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12-01-2009, 09:53 PM
  #88
Leafs Forever
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Ken Randall-Albert Leduc vs Charlie Huddy-Brad Maxwell

I guess I'll start off with no.5's.

Albert Leduc vs Charlie Huddy

Well since stats are apparently nothing, I'll show using using quotes, game account of Leduc, and then stats (for those of us who appreciate them) to show why Leduc is better.

Here's the quote from Joe Pelletier that pretty much describes how Huddy played:

Quote:
Huddy was one of those players who was solid at every aspect of the game, but not great at any of them. His hockey sense was his most outstanding skill. Defensively he was able to read the oncoming rush very well, often forcing the puck carrier to stay on the perimeter of the ice. His anticipation helped him offensively too. He was very smart about pinching in from the point, as well as joining rushes as a trailer.

Although he had good size, Charlie was not a physical player really. He held his own in the corners or in front of his own goalie, but often was paired with a more physical partner, such as Jeff Beukeboom. A willing shot block, Charlie relied on his strong skating game and brainy approach more than brawn.
So, good offensively (despite not finishing top-10 in defenceman scoring once if I am not mistaken, on the greatest offensive dynasty ever getting top-unit PP time on it..he was a bit more of a defensive consience on that unit, but still), good defensively, not the toughest or most physical guy.

Leduc?

Quote:
When he took his first strides on Forum ice, he did so with big skates to fill. Replacing Sprague Cleghorn on the Habs’ blue-line was no easy task, but the Valleyfield, QC native quickly cemented his role as a pillar of the team’s defense corps.

As physically punishing and imposing as his predecessor, this hard-hitting defenceman was equally renowned for his ability to lead the rush, propelling him to a career high 10 goals in his rookie campaign in 1925-26-canadiens.com.
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He was a clever goal scorer who often played rough when protecting his own end-LOH.
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As adept with the puck as he was at retrieving it..-canadiens.com
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He spent eight years with Montreal delivering solid hits and making life difficult for opposing forwards-LOH
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Always moving at top speed, his devastating body checks made him a fan favorite at the Forum. Cracking the NHL’s top 10 most penalized players list on three occasions, the robust rearguard fittingly earned himself the nickname “Battleship”.
The game accounts...

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A penalty to S.Mantha early in the third period found Leduc in the hero role keeping out four-man Detroit rushes-Globe and Mail
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Morenz, Leduc, Sylvio Mantha, Smith, Gorsvenor and Lamb took turns thrilling the onlookers with masterful all-around work.- Globe and Mail
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Joseph Albert Leduc, otherwise known as "Battleship" Leduc, is one of the most colorful figures in hockey. Besides being sturdy and effective defenseman, "Albair" is a scoring threat of considerate ability, and his stenming rush down the ice is sometimes the "piece de resistance" of an otherwise dull game. His legs working like pistons, Albert dashes down uweveres at no defrense. The outer guard combination that Albert has backed up before has not yet been developed, and he dives headlong into opposition when he reaches it. Most of the the time he barges through, and when he does he is deft with a shot or pass.- Globe and Mail
Quote:
One day overdue, but apparently in good shape, Albert "Battleship" Leduc, former defense ace of the Montreal Canadiens, turned out for the first time last night with the Ottawa Senators. Leduc teamed up on defence in the practice session with Harvey Rockburn, Scotty Bowman and Harry Radley, in turn, and was going in fine style. He blocked well, and his attacking plays were good.
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In the last period, "Hooley" Smith of the Maroons lost his temper, and took a swing with his stick at the silvering hari of "Pit" Lepine. He missed, and Leduc, husky Canadiens defenceman, sailed into "Hooley". A major penalty was awarded to Smith, and Leduc drew a minor. After the game was over, both jumped out of the penalty box and staged a hectic one-round fist fight at centre ice while 11,00 fans looked on and cheered.-Globe and Mail
So, what I can gather that; Leduc was great offensively, pretty good defensively an all-aroud, and great toughness. Seems to beat Huddy. But here's those stats for those that do care about them;

Defencemen Goals- 2nd(1926), 6th(1928), 3rd(1929), 3rd(1931), 9th(1932), 9th(1933)
Defencemen Assists- 9th(1926), 9th(1928), 9th(1930), 10th(1931)
Defencemen Points- 2nd (1926), 9th(1928), 5th(1929), 9th(1930), 4th(1931)

Playoff Defencemen Goals- 2nd(1928)*, 1st(1929)*, 3rd(1930)*, 6th(1932)*
Playoff Defencemen Assists- 1st(1930), 3rd(1931), 4th(1932)*
Playoff Defencemen Points- 4th(1928)*, 3rd(1929)*, 1st(1930), 6th(1931), 6th(1932)

Platoff Assists- 3rd(1930)
Playoff Points- 6th(1930)

*All placings marked with asterisk are standings that occured due to Leduc scoring 1 goal, assist, or point. Most of his placements were accomplished with lower scoring numbers. This is mainly a result of the era he played in, and due to many defencemen not scoring any points at all in the playoffs. between 1928-1933, Leduc tied for 2nd in defencemen playoff goals, 2nd in defencemen playoff assists, and 1st for defencemen playoff points, so he was indeed one of the best offensive playoff defencemen of his day, whether or not you care for scoring placements accomplished with small numbers.

Yes yes, I get that Huddy gets the era advantage. Don't think is translates to him being better than Leduc, perhaps the best playoff defenceman offensively in his day, who also has the quotes to back it up. Edge to Leduc.

