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03-13-2011, 09:10 PM
Norm MacDonald
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
1) On this site you will find me noting that Meszaros is terribly overpaid for what he's doing on this team. He is.

2) In this discussion, you will find me specifically citing Meszaros' special teams minutes as something that distinguishes him from Carle and Coburn if we're talking about dealing someone.

3) At no point have I EVER based this discussion on Meszaros' third pairing minutes. So, you're either creating paper tigers, or struggle at critical reading.
Yes you are. You said that Meszaros is a lot better than Carle defensively and a lot better than Coburn offensively. Also, when citing Meszaros's 2nd unit special teams as the reason why he's more valuable, you're that he is equal to or better than Carle or Coburn even strength.

His strong resurgence? Coburn's numbers have been regressing for consecutive years now. He's still unpredictable defensively (sometime he asserts himself, sometimes he does not), and his offensive game has become a void...
Yes. I'm talking about the end of last year when Krajicek was paired with Timonen and Coburn was put on the third pairing. He he turned his game around there and played really well, whether you choose to remember or not.
And no, he's been great defensively this season, and he has been "asserting himself" consistently.

He's *ing terrible offensively. He completely lacks any offensive creativity, and his only "good" offensive skill is the one-timer he developed a few years back... but now he never hits the damn net, so that's pretty much a waste of time.
That's annoyingly oversimplified. Read what I wrote. It's not his role to add "offensive creativity."

Coburn is pacing to 17 pts on one of the best offensive teams in the league... that's pretty bad. He had 19 pts last year... 28 the year before that... and 36 the year before that. His offensive game has disappeared.

Meszaros was overpaid in TB, but he didn't suck there... all you're proving here is that you're ignorant. All of his peripheral numbers were solid down there, he just wasn't producing offensively like they hoped.
No, he was bad. Maybe you didn't watch him play enough.

Then why aren't the folks he's on the ice with displaying similar numbers? It isn't a stupid argument just because you're incapable of understanding the point.
Because his partner was injured for a good portion of the season and his partner is a very good hockey player.

He hasn't. The team has been OBSCENELY good offensively with Carle on the ice this year (sadly behindthenet is still down, or I'd put the empirical data in front of you). If you want to make an argument for Carle THAT is what you hang your hat on, the Flyers score A LOT of goals with him on the ice... they also get scored on a lot.
He's hasn't been nearly as bad defensively as people make him out to be, and much of the reason why the team scores so much when he's on the ice is due to how much he helps their puck control.
Versteeg is acclimating... he's also a versatile wing that can play Richards' game with him.
I want to vomit.
However, it's fine to suggest he might be moved... doesn't change the original point, which is that both Carle and Coburn are on the list of expendable players on this roster.
Your original point was that they are "by far" the most likely to be moved. And no matter how you want spin it, anyone playing 20+ minutes a night is not "expendable", especially when there's nobody in the wings to replace them. Removing any of those 5 D will make the team significantly worse. That includes Meszaros.

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