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06-21-2011, 11:32 AM
  #140
Lafleurs Guy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
I think you overestimate the amount of exposure Montreal gets in English-language media outside of Montreal. It's more than most of the southern teams, but only because most of those teams are terrible. TSN talks about Montreal only because they kind of have to. The US media don't treat them as any more relevant than those non-playoff southern clubs.
No matter how you slice it, the Habs are followed by more people than arguably any other team in the league. There's a huge advantage to being here. Nobody pays attention to Nashville, including most of the folks who actually live there.

This shouldn't even be up for debate man...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Theo took a weak Montreal club to the playoffs with a .931 save percentage; 50 goals from Iggy or not, the Flames missed the playoffs and it wasn't close. Stupid as it is, team success matters in the voters' minds; if the Flames had made the playoffs, Iggy would've won.

Yet another reason why awards voting is terrible. It gets you a lot of press and it gets you in the HoF but it's a lousy way to determine who's better.
Actually, Iggy would've won but a Quebec sportswriter left Iggy completely off the ballot so that Theo could win. That's why Iggy lost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Markov has always been better than Kaberle, but the two were comparable: quiet, non-physical types who'd never have gotten the credit they deserve because of their playstyle and a weird notion that being a good offensive defenseman necessarily means you are weaker at defense.
I think he's better than Kaberle too, but he's a lot closer to Kaberle than he is to the elite blueliners in the league. They are, or at least were, similar players.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Well, you also have to factor in that the average goalie facing the Habs was significantly better than Price. That's much less likely to happen again than Price suddenly becoming league-average.
I think Price is a star. I think he's going to lead us to great things one day. And I think that we'd have been better off not chasing the quick fixes that we did two years ago because we'd be in a better position to win in the future.

Price may stay the same but again... you keep thinking everything is going to be better. I don't. There will be injuries, there will be slumps, we may drop off a cliff in the 2nd half... good teams overcome this stuff to post 100 point seasons. We haven't.

We'll see.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
Well, then the Habs are set right? If Price is going to be their best player a la Tim Thomas, they could win a Cup like the Bruins just did.
I think he's good enough to lead us to a cup someday, yes. But we need to support him.

I truly believe that Price will be good enough to win a cup and I've believed this for a long time. I believe he is going to be the best netminder in the league at some point and I think that we should give him the best support that we can. Subban has been as good (probably a whole lot better) as we could have hoped for and there's two guys with superstar potential we can build around. With his emergence, I am optimistic for the future for sure. I believe they are strong enough to build a legitimate contender around. However, I don't believe that we've done a good job of this and I don't believe that we're going to be contending as soon as next year.

I think we took shortcuts at the expense of long term success and it bothers me that we've got a bunch of smurfs up front now and we're waiting on Gomez to play out his contract... it was counter productive to what we should've done a few years back and it's unfortunate that we didn't take more of a long term view instead of trying to build via overpriced small free agents. I'm going to be sick if McD turns out to be anywhere near the blueliner he was forecasted to be.

Even though I thought we shoud've gotten a better return than Eller for Halak, at least it was a younger prospect coming back. And the way our scouting seems to be hitting homeruns with later picks it leads me to believe that they know what we're doing from that standpoint and we should have been making more of those kinds of moves. Gorges and Maxpac came to us this way, Eller came to us this way... I'd like to have seen more of those kinds of moves instead of the quick fixes that we saw two years ago. Maxpac looks good (not elite but good) Eller we'll have to wait and see on but that's about it for the forwards. I'd feel a lot better about our future if we had somebody up there that we could build around and if that prospect had at least some size.

As for this year, we'll be okay. We'll make the postseason and maybe we'll be better than hoped. But I'm expecting us to finish in the middle to bottom of the pack again. And that's against poor competition. I don't see us as contenders right now, there are too many holes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
I'm not putting any question about the strength of any Habs player to the general HFBoards population. Too much enmity against the Habs; you'll never see them get the credit they deserve.
That's a cop out. I'm not even talking about the general thread... I'm talking about the history thread. Folks over there will give you an honest answer. They're all about numbers over there and I'm sure they'd listen to your Sabremetric stats to back it up.

I think you're just worried that you'll be laughed off the board if you ask the question. If he's that good, you should be able to make a convincing argument to them though, so go try it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
No. It's been blamed over the years because it's the easy explanation. Sometimes to the breaking point (see the Philly series in 2008). It's never actually been the real problem.
I don't agree with you. I don't think many folks outside the Hab forum would agree with you either. Let's just leave this one alone dude.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
But you already recognized Markov's offensive abilities. The issue is you're saying he's not that great defensively, which is ridiculous.
I don't really understand how you could say he was weak defensively after having seen him play all these years.
Weak? No. Great defensively? Also no. Unlike the truly elite, he has limitations to his game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
But what exactly won't be better? You already said we should be getting good goaltending again. You said our blueline should improve, but have your doubts about our offense, although you did mention Gomez should go back to 55pt mark. So, envisioning an improvement up front is rather easy to do, but you refuse to believe so. You don't have much of an argument to counter it however, you base your notion on ''some things go good, others bad''. Considering you think defense/Goaltending will improve, you have to stick with the offense being bad.
But even if it is. It can't possibly be worse than last year, and if our D+G improve altogether, then why is it hard to believe they couldn't reach 100pts?
I don't think a 100 point season is impossible at all. I just don't expect it to happen.

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