Thread: Bryan Trottier
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08-25-2010, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
I just don't get why there seems to be a double standard for Trottier. Again, I don't see how he can really move up the HOH list against that competition because he is already quite high.. although I think the case could be made. I am just trying to understand why he seems to get so little appreciation in general.
I believe Trottier gets "penalized" for the great TEAM he was part of. No doubt that Isles team was among the best teams ever and the fact they had three players (Trottier, Bossy, Potvin) that you can easily make the case were "the most important" to that team - each of their individual value is diminished in some way. It's unfortunate.

I'm guilty of penalizing Messier for his contributions to the dynasty Oilers as well. At the time, I felt Messier was hardly a critical factor on that team, especially before 1983. I saw a different Messier once he left that shadow and became his own leader and champion.

In Trottier's case, it's definitely a factor IMO.

Originally Posted by Stray Wasp View Post
To expand upon the point about the effect of Potvin's absence relative to the Islanders' growing pains in 79/80, here's a link from the SI Vault that addresses these matters. The article talks about the a "leadership void" in the team and points out that early in the season, the team enjoyed a better run without Potvin than with him.

I'm not seeking to diminish Potvin either, rather to emphasise that before the avalanche of Cups, he had his doubters too.
Hard to fathom's not unlike Yzerman's leadership that was questioned before Detroit got really good and started winning in the playoffs. The "choking" moniker seems like a distant memory or a joke at this stage but before the first cup, it was there.

Similar to how the young caps are seen now. Ovechkin questioned for his play in big games.

I find it funny how you have the polarized opinions on this board (as pulppe pointed out earlier) on Ovechkin, Semin and the Caps in general yet few are able to discuss objectively on the topic. I get attacked at suggesting Ovechkin/Semin have much to prove and I'm thrown back stat after stat of how they are awesome playoff players - ignoring the point altogether. frustrating, for sure.

There's a tangible and distinct different between Marcel Dionne, Gilbert Perreault, Dale Hawerchuk AND Bryan Trottier, Mark Messier, Joe Sakic and Steve Yzerman - team success and championship rings. The ability to elevate your play, your teammates, your team to playoff success goes far beyond pts/game /shift adjusted for eras, shots/game and linemate/injury whining. No small point.

Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Esposito actually was a very complete hockey player - and a prolific scorer.

Jagr was quite possibly one of the top ten offensive talents ever. My own opinion - and that's all it is - when it comes to certain (very, very rare) players is that they are so exceptional in a single aspect that it renders the rest of their game unimportant.

The best examples, of course, are #99 and #66. I think that is the case with Jagr. If your point is that Trottier's offense did not match up Jagr's, no disagreement there. But "weak"? Yikes.
I wouldn't rank Jagr that high. For me, it's 99 and 66 and nobody close.

That "best at one dimension" argument is perfectly valid. But let's be careful where we draw that line.

I could easily argue that Bossy was much better at scoring goals, relative to the best goal scorers in hockey history (especially in the post-season) MORE THAN Trottier was better as an all-around center or than Potvin was better than any great defenseman.

But that's not fair to Trottier and Potvin since their value as ALL-AROUND hockey players should not and cannot be ignored in terms of their value to the team.

Last edited by redbull: 08-25-2010 at 12:25 PM.
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