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12-09-2009, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted by shadow1 View Post
Ever heard of David Jones?

Saying Koivu has played with nobodies is an exaggeration. Every year Minnesota at least has four pretty decent wingers that Koivu has played with. Examples: Brunette, Havlat, Gaborik, Rolston, Nolan, Bouchard, Miettinen, Sykora.

This one is certainly debatable. We can't look at +/- because the quality of each team is different, and the average PK time for each player is shockingly identical (2:08 for Stastny, 2:05 Koivu).

Mikko does have a big edge in face-off winning % (56.5% vs. 48.2%), but Paul has taken more faceoffs: 714 vs. 542 (he leads the league). Blocked shots and takeaways are identical.

So, I guess you're right in saying Koivu isn't inferior defensively. But I'll still take Stastny for his offense.
This is the post of someone who only looks at stats and doesnt watch the games. Brunette has declined greatly in the past few years and his numbers this year and last year can almost directly be attributed to Koivu. He is super slow, terrible defensively and turns the puck over constantly. He is terrific at finishing the passes that Mikko gives to him right in front of the net however, which most of Mikkos's wingers over his career have been terrible at. Havlat has been on the team for a quarter of the season and he has been injured for half of that time, same with Sykora. Gaborik and Koivu almost never played together as Demitra and Gaborik were paired for chemistry, but in the short amount of time that they were on the same line last year, Gaborik was over a Goal per game.
Rolsten and Bouchard played together and never with Koivu either. The only player you stated that has actually been on Koivu's line is Miettinen and everyone considered him to be a 3rd liner when we signed him. Again I hate making the linemate argument but its quite clear that the only time Koivu played with a legitimate first liner (Gaborik), there was some offensive magic.

As for the defensive aspect of the game, I can almost guarantee if you ask any player on the Avalanche/any player in the NW, who is better defensively, they would say Koivu. There is much more to defense than FO's and Takeaways.

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