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05-27-2011, 09:26 PM
seventieslord's Avatar
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Originally Posted by Dreakmur View Post
Not necessarily. It depends who the other defensemen are.
Of course it does. What you're saying is, "if the other defensemen on your team are crap, then who cares if you're the best of them?"

I agree. But such a question can be asked of the #1 defenseman on a crap team... not a 100 point team, and not a cup winner! The support defensemen on a 100-point or cup-winning team are not crap - if they are, they would be highly unlikely to win.

Originally Posted by Boy Wonder View Post
Again.. being the number one on a cup winner doesn't mean much to me, without context. For example, say Tampa wins the cup.. are you REALLY going to say Eric ****ing Brewer, who has 7 points in 17 games (respectable, I'll admit), should garner all-time praise for this cup run?
First, about Brewer, when you lead your team in ice time by three minutes, you are doing something right. In the playoffs, more than ever, coaches dole out icetime on merit, and change strategy on the fly. I'm confident saying there is no defenseman Boucher trusts on the ice more than Brewer right now.

Second, I LOL at your quick assessment of his play based on points. Same old jarek.

Last, I am really confused about your "context". If someone told me, "so and so is good, he was a #1 defenseman for this team." The first thing I would want to know is, "ok, so? How good was this team that had him as a #1 defenseman? How many points? Did they make the playoffs? How far did they get?" This is the exact kind of stuff I pointed out re: the four bottom pairing defenseman - did you read this? Isn't it interesting that when Samuelsson was a #1 his team missed the playoffs, but when he was a #3/4 his teams did well? Isn't it interesting that Gusarov only missed the playoffs when he was a #2, but won the cup as a #3?

Originally Posted by Boy Wonder View Post
Tampa is playing a high tempo offensive system. Roloson has been given a lot of credit for their success so far. It's basically been St. Louis and Roloson. Brewer has also been fighting to keep an NHL job for several seasons now, so unless every single GM missed out on him somehow, I'd say that he hasn't really been all that special. So.. what "ifs" are you referring to?
I know you said you weren't watching hockey in round 1, but are you watching now? Roloson has been absolutely unreal... at times. Other times he has been very, very shaky, and it seems more and more that he's getting shaky at crucial moments. St. Louis is Tampa Bay's MVP.

Fighting to keep an NHL job for several seasons? Where are you getting this stuff? Brewer led the Blues in icetime by over two minutes in 2007 and 2008. (yeah, I realize they sucked, so not a big deal, but much closer to a legit #1 defenseman than "fighting to keep an NHL job") Brewer was injured for much of 2009, but when he played, he led the Blues in icetime by two minutes again. He was 2nd in icetime for them in 2010, and 1st this year before the trade (although the top-3 were very close)

Not even close to my favourite player (although I have been extremely impressed by his physical strength) but jeez, give the guy his due. I love how some of you like yo act like you know so much more than the coaches who put players on the ice to win hockey games.

Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Number one in ice time is misleading. (Even Zhitnik did that and that means squat in terms of assessing his overall ability, specifically in his own zone.)

Eric Brewer is the back 1 in the 1-3-1 coaching system. He deserves some credit for the Lightning's playoff run AFTER the star forwards, AFTER the secondary scorers, AFTER the goaltending, AFTER the coaching, AFTER the powerplay, and then, then he does, in the context of the role he is assigned and the style they play.

Is the 10+ NHL season veteran going to make his MLD debut after 22 games post trade and one playoff run within which he played a widget role in an innovative coaching style because he led the team in ice time? Gawd, hopefully not.
Yes, VI, we know you have a least-favourite type of player, and that is any defenseman that you are old enough to have watched, who wasn't perfect defensively. Which makes it even more curious that you selected Sandis Ozolinsh a few drafts ago and defended his defensive play.

I'll defer to Guy Boucher in this case. He might be in the Stanley Cup Finals within the hour, so I think he's doing something right by giving Brewer these extra three minutes than splitting them up among a few other decent defenseman. You mentioned players like Jon Klemm and Frank Musil in the last round of drafting - do they help a team win more than Brewer?


We should really take the Brewer stuff to the chat thread at this point.

Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe
Anyway, it would be useful to know hoe much Watson led his team in ice time by.
I don't have my files with me, but I know it wasn't that much. Not like three minutes or anything.

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