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12-08-2009, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Reds4Life View Post
2 Selke trophies and 4 Lady Byng trophies = clean and great defensive player. PPG player in the NHL. His resume is pretty solid.
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
I don't think it's a stretch to claim Datsyuk is better defensively. He has two Selke trophies, matched only by Sergei Fedorov among scoring centres while I do not see much on Maltsev's defensive play.
Yeah, you guys are right, you are just misunderstanding me. Datsyuk is a pretty good ATD defensive forward already; he's just not in the elite category. He and Maltsev are very different players and comparing them in this way doesn't really work. It was a silly time to bring it up, but I'm just making the point that a player can't just "have" the attributes and BOOM, he has the same attributes in the ATD; a track record of using them and having success with them is still important. For example, 5 years ago J-Bo was very young and inexperienced but someone could have drafted him and said "he's the fastest defenseman in the draft" and maybe he is faster than Fedorov ever was, but I'll take Fedorov's "track record" of demonstrated speed any day. 15 years of offensive production is better than 5 when discussing ATD players, and I think 15 years of speed, toughness, or defensive ability should be better than 5 of the same as well, you shouldn't just be able to snap your fingers and say they "have it".

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Two Selkes are nice, and put Datsyuk in Brindamour territory. It's why I would love to have him on a third line if he'd drop that far.

As for his offensive record, he has two great seasons and two very good seasons. Third place in Hart voting once. I think it's an easy comparison to Markus Naslund, who had a 4 year peak himself. In terms of offense, Markus Naslund had the better peak (and therefore career) by a pretty clear margin. And I honestly don't think Datsyuk performed any better in the playoffs as an individual than Markus, but that's a can of worms I probably don't want to get into.

Even given Datsyuk's defensive edge, I'd probably place Markus Naslund higher than him on an all-time list. By the end of his career Datsyuk should be higher, but I'm pretty sure that's meaningless to the ATD, which is about "did," not "probably will."
You are right.

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