ching Johnson carried the puck the length of the ice ... Ching Johnson got in to stop Mackie's drive from right wing on a rush with Wally Kilrea.

All teams ... get away with as much interference as possible and, naturally, some of them are more proficent than others. Occasionally erring players are penalized and games are lost during their absence but even under these conditions it has been profitable to adhere to the nuisance. We think that the Ranger defensemen have always been past masters in this art, with good natured Ching Johnson as the ace performer.

Most of this interference occurs near the boards, preferably at the end of the ice surface, and is overlooked ninety percent of the time - at least by the officials. Defensemen will hold or shove attackers into the boards, knowing that as a general rule, the worst they can get out of it is a face-off in their own zone. We remember one night in Madison Square Garden when Johnson held the late Howie Morenz helpless against the side of the rink. The whistle roared to signify a penalty but in that fraction of a second Morenz hit his big tormentor on the top of his nearly bald head. Ching was chased as well as hurt, but he thought that was all right when Morenz received a major. We mention this incident as only one of the many numerous ones in the career of Ching Johnson.
In this example, Johnson seem's to have little trouble holding the great Howie Morenz, in addition to frustrating him out of his game. He figures to do the same in this series.

Globe and Mail, April 14th, 1937

Ching Johnson got the puck off Barry's stick after the Detroit centre had stickhandled his way in front of the net.
A clear example of Johnson's defensive skill beyond his physical attributes.


Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Considering ther other First team AST in Johnson's years was Shore, he likely would not have ever won a norris.
That would be an incorrect assumption.

All-Star Team Voting for 1931-32

Source: Wednesday, March 2, 1932; Globe & Mail, page 12

The newspaper listed the all-stars of each writer over the course of several weeks. I'm not going to go through and add all of that up myself. They do provide some aggregated data, though. There were 32 writers in total.

No players earned a unanimous spot on the all-star team. Ching Johnson (1st team Defense) earned the most votes; he was chosen by "all but two" writers and "22 times on the first team" (therefore he must have received 22 first-place votes and 8 second-place votes). Eddie Shore (1st team D) and Bill Cook (1st team RW) were selected by 29 writers; Charlie Conacher (2nd team RW) was listed on 27 ballots, Chuck Gardiner (1st team G) on 26 and Busher Jackson (1st team LW) on 18.
If they had the Norris Trophy in 1932 Ching Johnson would have been the winner.


I also found this little tidbit about Ching Johnson and Eddie Shore.

Globe and Mail, November 13th, 1929

There is much joy around Madison Square Garden today. Ching Johnson, the great Ranger defenseman, has signed a contract and will chase the puck again while his supporters cheer and his enemies jeer ... There is not a better natured hockeyist in existence than the amaible Ching but he has an unusual way of checking which confounds his critics and upsets his opponents. "Elbows" Harry Broadbent never had anything on Johnson the latter being most playful in the art of using his arms to ward off attackers. But "it's all fun" as far as Johnson is concerned and even opposing players are among his most loyal admirers. Johnson can take the bumps as well as deliver them, and he stepped into many terrific jolts, most of them engineered by the Bruins at Boston, where they would willingly play $10,000 to keep Johnson out of hockey. The latter invariably has selected Eddie Shore as his body-checking victim, and the moans and groans of disapproval in the Hub have been something out of the ordinary. Shore is a great player. He is colorful. In Boston he is an idol and he knows how to play to the gallery. His specialty is falling to the ice, as if in tremendous pain. So Johnson, an obliging sort of player, has helped along the hero act by upsetting Shore at every opportunity. May the good work continue.
If Ching Johnson was this much of a pain to the great Eddie Shore I can only imagine the effect he will have on the opposition alongside Zdeno Chara.


More about Ching Johnson.

Globe and Mail, February 24th, 1932

During the regular periods the Bruins outplayed their rivals by an impressive margin but Ching Johnson's spectacular defense work kept the Bostonians in check. Johnson also bore the brunt of the Rangers attack up to the overtime.
Globe and Mail, March 23rd, 1935

Canadiens, the mystery team of the playoff series, and Rangers, in and outers present an intriguing problem. Nobody knows what either would do, but the fact is admitted that hard-bitten veterans like the Cook brothers, Frank Boucher, and Ching Johnson go places when the money looms enticingly just ahead.
Globe and Mail, March 16th, 1937

Johnson, colorful defenseman who lured thousands of hockey patrons into Madison Square Garden to see him bowel over the enemy.

Last edited by Canadiens Fan; 11-27-2009 at 10:47 PM..
Canadiens Fan is offline   Reply With Quote