Phillies' Baseball (MLB): National Leeague Eastern Division Champs
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08-11-2011, 08:52 PM
Join Date: Apr 2009
Originally Posted by
Nothing. I probably shouldn't have phrased it that way.
What I meant is, in a context neutral environment, Victorino would contribute much more offense to his team than Howard, because Victorino been much better at the plate. That's the crux of the RBI debate; players should not be penalized or rewarded for things that are out of their control.
A batter's job is to hit. That's it. He can't control whether there are runners on base when he comes to bat, nor can he control whether or not his teammates drive him in when he reaches base. To say that Howard has been a more productive hitter than Victorino might be true, but that's only because he has far more opportunities to be productive. An entire lineup of hitters with a .932 OPS (Victorino) would score many more runs than an entire lineup of hitters with an .829 OPS (Howard).
Then it would only make sense that when Shane batted down in he lineup he was batting in more runs... And it would only make sense that sluggers with better batting averages would have higher RBI stats from the same fourth slot. The only thing is that is not always the case, and I really don't think you can place the reason for that with not having better averaged batters ahead of them.
Sabre-stats my prove otherwise but over the ages it has appeared to people who have watched the games that some players are just more apt to hit in runs than others are... Howards numbers with players on and players in scoring position that was posted here earlier tells me that Ryan is just one of those players... and I believe the same stats for Shane showed he was not better in those situations.
There is a reason Charlie puts Howard's name in the cleanup slot and not Victorino's... even when Ryan was out of the lineup. Charlie is old-school but he make the right decisions more often than not... RBIs my be worthless stats but in my mind some players are more apt to provide them than others... and some are better at getting on base and moving up the bases. It has to be more than merely opportunities, it has to also be converting the opportunities when in that position.
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