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05-12-2010, 11:29 PM
DIEHARD the King fan
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: blueline to slot
Originally Posted by
Yeah, but the difference is, we have quotes. We actually have DL telling us that it isn't going to happen and that he doesn't want to play here. Obviously you are throwing him under the bus, therefore you wouldn't believe him, but you have nothing on your side. Other than your own conjecture and conspiracy theories based on numbers that can fall either way without evidence. I am going to trust the guy who was actually in the conversation and knows what he is talking about.
As for Teubert, I probably wouldn't select him with the pick, but at the time I was yelling at my screen for us to pick Myers... Either way though, I have to be rational enough to wait until the full value of the asset is assessed before I pass judgment. Obviously the chances are stacked against Teubert on ever getting his name in the HHOF, but we still have no clue where the guy ends up. I can't say that Myers would have had the season he did on the Kings being the third guy beneath Doughty and Johnson.
At this very moment, you are right, we received poor compensation for Cammy, though there are pretty simple reasons for that. Other teams knew the problems we were having with him and his intentions, and he wasn't worth as much as he had been the year before or now. He wasn't established, never proved consistent, and was coming off a low point as well as proving to be injury prone.
Well, he obviously isn't losing now. He is playing in a Canadian atmosphere like he wanted and getting his money, but that doesn't change the fact that he couldn't get his way in LA and instead of getting his demands met, he ended up with a fair value contract instead.
I love how you say all this stuff in hypothetical context, but then say that Dean never made a reasonable offer, as if we know. Obviously he wasn't offered his $5-6 million, but that doesn't prove that we didn't offer a reasonable contract below it. Cammy had to reject a contract offer to get where he did. Either way, he has arguably proven himself worthy of his price tag now, but he was no where near it at the time. The season he put up this year is quite close to the season he put up the year he was traded.
OK, I stayed out for a while, but some points NEED to be made:
1) Its never been confirmed by ANYONE that Cammy would not have signed here had the money been right. The fact remains that he spends lots of off-season time here and has NOT SOLD HIS HOUSE in Manhattan Beach. He likes Los Angeles.
2) DL does not like Cammy as a person. I heard it from his own mouth. Find it in the other threads where I've mentioned it. People, even those in business dont say things like that just because it business. There were real reasons why I named DL a shill a while back. His public vs. his private comments about Cammy being one of the main reasons.
3) DL did not believe Cammy was worth anywhere near the money he was asking. DL knew that the 6MM demand was posturing, and an initial demand based on Cammy, acting as his team's NHLPA rep, trying to bring up, league wide, player salaries by tying his demand to Vaneks offer sheet. Thats from DL himself, no speculation, no guessing. That is what DL knew. He was not going to even negotiate. He knew, before the 2008 draft that he was going to jettison Cammy, and extracted vows of silence from those of us in attendance at those (private STH) meetings when he told us.
4) Keeping Cammy would not have handcuffed the Kings anymore than Ryan Smyth's contract currently does and maybe less, because Cammy would have signed for less. Simply put, every negotiator knows that you always ask for far more than you are willing to accept, so you can compromise and still get what you really want. The fact that he got 6MM from Montreal is based far more on his SUBSEQUENT almost 40 goal and almost ppg season with Calgary than his speculated steadfastness at taking nothing less than 6MM from the Kings.
5) Sure Cammy can say, AFTER PLAYING in Calgary and/or Montreal that he, as a result of playing there, realized that he has always wanted to do that, but if DL had negotiated in good faith, IF HE HAD WANTED CAMMY (which he didnt) and Cammy had signed a 4-5year contract at 4.5-5MM per year, Cammy wouldn't have had that experience (of playing in a Canadian City) to shape his "realizations." There is nothing, fact or quote-wise, from when Cammy was here that said he wanted to be somewhere else. In an interview quoted in aother thread from a time pre-dating my membership, Cammy said he wanted to be here and was looking forward to seeing what the team would do. he was asked point blank if he saw himself as a member of the team next year and he said he did. As many of you are fond of saying, hindsight is 20/20. When you talk about Cammy not wanting to be here, you place the cart before the horse. DL DIDNT WANT HIM HERE, so how can you possibly blame that on Cammy.
6) Scoring (sniper-like) goals is something you cant teach, and some people have a knack for it and others dont. Cammy has that knack, a quick release and accurate placement. He finds seams and for a player his size, he plays a lot bigger.
The facts are that DL decided he didnt want him here and basically let him know that by his actions in contracts "negotiations" if they could be called that. To blame a player and say he didnt want to stay here when the GM basically says and acts like he is a POS is at best biased and at worst dishonest and deceptive.
There is no doubt Cammy can play, and I am well beyond him no longer being a King. I am truly happy for him that he is finding the success he didnt have, teamwise, here.
What I can't fathom is why some of you still think he is not the player the rest of the league and every hockey sports talk show acknowledges that he really is. If you treat a guy like crap, because you dont value him, and then don't negotiate in good faith, who's fault is it if he doesn't stay, even if he had wanted to? (this hometown discount crap is just that--Did Kopitar take one?)
Try treating your wife/GF like crap for a while and see what happens!
Last edited by DIEHARD the King fan: 05-12-2010 at
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