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08-21-2011, 12:21 PM
  #119
Rutabaga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Yes you need depth and elite players. It's not one or the other. Right now we don't have enough of either.
Yes, you need both, but i believe that depth is more important than truely having a game-breaking forward, like some may feel.
Pacioretty and Eller, for instance, that could be a very interesting duo. Could be, but just like any other player at this age.

Anyway, we potentially have the players to have that depth, and we potentially have this elite talent. Right now, yes, we dont have that, but we are not at this stage, and the potential is there.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Not sure where you're coming from here. Kopitar and Crosby were taken from the same draft as Price.

Toews, Kane and Doughty are all YOUNGER than Price is. Doughty is actually younger than Subban believe it or not.

Malkin was drafted one year before Price and the 'old man' of the group is Mike Richards who certainly qualifies as being part of the same generation of players... The fact that these guys have 'lots of games behind them' as well as some cups to go along with it should show you what we're up against for the future. Those players are actually going to get better.
I know, but they're not playing at the same position.
We know that a goalie takes much more time to develop, we know that a defenseman hit his prime much later than a forward.

Doughty is the only player i can safely bet about being better than Subban, at this stage of his career. And Price is the best goaltender you could find under 25.

Very good forwards are much easier to find that a very good D or a very good goaltender.

If you have a Top-3 Goalie in the league and a Top-5 or Top-10 D, you're not that far from being a contender.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
You can win a cup with good but not great goaltending.
You can win a cup with good but not great defense.
You can win a cup with good but not great offense.

It's all been done before, but the clubs with the greatest chance at winning are great in all these areas. That's what we should aspire to do. If you have this, your odds go up considerably right? So why not try to build your team that way?
I doubt that they were great in all of those areas. The defense of Pittsburgh was not that great, Chicago and Detroit did not have a great goaltender, Boston did not have a game-breaking forward...

If its possible, dont you think it make sense for the management to chose this way instead of a risky manoeuver by starting a brand new team ?
Thats all i meant, today, its so close, that you dont have to be dominant to win the Cup, and the thing is that you basically cant be dominant.

We seem to chose a way, with a strong defensive unit, its an acceptable choice and i absolutely dont know if its the best one, but i find it interesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
So if you don't see us winning a cup in the next three years, why are we wasting our time signing guys like Eric Cole? What is the purpose of this? How does this help us to win a cup?
If im not seeing us winning the cup, its mostly because of Gomez.
Honestly, if you switch the Gomez we have with a consistent player like he was with the Devils, i dont see why its impossible to win it.

Signing Cole "simply" improve the team, currently good enough to challenge for the division, which is not that far at all from contending, to push the young players, to give them the confidence about the future, to show that we believe that this group can still improve etc...
And it was the best option we had.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
This kind of thinking just doesn't make any sense to me at all. If we aren't dominant, we can't realistically EXPECT to compete for a cup. We have to rely on luck to get us in and that leaves things entirely up to chance.

Why not take a different mentality and try to build the best team we can and THEN hope for the best? Doesn't that make more sense to you than getting Gomez or Eric Cole?
You see us at 5th. Thats a reasonable goal, i think we're going to finish at 5th too. League-wise, that should be good for 10-11th. Thats a progress, and we're not that far from the top, still with room for improvement.

Now, there is more reason to believe that we can do better than reasons to believe that we can do worse.

We only have 2 teams, and for one of them, its debatable that are clearly better than us in the conference.

When you're that close with around 10-11M$ of lost money on the cap, it means that in the future, you can win.

Today, i said it, but you cannot be dominant. Every team has weaknesses.
And there is a compromise between relying on luck and being dominant. You can be a good team with a lucky bounce going your way. Boston did have a better team, but needed 3 OT wins against us.
Vancouver did need a Game 7 against Chicago...

When it so hard to build a Cup-winning team, its quite easy to understand the choices that some GM made.
A rebuild can bring you higher, but only "can", and its not more likely at all, the risks are just too big for the franchise.

You would start a new team instead of trying to fix it progressively, but giving up on at least 3 or 4 years in order to potentially have a better shot, in such a competitive environment, its a risky move. The franchises dont like risks.

When they decide to do it, its always because they dont have any other option and their future is really dark anyway. Which often means that there is some problems in the organization, by the way, otherwise you wouldnt be in that situation.

I am too lazy to check, but i dont think that any rebuilds has been done on a team, recently, just 3-4 points shy of the PO with a decent future. Just a decent future.

Now, were we in that situation...hard to say. We were 8th, but we did not have enough assets. Minus Markov and Plekanec, honestly, it was not really exciting.

Maybe we could have done it, but now its too late, and i understand the decision to not doing it.

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