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08-20-2010, 10:48 PM
Big Phil
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Originally Posted by C For Choke View Post
.... and players who didn't get enough.

Who are some great examples? I think two examples right off the bat for players who get too much credit for the success of others are Mario Lemieux and Jarome Iginla. Don't get me wrong, I love Captain Iggy but I feel he gets more credit than he deserves. People (myself included) say Iginla makes everyone around him a better player and he does. However, it was pretty ridiculous once Cammy left town and fans were saying how he was a product of Iginla. Cammy still scored at 39 goal pace in Montreal, and was their best skater in the playoffs. The only thing Cammalleri suffered on was assists.

For Mario, it's the who Jagr debate. "Jagr racked up so much points because of Mario!" which I just don't believe. Jagr won FIVE Art Ross Trophies. Of those 5, only ONE was with Lemieux on the roster. Jagr gets underrated a lot because of this (as evidenced by all of the ridiculous Forsberg and Lindros comparison threads). Jagr on his own was the best player in the League without Lemieux there.

The best example ever of someone who doesn't get enough credit is Adam Oates. I don't even need to explain why because I'm sure you all know.

But, I want to know who are other players who received too much credit and who didn't get enough?
I think on the HOH board you won't find a person belittling Jagr's accomplishments. If it happens he strongly gets corrected. Jagr proved once Mario and to a lesser degree, Francis left that he did not need superstars to perform. His best NHL season is probably 1999 along with 1996. In 1999 he had Straka playing with him. Take a gander at Straka's stats when he isn't a teammate of Jagr's.

Mario was just such a dominating prescence in his career that I don't think you can ever give him enough credit for what he did for players. Early in Jagr's career we assumed he was feeding off Lemieux which ended up not being true but as for some other players (Brown, Young) it was obvious who helped who.

Oates I agree with you on. The common denominator is too hard to ignore. He guided two wingers (Hull, Neely) on separate occasions to 50-in-50. A shame the man is still waiting to get into the HHOF. Gretzky, Lemieux and even Orr did help a teammate reach that accomplishment. Let's not forget that Esposito and Kurri weren't exactly bums out there either.

For a man who gets too much credit would be Claude Lemieux. Yes, some decent postseasons, but he was far too feast or famine for my liking. You never knew which Claude would show up. And he never elevated the play of his teammates that I ever saw

I know this has been beaten to death on another thread but Osgood is an example of a guy who is a classic case of being spoonfed the success he's had in his career and has actually fooled a legion of people into thinking he belongs in the HHOF

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