Ken Randall vs Brad Maxwell

Another one of those interesting tidbits:

Quote:
He possessed and extremely hard and accurate shot from the point and was an excellent puck carrier - though he lacked the speed to dominate at the NHL level-Joe Pelletier
A speed problem, perhaps- not good. Although he likely doesn't have to face my deadly top line, I've got plenty speed on my other lines; Harris, Fleury, Wharram, Stewart, Martin can take advantage of slow skaters. Particularly Wharram and Stewart, who were also two of the best skaters of their day.

But anyway- onto the full comparison.

For those of you who care about stats, Maxwell finished top-15 in points amongst defenceman twice in his career- once in his first season (13th), described here by LOH:

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During the 1977-78 season, Maxwell notched 47 points but struggled defensively along with the rest of his team
and once 5th, but as Joe Pelletier notes:

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Only one season, 1983-84, did he put up great numbers when he scored 19 goals and 73 points
It was a one-hit wonder offensively for him in the regular season.

Now he has a number of good playoffs, I will concede. Described as tough as nails and good two-way ability (although if he has any speed problems, he'll still get burned), but as good in those regards to Randall, one of the toughest of his day?

I present to you, the complete package that is Ken Randall.

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He was known in that era as being one of the toughest players on the ice, and in fact many writers took to calling him a "hooligan" or "thug" for what was often perceived as dirty play by fans and opposing players.-HHOF
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Ken Randall was one of the original tough guys. Coined a "Hooligan" and a "Thug", Ken was not afraid of throwing his weight around with opponents or the NHL brass.

Among the more rugged and aggressive players who liked to combine a fair amount of jousting with their play with resultant penalties, Ken Randall stands forth as a good example.

He was an even more chunky player than Pitre and it was remarkable the way he could hustle as a forward.

A good slam bang player who gave his best at hockey and as a fighter, Ken Randall was on four championship teams and two Cup winners. -SIHR
Quote:
Among the most rough and uncut characters to grace the page of hockey history was Ken Randall.

Randall was a chunky barrell-chester pug, prone to weight fluctuation. But for a big man, he could hustle. He handled the puck well and had a good shot.

Randall was a colorful slam-bang hockeyist, the kind of bulldog every coach wants in the dressing room. Although he was not enrishned in the Hockey Hall of Fame, he was nonetheless one of the top hockey players in the new NHL.-Ultimate Hockey
Well, there is his great toughness which likely outmatches that of Maxwell by quite a margin. Also suggests some offensive game as well, and that he was one of the best of his time in the NHL. Onto those game accounts I worked tirelessly to aquire. These will focus more-so on the other parts of his game since toughness is well covered:

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"Ken" Randall played the beat game he has ever shown on local ice and his rushes were of sensational variety.-Globe and Mail
Quote:
Mummery and Randall gave a grand display, and their blocking and rushing was well nigh perfect. The latter had settle down to buisness in earnest, and if anybody stood out last night it was Randall. He completely bewildered the visitors by his sensational rushing and seemed to be able to outguess the defence with ridiculous ease.-Globe and Mail
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Nighbor and Darragh had chances but were stopped up by Mummery and Randall-Globe and mail
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Randall and Noble again bore the brunt of the work for the blueshirts. The former notched three goals after clever end-to-end dashes.-Globe and Mail
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Prodgers, Matte, and Randall played a defence game, and the locals (Ottawa) could not get through-Globe and Mail
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Two players stood out for the wearers of green and white, these being Randall and Noble. The former checked well and was very effective on the attack. His rushes generally led to a shot on goal.-Gloe and Mail
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Ottawa did their checking on their own side of centre ice, and against the five-man defence only Randall could make any headway.-Globe and mail
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The Senators frequently got by the local defence, but came to grief when they encountered the Matte-Randall defense-Globe and Mail
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Randall made good with a vengance at the rover position. He used his sturdy body to good effect in stopping McKay, Adams, and Skinner, and none of the visitors wasted any time in trying to intimidate him. As a puck carrier, Randall was as good as any other player on the ice and in the first thirty minutes he was the only local player who could make any headway. - Globe and Mail
Quote:
On the defense, he and "Red" Stuart held the Ottawa Attackers at bay with unexpected skill, and on the attack, Randall bored right in on the net in telling fashion. Severeal times he beat the Gerard-Boucher-Clancy second line [To explain, another quote: "Eddie Gerard and George Boucher had a bad night on defense, and when "King" Clancy was inserted the second line was still shaky"] with ridiculous ease. -Globe and Mail
Quote:
Randall played the entire sixty minutes, and his rushing was one of the bright features. -Globe and Mail
Quote:
With Langlois and Randall giving him air-tight protection, the local sharpshooters drilled the puck from all angles at all distances..-Globe and Mail
Unlike Maxwell, looks like Randall could dominate at an NHL level. All these quotes are from Randall as a defenceman.

Toughest guy of his day? Seemed tougher than Maxwell. A defensive record that uncludes shutting down the likes of Nighbor, Darragh and the other Senators? Maxwell is described as a good two-way better, but I think these show Randall better defensively. Offensively? Randall seems to be described as dominant rusher in that regard (getting past guys like Gerard and Clancy with "ridiculous ease"). Randall is hard to determine exactly how much he spent on forward and defense in each season; although from my readings, he seemed to spend almost all time on defense in his early days (and if he is counted as a defenceman in his first year for example, he places 5th amongst NHL defenceman.) He, as his bio indicates, has a pretty good offensive record, and I think he can compete with if not best Maxwell in that regard all things considered. All thigns considered, edge Randall.


Last edited by Leafs Forever: 12-01-2009 at 10:01 PM.
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